RNG unfair and Ret Pallys back to being boring

[Deleted]

Why do Blizzard have to make some classes so RNG in raids... I play a Ret paladin in DS 10 hc and at times I can really struggle to put out some really good DPS, whereas other tops i can find i'm easily topping damage meters by a good couple of k over the person second. It doesn't really seem fair that a certain class will do a completely different amount of DPS during an encounter compared to some classes that will do a very similar amount each time.

For example, one raid week on heroic Morchok I can push out 38k dps extremely easily just because i get a few procs during the time my cooldowns are up and can burst up to around 75k. Then we move on to kill Yor'sahj and my dps there will go down to around 32k. The next week that we go it will be completely the other way around. Why does it all have to be based around the amount of procs you get.

How much dps you do should be based around skill and gear level and how you've manipulated your stats like crit/mastery and how you use your skills, not, 20% chance to get an extra spell to do uber leet deeps... (I know that some people will see this and be like QQ MOAR, play another class if you don't like it etc) but i just want to see what people think about the RNG of certain classes like a ret pally for example. Anyone else hate something about their class and how RNG it can be?

Final part of my rant here - Ret paladins used to have such a slow gameplay feel after holy power was implemented, having to use 3 crusader strikes to build up a templars verdict so you could pop out a massive crit. Then when dragon soul came out the gameplay sped up and playing a Ret paladin became faster and a lot more fun with the 2p bonus. Now that MoP is coming out and gear will be changed very quickly, we'll lose the benefit of the 2p bonus and paladins will go back to being a slow dps class to play, where you can pretty much alt-tab to facebook while you wait for your crusader strike to cool down seeing as the damage from a judgement is pretty useless (only really good for killing a critter and regenning mana).

My question really is, Do the people of WoW think playing a ret paladin will be worth doing so if the gameplay will be slow and boring, are all the current ret paladins going to go and re-spec back to prot/holy like they all did at the start of Cataclysm? Will Ret paladins become a rarity of the game???

Post your opinions

[Deleted]

You clearly haven't played a ret on the beta then, the only proc we get is the instant exorcism, most abilities generate holy power too, so its a win win

[TJ]

Play my Ret Paladin and do 42-46k each week on Ultraxion, could be much worse. Also as mentioned above Ret is a lot less reliant on rng in the current beta.

[Deleted]

I played beta for about 20 mins on my warrior before getting bored of the constant people moaning about a buggy quest, i'd rather play the working client when the expansion pack is released as long as the game play is still relatively speedy then i'll be happy thanks

[Deleted]

I played beta for about 20 mins on my warrior before getting bored of the constant people moaning about a buggy quest, i'd rather play the working client when the expansion pack is released as long as the game play is still relatively speedy then i'll be happy thanks

just wondering, did you AP? if so, did you do it for D3 with the beta as a bonus, or the other way around? or did you get a random invite?

[Reith]

You clearly haven't played a ret on the beta then, the only proc we get is the instant exorcism, most abilities generate holy power too, so its a win win

That and it resets the cooldown instead of making it available to use instantly, so if you get unlucky with procs, you can still use it after 15 seconds.

[Deleted]

DK is probably the most RNG of any class, my damage varies from 40k -> 50k dps

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w4...?s=6896&e=7158

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w4...?s=8459&e=8718

[Deleted]

DK is probably the most RNG of any class, my damage varies from 40k -> 50k dps

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w4...?s=6896&e=7158

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w4...?s=8459&e=8718

I wasn't are this thread was about DK's sorry

[Malthanis]

I wasn't are this thread was about DK's sorry

It's a comment on RNG and it's effects on other DPS in comparison to Retribution. In all honesty, the RNG in our spec isn't nearly as bad as others. Fire mages got the worst of it, I think.

[Deleted]

Ret dps fluctuates a lot. It's partly because of RNG but also because we're so reliant on cds to maximize our dps, wich is pretty frustrating because optimal use of cds depends not only on ourselves but on external factors like fight duration or timing with bloodlust. Not to mention having good rng during cds also causes our dps to greatly spike.

This is an issue that is further worsened by our BiS weapon(gurth).


But OP, do not worry. On beta, like it was mentioned, the only RNG you got as baseline is art of war and even in the worst case scenario you will have exorc availeable on a 15s cd. You can choose to talent for Divine Purpose but it looks like the weakest of all three choices dps wise.

[Samin]

Play my Ret Paladin and do 42-46k each week on Ultraxion, could be much worse. Also as mentioned above Ret is a lot less reliant on rng in the current beta.

Well I still think there seems to be a design problem here. From the new "Core ability" page (only datamined yet)

PALADIN_RET_CORE_ABILITY_1 - Use when available. Generates 1 Holy Power.
PALADIN_RET_CORE_ABILITY_2 - Use when available. Generates 1 Holy Power.
PALADIN_RET_CORE_ABILITY_3 - Use when Art of War occurs.

(Judgement/Crusaders Strike/Exorcism)

Which honestly is

PALADIN_RET_CORE_ABILITY_1 - Use when available. Generates 1 Holy Power.
PALADIN_RET_CORE_ABILITY_2 - Use when available. Generates 1 Holy Power.
PALADIN_RET_CORE_ABILITY_3 - Use when available. Generates 1 Holy Power. Cooldown reset by Art of War

I mean I love it, but looking at it like that it's kind of weird that we now need 3 abilties that basically do the same to work properly. I mean Judgement has other uses but the difference between Crusaders Strike and Exorcism especially seems kind of weak currently. And you really just mash these three abilities when available until you have 3+ holy power to use finishers.

Again, I enjoy the playstyle currently on beta, but I also enjoyed the WotLK playstyle which was apparently disliked mostly.

[Landin55]

Beta ret is smexy...like WOTLK smexy.
I be swinging that new TV animation all day every day.

[Deleted]

For those saying that RNG problems have been solved... really...

1st - It's RNG all over again, You get mad dps from chain exos, or you get craped ( let's not forget when it resets when you have something like... 1-2 sec left on CD )
2nd - Crusader's Zeal, so 25% extra attack speed on 3 melee swings ( not Haste, but just attack speed, how great! )! Oh, but it's a 20% proc! Yes, a proc! Which leads to more Exo procs... or not? You know it's RNG! And with no exo procs, you won't get as many HP to maintin the more fluid rotation, unless you mass stack haste, obviously.
( And still Sanctity of Battle scales with spell haste, WTF? )

I think RNG wise we're exactly in the same position than before, we're just not that reliant on CDs ( we'll see, cuz Avenging Wrath with hammer spam is... mad dps ).

Also, our AoE rotation is back to crap and hits for shit, having us spam single target skills to AoE ( yet again ), but that's something for another topic.

Oh, and no, I'm not planing on rerolling to another class.

[Wildspirit]

Obviously you didn't play Ret Pal in beta ... so before you criticize or complain, try.

You talk about the 2part bonus set ? well in MoP, as ret spec, your judgment will grant a HP... as your exo and CS... and HoW as well if I'm not mistaken... Your exo is now instant with a 15s CD and a chance that your melee swings reset the cooldown.

Didn't really check the new glyphs and didn't pay much attention to the talents, but overall, the rotation is more fluid and if you sometimes run out of skill to use, well, it's because you messed up your cycle.

[minteK917]

Beta ret is by far the best its ever been... Hell my rogue looks like its turning into crap compared to ret. I mean im sure they will get fixed eventually. Right now ret in pve at least and mabye even in pvp shape up to be one of the best spec in the game. Not 3.0 tbc status, but you know actually competitive.

[Dark_light_uk]

You clearly haven't played a ret on the beta then, the only proc we get is the instant exorcism, most abilities generate holy power too, so its a win win

QFT: I'm on the beta and yes its kinda mad how nearly everything gives me HP... well that been said I'm stuck with a 25 year c.d on judgement so I can't comment further

[Frozen Death Knight]

For those saying that RNG problems have been solved... really...

1st - It's RNG all over again, You get mad dps from chain exos, or you get craped ( let's not forget when it resets when you have something like... 1-2 sec left on CD )
2nd - Crusader's Zeal, so 25% extra attack speed on 3 melee swings ( not Haste, but just attack speed, how great! )! Oh, but it's a 20% proc! Yes, a proc! Which leads to more Exo procs... or not? You know it's RNG! And with no exo procs, you won't get as many HP to maintin the more fluid rotation, unless you mass stack haste, obviously.
( And still Sanctity of Battle scales with spell haste, WTF? )

I think RNG wise we're exactly in the same position than before, we're just not that reliant on CDs ( we'll see, cuz Avenging Wrath with hammer spam is... mad dps ).

Also, our AoE rotation is back to crap and hits for shit, having us spam single target skills to AoE ( yet again ), but that's something for another topic.

Oh, and no, I'm not planing on rerolling to another class.

That kind of RNG is a lot different from having to rely on procs to fill up all the void between each CS and TV attack. For one, we don't need to take Divine Purpose, and even if Exorcism can get its CD reset, we can always rely on it to be ready every 20 second. That's a lot different from live where the procs decide if we can load off our damage really fast or not. Having two baseline procs which both affect the same spell is not a lot of RNG, at all.

[Sparkalark]

QFT: I'm on the beta and yes its kinda mad how nearly everything gives me HP... well that been said I'm stuck with a 25 year c.d on judgement so I can't comment further

Go do end time and kill last dragon, clicking the hour glass should reset the cooldown.

[ZeroEdgeir]

And do note, for those that may not have read anything, but complain anyways: We can also overflow our Holy Power up to 5 now, too, called Boundless Conviction.

HP Generators
Crusader Strike - 1 Holy Power, shares CD with HotR
Hammer of the Righteous (yes, we get it as Ret) - 1 Holy Power, used for AoE HP generation, shares CD with CS
Judgement - 1 Holy Power
Exorcism - 1 Holy Power, has a CD, reset by AoW procs

HP Expenses
Templar's Verdict - Can only be used with 3 Holy Power, hits like the truck it should be.
Divine Storm - Can only be used with 3 Holy Power, this is our AoE burst skill.
Word of Glory - Self-heal, if you need it or something (obviously not a DPS gain, unless it prevents your very close death, cause death is a big DPS loss)

RNG Factors
Art of War - Instantly refreshes the CD of Exorcism, procs off auto-attacks.
Crusader's Zeal - 20% chance to increases auto-attack speed by 25% for 3 swings, procs off of auto-attacks.

That is like it.
So really, what is the big deal?

[minteK917]

And do note, for those that may not have read anything, but complain anyways: We can also overflow our Holy Power up to 5 now, too, called Boundless Conviction.

HP Generators
Crusader Strike - 1 Holy Power, shares CD with HotR
Hammer of the Righteous (yes, we get it as Ret) - 1 Holy Power, used for AoE HP generation, shares CD with CS
Judgement - 1 Holy Power
Exorcism - 1 Holy Power, has a CD, reset by AoW procs

HP Expenses
Templar's Verdict - Can only be used with 3 Holy Power, hits like the truck it should be.
Divine Storm - Can only be used with 3 Holy Power, this is our AoE burst skill.
Word of Glory - Self-heal, if you need it or something (obviously not a DPS gain, unless it prevents your very close death, cause death is a big DPS loss)

RNG Factors
Art of War - Instantly refreshes the CD of Exorcism, procs off auto-attacks.
Crusader's Zeal - 20% chance to increases auto-attack speed by 25% for 3 swings, procs off of auto-attacks.

That is like it.
So really, what is the big deal?

Hammer of wrath also still gives holy power for ret. It was just wrong tooltip from mmo-champ.