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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    Also, Diablo II was not brutal and not unfair. I've got over 2 accounts of HC characters beyond lvl 94, expired now though, and all of them cleared Diablo II entirely, even solo. And as far as I know they never removed Iron Maiden (?)
    Which classes was it? My brother used to play a sorc and neco, he didnt have any problems in hardcore. They didnt remove Iron Maiden from players, just mobs.
    I remember running with my friend in one of those portals in ACT 5 in hell, mobs werent even in the screen, yet they managed to put Iron Maiden on us killing us both (thats before they removed it).
    Examples->Something like brutal would mean mobs/bosses doing high ammount of dmg compared to your hp leaving you dead in 1 or 2 hits (Death lords *Mintours with dual Oo for example*), something unfair would be completely neglecting your build by having an immune against it.

  2. #22
    will believe it when i see it, its to rare to see brutal content in games these days..

  3. #23
    AMAZING! = D game may last abit longer for those of us just interested in beating inferno and not farming shit.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by VXFadhel View Post
    Which classes was it? My brother used to play a sorc and neco, he didnt have any problems in hardcore. They didnt remove Iron Maiden from players, just mobs.
    I remember running with my friend in one of those portals in ACT 5 in hell, mobs werent even in the screen, yet they managed to put Iron Maiden on us killing us both (thats before they removed it).
    Examples->Something like brutal would mean mobs/bosses doing high ammount of dmg compared to your hp leaving you dead in 1 or 2 hits (Death lords *Mintours with dual Oo for example*), something unfair would be completely neglecting your build by having an immune against it.
    I have two of each class, besides Paladin and Druid, which I don't like all that much. Iron maiden was only removed in Chaos Sanctuary and as far as I can see, not from all mobs in the game.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    I have two of each class, besides Paladin and Druid, which I don't like all that much. Iron maiden was only removed in Chaos Sanctuary and as far as I can see, not from all mobs in the game.
    Perhaps, its been a long time since I last played, so my memory is abit fuzzy. But just to be clear, I dont mind brutality and fairness (to some extend of course). Most games have them, but I was asking "what do they mean by hard?" since some mentioned "hard". I am not here to teach people the difference between the three. But if you think that Diablo 2 was hard somehow, please elaborate if you got time. Would be much appreciated.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Noirlama View Post
    Also it's awesome that inferno is actually getting harder the further you progress, instead of the same difficulty through whole inferno!

    BTW: Little bit offtopic but I'm wondering if it was possible to bet the ancients on hell difficulty solo? I tried it many times but failed so hard as sorc.. (maybe am a noob)
    They were difficult to solo but more than doable on every class. After the last few patches they are way easy even on Hell.

  7. #27
    For some reason, I cant edit my post atm.
    Wanted to add *But if you think that Diablo 2 or is Diablo 3 is hard somehow....*

  8. #28
    I just hope there isn't threads of world first Inferno completions and stuff. Diablo did have a ladder but really, who even cared? Most people played because the game was awesomely fun to play by yourself or with friends. I'd just hate to see the game become so much like WoW and be a constant competition. I'll beat Infernoi eventually. I don't care how long it takes.
    "It's clear this is another bash Apple thread. Such things are not conducive to a good discussion."

    WRONG! Those are the BEST discussions!

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    Actually, no, since difficulty is a variable term. Due to the fact that all mob hp, damage output, etc was linear, but the player still gained levels from ActI to ActIV, the difficulty actually went down. Note that they specifically mention that it's the MOB LVL that was previously linear, not the difficulty. They decided to pump this up to a level where the difficulty kept rising in comparison to the characters power per level, by increasing the mob lvls. So instead of going down, it's actually going up now. Which is great.

    Edit:
    Also, Diablo II was not brutal and not unfair. I've got over 2 accounts of HC characters beyond lvl 94, expired now though, and all of them cleared Diablo II entirely, even solo. And as far as I know they never removed Iron Maiden (?)
    Iron Maiden was removed in one of the newer patches (just like Multishot Lightning Enchanted - too bad that). Just like they added randomized monsters in Act V. The Shenk area can be a real pain nowadays on Hell because you can get the bad luck of running into all ranged attackers. In fact compared to original D2:LOD Hell act V is a lot harder, while Chaos Sanctuary is a lot easier.

    EDIT: Another chance in recent patch is the mega enormous Durance of Hate so you can't really farm Mephie fast anymore, as it is really mega humongous huge now.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by VXFadhel View Post
    Perhaps, its been a long time since I last played, so my memory is abit fuzzy. But just to be clear, I dont mind brutality and fairness (to some extend of course). Most games have them, but I was asking "what do they mean by hard?" since some mentioned "hard". I am not here to teach people the difference between the three. But if you think that Diablo 2 was hard somehow, please elaborate if you got time. Would be much appreciated.
    To me it was only hard in the sense that being surprised by a bad set of spawns, or bad combinations and aura's, could kill you in (a) mere second(s). Danger was around each corner, even though it never actually was around each and every corner. The sense of a possible threat was greater than most of the actual threats, until you suddenly barged into a room where the threat was greater than you expected.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by VXFadhel View Post
    For some reason, I cant edit my post atm.
    Wanted to add *But if you think that Diablo 2 or is Diablo 3 is hard somehow....*
    Diablo II wasn't so much hard as that it has huge difficulty level swings. Mostly due to massive damage spikes like Black Souls (Gloam) in Hell, which led to a very weird play experience where you could zerg through hell but get owned in a few seconds by a Black Souls (Gloam) boss pack (to give an example).

  12. #32
    Sense of danger was great. But keep in mind that some situations are not hard but they are brutal and unfair. You over-come unfair and brutal advantage. As I said, I am not here to teach people the difference between the three (thank you for explaining btw really appreciated). Nevertheless, some says "they over-come hard situations", so we can agree that "hard" is relative to the person.

    @Cairhiin
    Woah Oo hehe it was pain before also (I am guessing much greater pain now though).

    Edit: Ye, brutality and unfairness is fun to some extend. It adds challenge and so. I am not saying its bad thing (keep that in mind).

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by VXFadhel View Post
    @Cairhiin
    Woah Oo hehe it was pain before also (I am guessing much greater pain now though).
    Oh yes. Since I always play purist, and new ladder seasons, I never trade. Act V with Skeletal Archers (burning arrows) and those Sabercats (lightning javelins) can really kill you fast. That's why I always build my chars for max block.

    I agree with you though, Diablo II had a lot of unfair moments. Coming down the stairs and being mobbed up on while loading is one such scenario. Some boss/modifier combos also stacked the odds against you like Black Souls with the lower resist aura for instance. Deathlords with fanaticism and extra strong and extra fast are mental as well. The thing is in later patches for D2:LOD they also greatly increased the movement speed of mobs and mobs like the Deathlords are entirely immune to slowing effects in Hell. So even your Freezing Aura merc is off no help in such cases.

    I really hope in Diablo III the difficulty level is more even, and that those really ridiculous spikes have been smoothed out. I know plenty of hardcore players who like to talk tough but when push come to shove they insta-exited game while in danger of dying, which won't be possible in D3 anymore.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Cairhiin View Post
    Oh yes. Since I always play purist, and new ladder seasons, I never trade. Act V with Skeletal Archers (burning arrows) and those Sabercats (lightning javelins) can really kill you fast. That's why I always build my chars for max block.

    I agree with you though, Diablo II had a lot of unfair moments. Coming down the stairs and being mobbed up on while loading is one such scenario. Some boss/modifier combos also stacked the odds against you like Black Souls with the lower resist aura for instance. Deathlords with fanaticism and extra strong and extra fast are mental as well. The thing is in later patches for D2:LOD they also greatly increased the movement speed of mobs and mobs like the Deathlords are entirely immune to slowing effects in Hell. So even your Freezing Aura merc is off no help in such cases.

    I really hope in Diablo III the difficulty level is more even, and that those really ridiculous spikes have been smoothed out. I know plenty of hardcore players who like to talk tough but when push come to shove they insta-exited game while in danger of dying, which won't be possible in D3 anymore.
    I talk tough, but I also quit the game when I got smacked in the face by a SSP-FANA death lord in Act V, on my Sorx. Most of my sorxes survived the worst. I could literally stand in Soul lightning with lower resist, but death lords make quick work of you even with max block. But than again, I only used to do that on characters that somehow got "caught" during a teleport action, because it put me at a severe disadvantage. (I also didn't trade).

    All my other chars rarely had to flee a game, because I was the one that picked the pace and the location.

    Edit: Also, I do not recall a single moment in 6 years time where I encountered mob spawns directly below a map transition. Excluding the cowlevel.
    Last edited by Vespian; 2012-04-03 at 11:02 AM.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Cairhiin View Post
    Oh yes. Since I always play purist, and new ladder seasons, I never trade. Act V with Skeletal Archers (burning arrows) and those Sabercats (lightning javelins) can really kill you fast. That's why I always build my chars for max block.

    I agree with you though, Diablo II had a lot of unfair moments. Coming down the stairs and being mobbed up on while loading is one such scenario. Some boss/modifier combos also stacked the odds against you like Black Souls with the lower resist aura for instance. Deathlords with fanaticism and extra strong and extra fast are mental as well. The thing is in later patches for D2:LOD they also greatly increased the movement speed of mobs and mobs like the Deathlords are entirely immune to slowing effects in Hell. So even your Freezing Aura merc is off no help in such cases.

    I really hope in Diablo III the difficulty level is more even, and that those really ridiculous spikes have been smoothed out. I know plenty of hardcore players who like to talk tough but when push come to shove they insta-exited game while in danger of dying, which won't be possible in D3 anymore.
    Yeah agreed. Defense and block was amazing OO but damn how fast you die outside hehe^.^
    We will see how Diablo III turns out. Hoping for the better.

  16. #36
    My sorx usually looked approximately like this:

    Boots: War Traveler
    Belt: Thundergod's Vigor
    Shield: Stormshield
    Rings: SoJ, Bul Kathos, Wisp (variable)
    Amulets: Mara's Kaleidoscope
    Headgear: Harlequin Crest
    Chest: Skullder's Ire
    Orb: The Oculus

    The inventory was then dedicated to as much as possible max resistance, until all resistance ended up around 70+ with lower resistance aura on me. Souls couldn't hurt me due to the damage reduction (part physical) and the lightning immunity/absorb.

    I also had a few runewords on my W key (swap weapon set), to give me a little bit of BO/BS.

    Edit: My fav was Blizzard sorx.
    Last edited by Vespian; 2012-04-03 at 12:04 PM.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    I talk tough, but I also quit the game when I got smacked in the face by a SSP-FANA death lord in Act V, on my Sorx. Most of my sorxes survived the worst. I could literally stand in Soul lightning with lower resist, but death lords make quick work of you even with max block. But than again, I only used to do that on characters that somehow got "caught" during a teleport action, because it put me at a severe disadvantage. (I also didn't trade).

    All my other chars rarely had to flee a game, because I was the one that picked the pace and the location.

    Edit: Also, I do not recall a single moment in 6 years time where I encountered mob spawns directly below a map transition. Excluding the cowlevel.
    Uh there was plenty. Most of the temples in Act III where you need to enter to do the book quest for instance. Half of them have mobs right down at the stairs. Last level of Worldstone Keep it happens often enough as well (especially if there's Succubi, Deathlords or Dolls). Though it was infinitely worse in Diablo I.
    Last edited by Cairhiin; 2012-04-03 at 11:46 AM.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Cairhiin View Post
    Uh there was plenty. Most of the temples in Act III where you need to enter to do the book quest for instance. Half of them have mobs right down at the stairs. Last level of Worldstone Keep it happens often enough as well (especially if there's Succubi, Deathlords or Dolls). Though it was infinitely worse in Diablo I.
    Can't say I can relate. I've done more Baalruns than I had levels among all of my characters and I can't recall getting death trapped even a single time. But than again, last patch was either 1.11 or 1.12, that I played. Perhaps something changed.

  19. #39
    I won't believe this shit untill i see it.

  20. #40
    level 96 sorc atm on USWEST SC can pretty much do most of the game in hell solo, exception is Izual if glooms are there, fant mob packs near the council act 3, fant death lords is instant esc out conviction witches in act 5 before baal.
    I do 15k fireball casts im FCR capped so its like a machine gun and my hireling has Infinity runeword polearm for the conviction aura.
    Last edited by Mechanic; 2012-04-03 at 12:00 PM.

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