Does Lightwell need to be removed or reworked

[Purpleisbetter]

"if" "if" "if"


Everything about this spell is conditional. And anecdotal.

Still waiting/hoping to see a decent log where LW did something noticeable (beside beeing sniped by the whole universe).

p.s.: Begging people to click on ur LW and call them bad raiders if they won't do? 100% ridicolous.

[hellgrimm]

"if" "if" "if"


Everything about this spell is conditional. And anecdotal.

Still waiting/hoping to see a decent log where LW did something noticeable (beside beeing sniped by the whole universe).

p.s.: Begging people to click on ur LW and call them bad raiders if they won't do? 100% ridicolous.

Let me gues, you don't ever use warlock's health stones.

People try to min/max everything in this game and are supposed not to care about lightwell? That's clearly laziness on their part

If anything, it would be nice to be able to relocate it.

[Purpleisbetter]

i do use the healthstone, and use a lot of shields when no disc priests are around when in need. And use lightwell whenever i see one and i'm sure it won't overheal That's not the point.

My point is that spell is just too weak in real world.

As said multiple of times, there are bosses like (to some degree) madness, warship and spine where its rather hard to click on it, with dps and tanks already busy enough with their own job.

Then there are fights where it should be perfectly viable, like Ultraxion, where if we're talking to high profile, why u are even healing it? Paladins would take that role and u would be benched/or going shadow. We've Morchok where theres not so much healing to do. And when u need quick refull u don't go for lolwell, but 2xbinding heals, poh and coh and quite refulled your party.Then we can talk about zon'ozz where it may be used, but when u need that the most, ur stacked and palas and yout own sanctuary are already making that "small" hot going in to the overheal graveyard. And that's if youre 2 healing that boss, because add another holy radiance/efflorescence/healing rain+hst and the thing can only go worse. When u're spread well, only a few guys in range and busy with their target switching...
Hagara? very little to heal. Lot of movements and guys going OoR from lolwell, i don't see it going anywhere. Yor can potentially offers more chances to use it, but there's almost no healing to do untill R-Y etc slime combo, where your friendly pala (we're talking about skilled raids with skilled players, so proper setups, right?) and yourself are blowing the hell out of ur healing CDs, under BL and tanks are aiding with their 4pcT13. So no. LOL. Won't give a help.

I just think about spine, where the group idle for quite time theres the healing absorb debuff and so on. But here where the LOLwell starts to shine: "if the adds don't cover it" "if the dps are not dealing with tendons and /or fiery grips, if...if...if...if...".

It's HOLY priest class we're talking about not "Maybe if we've some luck" Priest healing spec.

And its there where this spell starts to be the most hypotetical strongest cd ever made in a videogame. Beside beeing that way only on anecdotal experience where no logs are shown.

And last, but not least. FOR F* SAKE, I AM the healer, i DECIDE if a spell is going to heal, not my mates deciding to get heals from one of my spell. Is ridicolous.
I hate enough sanctuary et similia, why would i support something that takes this kind of weirdness in to the next level?


p.s.: I just WONDER , if Blizzard ever made a glyph that trnasforms the standard lolwell into a ToC one, even with a -50% healing output reduction. With the current numbers, how OP would be that paired with DH?. Smart healing, no impariment/burden to anyone. just pumping green numbers. It would be ridicolously OP, isn't it? Its quite obvious in fact.
In that case i would be so curious on how many of the haters wouldn't take advantage of it. I know the answer actually, its NONE.
Such a glyph would be mandatory and the feeling of roflstomping in holy palas faces is just too delicious. And i m also dead sure that everybody would praise Blizzard to gently skyrocketed our healing above the stars. LOL.

---------- Post added 2012-05-01 at 04:58 PM ----------

The way symbiosis work.

Adding a spell as an extra action button. Yeah, fairly good solution.

Hard to make it go along with the limited charges it offers, but yeah i like this.

Making it also some sort of dps buffing cd would exite me quite a bit. You would be begged to throw it down, it adds lines of satisfaction.

[Kelesti]

As said multiple of times, there are bosses like (to some degree) madness, warship and spine where its rather hard to click on it, with dps and tanks already busy enough with their own job.

I just think about spine, where the group idle for quite time theres the healing absorb debuff and so on. But here where the LOLwell starts to shine: "if the adds don't cover it" "if the dps are not dealing with tendons and /or fiery grips, if...if...if...if...".

The DPS can deal with tendons/grips and still click Lightwell. Huge range. Doesn't remove target or interrupt casting either. The only one that's the problem is phase 3 when there's just SO many adds. That's the issue at hand here.

In that case i would be so curious on how many of the haters wouldn't take advantage of it. I know the answer actually, its NONE.

Not really. For something that can outheal Divine Hymn by far, while still letting me cast at the same time, I'll take a raid that can use the supercharged Lightwell over a weaksauce alternative any day.

Making it also some sort of dps buffing cd would exite me quite a bit. You would be begged to throw it down, it adds lines of satisfaction.

"Mage, click the Lightwell, your health is low." "Hang on, my cooldowns are coming back up, hang on, keep me alive until they're up. Awww wtf why'd I die?"

And then you get people clicking it at full health, because hey, it's a DPS cooldown not a health ability, even if it's only a 3% damage increase that's what they'll click it for.

[Slavemaker]

Lightwell is fine, people just need to stop being stupid/lazy and click the dang thing.

[Ethas]

><

I used to agree with most of you, until I found a raid leader that uses lightwell strictly as a raid CD. When it's actually needed. That experience will change your mind instantly. Let me illustrate why, and encourage you all to try it:

15 lightwell renews going out at once:
Average tick (at ~7% crit): 10,500 HP
Pretend for a second it doesn't benefit from haste (close enough to true, although I personally would manage a 4th tick).
Then, 3 ticks per click.
Over a period of 6 seconds, 1 click gains 5.25K hps.
Consider for a second 15 clicks at once:
5.25K * 15 = 79K HPS, 6 second duration.



Now, if you have as much haste rating as I do:

10500 * 4 * 15 = 630K total healing, pre-cast in a single GCD
duration: @ 17.6% haste from rating, 8 / 1.176 = 6.80 seconds.
HPS as a cooldown in 25-man: 92K HPS. If you continue healing during this period, you can easily push 160K raw, thank you lightwell. You can't spike nearly that high with DH, under any possible combination of haste buffs. (edit: unless you happen to be a troll)
HPS as a cooldown in 10-man: 61.8K HPS. If you continue healing during this period, you can easily push 130k edit: 120K raw. Thanks lightwell. That's a DH under bloodlust.


If you're not abusing the hell out of this already, please reconsider. It's all about positioning and coordination. Yes, people have to interact with it, your raid needs good positioning, etc. Is that really so cumbersome? Maybe you're just tired of griping at your raiders to use it. On the same token, maybe you just need to go find a new raid leader :b. The numbers speak for themselves. LW is very worth putting up with, and learning to use.

Yes my guild leader has been using it as raid CD at our first attempts on some HM bosses back to firelands but once boss is defeated (tho even as a CD it still wasnt used to max charges) it is not needed anymore and everyone cba to use it. Also its effective HPS wont be even close to raw one.

And then you get people clicking it at full health, because hey, it's a DPS cooldown not a health ability, even if it's only a 3% damage increase that's what they'll click it for.

Well if you place it during aoe it will be good and finaly involve some priest action rather then anyone else. Anyway everything is better than current state of LW. I'd better see my LW goes fully overheal instead just standing still without anyone who interested in clicking it. Because just as you said: dps care only about dps.

[liljc711]

i say let the lightwell be the size of cookie's pot in deadmines.

[zakaluka]

they wouldn't let me be holy to get a log plot, raid leader said he didn't feel like wiping to lack of PS because holy blows for madness . Maybe in a bit when our druid can survive impale without sac. No other fight is good for a demo in current tier.

And poor ethas, language barrier sometimes translates into a terse tone.

Also its effective HPS wont be even close to raw one.

If this is true a CD wasn't needed. If I use DH when it's actually needed, it won't overheal. If I call LW when it's actually needed, nobody will be capable of sniping it (6 second duration and all).

Really wanted that plot.

[Volitar]

Maybe if you could make a macro eat a charge it would be fine but as it stands I hate it. I would like to see it work like trash from the ToC 5 man where it just sort of shoots heals out. Maybe is could just be a clone of the new healing stream totem. Whatever they decide to do it will be an improvement over the current version.

[Tsplodey]

Doesnt look like itll be changing after reading yesterdays blue posts.

We may re-design how the statue works, removing the on-click effect as it steps on Lightwell's toes a bit.

[muto]

It's need to be the size of Kologarn so people click it.

[ramennoodleking]

"if" "if" "if"


Everything about this spell is conditional. And anecdotal.

Still waiting/hoping to see a decent log where LW did something noticeable (beside beeing sniped by the whole universe).

p.s.: Begging people to click on ur LW and call them bad raiders if they won't do? 100% ridicolous.

I have logs where lightwell did from 500k-1mil healing. Would that be enough?

---------- Post added 2012-05-14 at 03:02 AM ----------

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/8l24v...90#Sureilltank

500k back in t11

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-il...?s=1021&e=1294

630k on h zonozz

I havn't healed for the past couple months, and we havn't been working on progression since mid february, so I'm not gonna bother to dig through old logs just to prove a point. But half a million healing is enough.

---------- Post added 2012-05-14 at 03:09 AM ----------

i say let the lightwell be the size of cookie's pot in deadmines.

And to that i say let it BE cookie's pot, complete with cookie throwing out food (heals) to everyone who clicks it.

[Purpleisbetter]

Oh typical lw-renew healing.

Got the same numbers in average, still find it weak.

And yeah, u basically put down the LW to heal yourself:
Sureilltank 255512 36.7 %

The raid got healed for an impressive 410k over a 8M healing done (:\).

Its the usual i got then i got bored and dropped the talent.
And u were really lucky u got R.Sham and not a R.Druid or numbers would be even lower.

[Derpstorm]

Not sure how there is still a debate about the viability of Lightwell, just click the damn thing. This coming from someone whom plays primarily dps and tank, rarely healer and never a holy priest. Find me a spell with more HPM than Lightwell, I dare you :3

[ramennoodleking]

Oh typical lw-renew healing.

Got the same numbers in average, still find it weak.

And yeah, u basically put down the LW to heal yourself:
Sureilltank 255512 36.7 %

The raid got healed for an impressive 410k over a 8M healing done (:\).

Its the usual i got then i got bored and dropped the talent.
And u were really lucky u got R.Sham and not a R.Druid or numbers would be even lower.

Gosh you're right, 8% of my healing is nothing. Let's go ahead and get rid of echo of light and the glyph of prayer of healing too, which also did around that measly amount. You should go ahead and drop the glyph if you havnt yet and ask a GM to deactivate Echo of Light for you.

Also, I had a resto Druid in the first example.

Raid healing is raid healing, regardless who it goes to. You are just to stubborn, close-minded, and any other synonym to drop it and be reasonable. Have a good day.

[Jaja]

I chose rework, I do like it as is but I would love a slash command that could be macro'd so I don't have to try click it. It can be damn near impossible to see!

[Omgarsh]

Has anybody mentioned the glyph in MoP that makes it auto-target people below a % of health? I think that makes it way better/more useful. My problem as a non-priest player and mostly a DPS/tank is that I forget it exists in the heat of most boss battles. Or I just don't take enough damage to make it worth clicking and spending a charge that could go to someone else.

[Ynna]

My problem as a non-priest player and mostly a DPS/tank is that I forget it exists in the heat of most boss battles. Or I just don't take enough damage to make it worth clicking and spending a charge that could go to someone else.

This is the problem with Lightwell. Do you ever forget you have a healthstone? Do you ever forget your defensive cooldowns?
And seriously, if you never take enough damage in a raid to click the Lightwell, you're probably the best raider on the planet.

[Praeori]

rework.. nice idea, but not powerful enough ..