Thread: Smite or not?

Page 1 of 2
1
2
LastLast
  1. #1

    Smite or not?

    Currently I am running a 31 / 8 / 2 spec that has inspiration and 2/3 darkness, and no Archangel.
    I was told by some guildies that I should go atonement / smite spec.

    Is this even worth it? I can see if I healed the melee on zonozz or healed ultrax that this could be usefull but I dont really see it being much better.

    Anyone have opinions / experience with this?

  2. #2
    are you doing heroics? otherwise something is seriously wrong if they want a healer to dps
    Isnt 10% of infinite still infinite?

  3. #3
    Herald of the Titans Darkfriend's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    2,992
    Its more that you don't need that extra healing in a lot of heroics even. Smiting tendons on progression spine is nice, as well as on fights like ultraxion or w/e. On my priest alt I take smite. Its situationally useful.

  4. #4
    Atonement Spec is always a raid dps increase no matter what, if you're progressing it may be vital to use this if you're having trouble with the dps not being enough. If not I prefer Atonement Spec myself, due to Archangel but also since it's a smart heal. 1,5s cast time with a heal off average 22k per hit is really good and cheap.

    It comes down to a matter of how you can handle it. If you're able to make use of Archangel and be predictable of the encounter, Atonement is the way to go.

    Heroic Progression = Atonement Spec - No matter what the circumstances, you should be using this unless you're assigned to tank heal ( which would be a waste ). Due to the extra dps even if it may be a little, on heroic content it makes significant difference between a kill and not a kill. Also, the Archangel synchronize really well on certain fights. Morchok Stomps, zon'ozz black phase, yor'saj (yellow,red,black phase ) and so on.


    With proper use, it'll give a better result since having a PW:s and then cast a Heal/Gh/Fh which equals 2/2/1,5 second cast time ( average )in order to reduce the CD of Weakened Soul, I just don't see why it would be worth it unless you're tank healing.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by martiz View Post
    Atonement Spec is always a raid dps increase no matter what, if you're progressing it may be vital to use this if you're having trouble with the dps not being enough. If not I prefer Atonement Spec myself, due to Archangel but also since it's a smart heal. 1,5s cast time with a heal off average 22k per hit is really good and cheap.

    It comes down to a matter of how you can handle it. If you're able to make use of Archangel and be predictable of the encounter, Atonement is the way to go.

    Heroic Progression = Atonement Spec - No matter what the circumstances, you should be using this unless you're assigned to tank heal ( which would be a waste ). Due to the extra dps even if it may be a little, on heroic content it makes significant difference between a kill and not a kill. Also, the Archangel synchronize really well on certain fights. Morchok Stomps, zon'ozz black phase, yor'saj (yellow,red,black phase ) and so on.


    With proper use, it'll give a better result since having a PW:s and then cast a Heal/Gh/Fh which equals 2/2/1,5 second cast time ( average )in order to reduce the CD of Weakened Soul, I just don't see why it would be worth it unless you're tank healing.
    Basically this with a twist. In a large sense, you don't take atonement for the dps (although it is helpful in heroic progression) you take it for the small but not insignificant mana return and the nice healing boost for spike phases. It is very simple to keep your stacks up and snag a +15% healing on fights like Zonozz where there is predictable burst damage. In the long run, both the mana return and the strong healing cooldown are much more valuable than SoS.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by RumpleFugly View Post
    Basically this with a twist. In a large sense, you don't take atonement for the dps (although it is helpful in heroic progression) you take it for the small but not insignificant mana return and the nice healing boost for spike phases. It is very simple to keep your stacks up and snag a +15% healing on fights like Zonozz where there is predictable burst damage. In the long run, both the mana return and the strong healing cooldown are much more valuable than SoS.
    This. AA isn't about DPS at all outside of maybe Ultraxion heroic. The DPS is a bonus but that isn't the reason for taking the spec, or if it is you're doing something terribly wrong.

    OP you lose SoS/ToT. You say AA isn't useful. You tell me in current content where SoS/ToT is useful. Tank healers aren't required, we rarely ever even cast GHeal any more. Why even take these talents? They're mostly useless. Dragon Soul is all about PoH & raid healing, AA benefits this spell far more.
    Last edited by Halaberiel; 2012-04-21 at 04:32 PM.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by RumpleFugly View Post
    Basically this with a twist. In a large sense, you don't take atonement for the dps (although it is helpful in heroic progression) you take it for the small but not insignificant mana return and the nice healing boost for spike phases. It is very simple to keep your stacks up and snag a +15% healing on fights like Zonozz where there is predictable burst damage. In the long run, both the mana return and the strong healing cooldown are much more valuable than SoS.

    Ok another question to ask, once i get my bonus healing from popping AA, should I use Power Infusion on myself and start spamming prayer of healing instead of smiting?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Corayo View Post
    Ok another question to ask, once i get my bonus healing from popping AA, should I use Power Infusion on myself and start spamming prayer of healing instead of smiting?
    Very rarely, if ever, should you be PIing yourself instead of a DPS.

    But what was said is overall correct; AA is invaluable. On demand throughput on such a low CD is a boon in nearly every fight.

    If you're just getting into AA, and whatnot the best thing you can do is know the fight and is damage patterns. Here's a blogpost I did back in early DS about it. http://talesofapriest.com/2011/12/19...archangel-4-3/

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Halaberiel View Post
    OP you lose SoS/ToT. You say AA isn't useful. You tell me in current content where SoS/ToT is useful. Tank healers aren't required, we rarely ever even cast GHeal any more. Why even take these talents? They're mostly useless. Dragon Soul is all about PoH & raid healing, AA benefits this spell far more.
    Not saying it isn't usefull. Just saying that I don't have any experience with it. I usualy do PoH and bubble, then spot heal with greater heal. If it will improve my healing, I will certainly try it.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Corayo View Post
    Ok another question to ask, once i get my bonus healing from popping AA, should I use Power Infusion on myself and start spamming prayer of healing instead of smiting?
    If you lose HPS from smiting, then don't smite. You only use smite during periods of downtime. Perhaps this is a bad way of explaining this: If everyone is full HP either because your other healers are keeping them up, or there is simply not enough damage coming out, then smite away. For example, a lot of priests will just smite the entire time the corruption is up during MDW because the healing requirement is small & the other healers can cope on their own.

    That being said, it isn't generally what I do as I'm a bit of a HPS whore these days. I use AA purely to increase my HPS & throughput at points where it counts. A lot of DS fights are designed with bursts at certain points, so having extra cooldowns can be very very helpful.


    Quote Originally Posted by Corayo View Post
    Not saying it isn't usefull. Just saying that I don't have any experience with it. I usualy do PoH and bubble, then spot heal with greater heal. If it will improve my healing, I will certainly try it.
    Spot healing is kinda non existent in DS. You want to be casting PoH continuously to stack aegis even if not everyone is taking damage. The only fight with any real focus on spot healing is I would say Hagara, on any other you're better just PoH spamming since people are usually stacked enough for it to hit 4/5 people.
    Last edited by Halaberiel; 2012-04-21 at 05:28 PM.

  11. #11
    If you dont really use greater heal much, which spec would be best to get? This: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#bfGorR...hMZb:mVqdaqMz0 is what I currently have.

    Is http://www.wowhead.com/talent#bfGorR...hZhb:mVqdaqMz0 a viable option?

  12. #12
    Herald of the Titans Yilar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    2,960
    You smite whenever the other healer can solo heal for periods of time, when he can't you use pws/poh etc. nobody is gonna be able to tell you exactly what is the right answer for you, because it all really depends on the other healers abilities.

  13. #13
    Your points in the disc tree are correct although you could drop 1/3 mental agility (it's only 3% to instants, work out how much mana you gain from WoL, it's pretty damn terrible). You could put that one point into ToT or SoS or even focused will if you want. You could even drop more points from mental agility if you want, although personally I don't think the other points (ToT/SoS) are worth it on most fights (I find SoS useful only on MDW/Warmaster).

    Dropping inspiration is dangerous. Even with a Shaman in the raid he's not going to have ancestral healing on everyone, and people other than the tank do take physical damage. Especially on fights like Warmaster/Spine/Madness all have large physical raid damage components.

    Empowered healing is more or less strong, it depends how often you use direct heal spells. I don't know, I use binding heal a fair amount on some fights & Gheal is useful on Spine heroic. It's definitely a weak talent (as atonement), but then the other talents you can take instead of it are equally weak. Definitely don't drop it for renew LOL.

    Whether you get VE or not depends if it gives you an extra fiend or a fiend at a better time in the fight. I'd say personally only Zon'ozz/Warmaster/Spine are fights worth having VE on. If you don't get VE then get Darkness.

  14. #14
    This is the spec i am trying now since I havn't really been using greater heal as smite: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#bfGorR...hMZh:mVqdaqMz0


    Like it so far.

  15. #15

  16. #16
    Field Marshal Rfx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    94
    Why don't you try an smite/holy fire spec and see what you like/can play better.
    Both are strong. I play with a smite spec.
    > your guildies aren't you!

  17. #17
    I'm having a hard time believing people actually use A/AA specs for progression. Maybe for 25 man raiding in some cases, but in 10 man, I find it really unreliable and I still prefer to spam heal on tank in case of incoming damage and keep shielding in down times.

    I find the smite spec to only be viable when you overgear content and are bored. I might be wrong, but i always had a hard time finding the smart heal efficient at all.
    Macphisto, discipline priest | Karuzo, mistweaver monk

  18. #18
    Stood in the Fire
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    England
    Posts
    426
    Quote Originally Posted by Spotnick View Post
    I'm having a hard time believing people actually use A/AA specs for progression. Maybe for 25 man raiding in some cases, but in 10 man, I find it really unreliable and I still prefer to spam heal on tank in case of incoming damage and keep shielding in down times.

    I find the smite spec to only be viable when you overgear content and are bored. I might be wrong, but i always had a hard time finding the smart heal efficient at all.
    Exactly this. AA/A is a gimmick spec that is great on progress, when you need the additional raid DPS (was practically compulsory for Ultraxion in the first few weeks), but a more standard Discipline spec is far better for 99% of cases. The 15% boost to healing done is nice, sure, but a lot of fights don't give you a chance to squeeze in five Smites every 30 seconds. The best answer to a lot of situations in this tier tends to be "cast PoH for Aegis".

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Spotnick View Post
    I'm having a hard time believing people actually use A/AA specs for progression. Maybe for 25 man raiding in some cases, but in 10 man, I find it really unreliable and I still prefer to spam heal on tank in case of incoming damage and keep shielding in down times.

    I find the smite spec to only be viable when you overgear content and are bored. I might be wrong, but i always had a hard time finding the smart heal efficient at all.
    I used it during progression on spine & madness HC pre nerf then continued to use it afterwards. I'd tried the spec before spine but never really given it a chance till that point. This spec is more than viable on progress I can tell you right now, it's better than standard SoS on all fights except Warmaster imo.

    It's nothing to do with the heal. If you're doing things right you'll try to smite when there isn't even any damage going out. For me having that 15% boost is better than spamming PoH to stack aegis when people are full HP, which is basically what you're sacrificing. A few examples of times when you can smite...

    Morchok: transitions (lose no healing)
    Zon'ozz: start of fight & once the void spawns after black phase, damage is basically non existent. (losing healing from aegis stacking if you have mana)
    Yor'sahj: in between every phase (losing nothing, you have time to aegis stack & get evangelism)
    Hagara: after every transition (losing nothing, people are already full HP & no raid wide damage soon)
    Ultraxion: from start of fight till blue if your other healer is good (losing all your HPS here but it doesn't matter)
    Warmaster: very little points where you can use it, that's why I don't recommend for this fight
    Spine: there are constant breaks, you can keep AA on CD 100% of the time on this fight (losing healing constantly here, but I think the gains outweigh the losses personally, especially considering you're mostly losing debuff healing which isn't what you should be concentrating on as disc anyway).
    Madness: just after corruption dies there is no damage, while killing the wind tentacle there is basically no damage outside of cataclysm/blistering, straight after swopping platform there is no damage. This fight has loads of places where you can smite. (losing aegis stacking or nothing in some cases)

    So yea, it's more than viable. Try it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tihr View Post
    Exactly this. AA/A is a gimmick spec that is great on progress, when you need the additional raid DPS (was practically compulsory for Ultraxion in the first few weeks), but a more standard Discipline spec is far better for 99% of cases. The 15% boost to healing done is nice, sure, but a lot of fights don't give you a chance to squeeze in five Smites every 30 seconds. The best answer to a lot of situations in this tier tends to be "cast PoH for Aegis".
    Perhaps not every 30 seconds, but you don't need to use it that often to make it worth it. Do most people honestly use SoS continuously now? I barely ever have to do any tank healing. I just count the tank like another raid member these days.
    Last edited by Halaberiel; 2012-04-22 at 11:55 AM.

  20. #20
    I smite whenever i'm not using some other heal and try to use Holy Fire pretty much on cooldown regardless both to keep evangelism stacks up and because it's one of our most efficient heals both in Health per mana and per second.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •