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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by checking facts View Post
    in tirisfal they have free will, in silverpine they have free will and in WP they have free will. there's no evidence of any sort of mind control. (read posts 196 and 199 on this thread, I don't like to keep on repeating myself lol)
    During the silverpine questline, an entire village that was planning an attack on the forsaken was killed and raised by the Val'kyr, joining the forsaken in battle instantly. No conversation, no suicides. The instantly joined their hated enemies. Now godfrey and stuff were clearly still independent to a degree, I admit.
    A look at the warcraft novels, RPG books, games and magical french space soccer.

    Glory to person-whose-name-I-dont-know-but-rules-Kul-Tiras!

  2. #202
    Brewmaster Kiry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beerbill View Post
    Pretty much what Deadmedic said, you will only know what Sylvanas mean to us, playing as Forsaken... idk its like you do really feel pride of begin a Forsaken.
    This 100%. They told her story so well that if you play Forsaken, you can believe in it. She's a very cool, understandable character.
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  3. #203
    The Lightbringer Pud'n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ijffdrie View Post
    During the silverpine questline, an entire village that was planning an attack on the forsaken was killed and raised by the Val'kyr, joining the forsaken in battle instantly. No conversation, no suicides. The instantly joined their hated enemies. Now godfrey and stuff were clearly still independent to a degree, I admit.
    Seems more like sloppy story telling on part of Blizzard, than Blizzard intentionally showing the newly risen Forsaken as being MC'd. After all, the exact same Val'kry group of Val'kry that resurrects playable Forsaken during the Forsaken starting zone, and playable Forsaken obviously show their own independence and will.
    Last edited by Pud'n; 2012-04-30 at 07:53 PM.

  4. #204
    To me, Sylvanas represents defiance against condescending, arrogant people. During the third war (Warcraft 3), the Alliance were incredibly arrogant and acted with bigotry against the Blood Elves. They also demanded the citizens of Lordaeron give up their claim to their own kingdom to the Alliance after having liberated it from Arthas. Unacceptable. One person took up the mantle of leadership and organized the fallen Lordaeron citizens into a united fighting force to drive off the Scourge and defend their territory from the kingdoms of the Alliance who thought themselves entitled to land that wasn't theirs. She's also full of emotion, never being ashamed of feeling rage and vengeance toward Arthas for the atrocities he committed against her and her people (both the Forsaken and the Blood Elves).

    She died defending Silvermoon, she sent troops to help the Blood Elves reclaim their land from the Scourge, she has been the victim of Alliance bigotry simply for being undead, she has been the victim of betrayal time and again, and does what must be done to fight back tooth and claw against those who consider them superior and entitled to their lands. Her cause is one I'm happy to fight alongside.

    I relate to her bitterness and position. Growing up, there were plenty of people (usually in the church) that looked down on me for one reason or another and perhaps this is just me, but people acting like that they're inherently better than me really brings my blood to a boil. Those with haughty attitudes, supposing themselves "holier than thou," and looking down on you only makes you want to fight back, to knock them off their high horse, and show them that you're a force to be reckoned with and respected. That's how I see Sylvanas Windrunner.

    Additionally, contrary to her outer shell, she is not without sympathy. In a quest in Silverpine, she explains why she fights against the Alliance: to protect the rights of the undead citizens of Lordaeron and how she will never allow the Alliance to steamroll over them. You can see her lament the tragedies that have befallen her by returning an heirloom amulet from the Ghostlands. She assures the orphans that visit her during Children's week that despite having verbal fights with Garrosh, she isn't going to abandon the Horde - that the child has nothing to worry about. There's an admirable, soft side to Sylvanas; it's just hidden under an outer shell of tragic bitterness.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiry View Post
    This 100%. They told her story so well that if you play Forsaken, you can believe in it. She's a very cool, understandable character.
    This was true pre-Cata. It's no longer the case now because of the direction they took her storyline.

    I liked her character back then because she had a great story. She was a victim that triumphed the best way she could have. Her cause was a just one: to make sure the Forsaken had a place to call home on Azeroth. That home should be Lodaeron, because it belonged to them in life. Everyone wanted them eliminated, despite them being victims, and she wasn't having it. She was fierce and fearless.

    As for the fanboy art, that only got stupid when Blizzard changed her model from the "unsexy" NE to the BE model. I don't think the fanboy art wouldn't have gotten as ridiculous as it did if she remained the NE. Even still, don't forget most of those artists have effed up views about women, life and relationships in general. Not as much of a generalization as you would think.

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by darklady View Post
    This was true pre-Cata. It's no longer the case now because of the direction they took her storyline.

    I liked her character back then because she had a great story. She was a victim that triumphed the best way she could have. Her cause was a just one: to make sure the Forsaken had a place to call home on Azeroth. That home should be Lodaeron, because it belonged to them in life. Everyone wanted them eliminated, despite them being victims, and she wasn't having it. She was fierce and fearless.
    How has this changed? In the new Silverpine Forest quest line, she re-emphasized why she fights against the Alliance: to protect the undead citizens of Lordaeron from Alliance prejudice and aggression. Alliance still want them eliminated and she's still not having it. She is still fierce and fearless and more in tune with her people instead of considering them merely arrows in her quiver to fire at the enemy.

  7. #207
    The Lightbringer Kathranis's Avatar
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    Why would anyone want to kill off one of the most interesting character's in the game to begin with?

    Who cares if she does evil things. She makes the story interesting.

    I don't get this seemingly widespread desire some people have to make the game more boring by killing off all of the characters who are morally gray.

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by Jediguy View Post
    How has this changed? In the new Silverpine Forest quest line, she re-emphasized why she fights against the Alliance: to protect the undead citizens of Lordaeron from Alliance prejudice and aggression. Alliance still want them eliminated and she's still not having it. She is still fierce and fearless and more in tune with her people instead of considering them merely arrows in her quiver to fire at the enemy.
    It's changed because I no loner believe in her cause or story. She's suffering innocents to the same fate she suffered and robbing graves. She's the LK part 2, and it betrays her character. You can be a badass w/o being evil. I stopped playing my undead, so did a lot of the people in the guild that toon was in (or they race changed them to BE's.)

    It would have been better for there to be this silent understanding that the Forsaken are a doomed race. Keeping the population going by her current means....isn't likable. You don't like a race, you won't play it.

  9. #209
    Brewmaster Duravian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylaria View Post
    Even if this...."poster" is joking.

    There are people that are really like this...it's....almost creepy. They devote life to a video-game Character.

    I love some video game characters myself....but NEVER enough to say "My life"
    He's roleplaying, get over it...
    "The Thread Ender" - No seriously, whenever I enter a thread, people stop talking. Wtf guys, is it something I said?

  10. #210
    Pandaren Monk Solzan Nemesis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimPaladin View Post
    Pretty much just because she's female. She's also the only female faction leader (Tyrande stopped counting awhile ago.).

    That and they just sort of like her character, I guess.
    Oh and she is a badass

    Quote Originally Posted by stomination View Post
    Why are people so against her is the real question. Most of the time its people from that play a different faction or race that complains about it.


    We want Lor'themar to actually be a character that does something but we can not force blizzard to do so. He is basically just someone holding space and only doing things in short stories/out of game stuff. Garrosh is the only thing that has changed the horde. Sylvanas only change is she now uses the forsaken as a shield against death instead of arrows against death. She needs them to survive so she can survive.

    Gilneas was taken because Garrosh wanted it taken. He would have done it himself by sacrificing the Forsaken but Sylvanas stepped in and said no to that.

    Garrosh is going to be corrupted while Sylvanas is still doing the things she did when she was alive. She has not changed much except she is part of the undead.
    I would love if Lor'themar got a lot more importen and became the Sun King.

  11. #211
    Well personally... I don't think she has ever really fit as leader of the forsaken... yes she was wronged by Arthas, yes someone needed to take control of the undead left behind... but is she the right fit... meh.

    Blizzard kind of strengthened her position as a leader of the horde when they introduced the bloodelves. That whole quest line made a lot more sense than having her as a leader did previously.

    I'm not sure I'm a huge fan of the Vrykul situation we find ourselves in. This whole she can't die bit... is getting old. The killing her and resurrecting her is pointless really. How about you just not kill her? Or how about the vyrkul got destroyed with arthas... or still under Bolvar's control.

    All that aside... I think she has one of the most attractive in game models (I know its a BE) (and no I don't get off to cartoons) of any model, her and Ysera, and Alexstraza

  12. #212
    High Overlord mpaskin1's Avatar
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    THEY LIKE HER BECAUSE SHE HAS TITS.
    there, i said it.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Sylaria View Post
    Even if this...."poster" is joking.

    There are people that are really like this...it's....almost creepy. They devote life to a video-game Character.

    I love some video game characters myself....but NEVER enough to say "My life"
    he(I assume) means his characters life. I refer to myself when I talk about ym undead lock. and from that poitn of view, I am way more loyal to sylvanas than anyother leader, even when thrall was still leading us
    What bosses will be in the Deathwing Raid?
    Quote Originally Posted by MauroDiogo View Post
    Leg 1, Leg 2, Hind Legs is a duo boss fight, Wings, Tail, Head and last Heroic mode only boss is his Chin. Totally optional and only for those hardcore enough. It's jaw dropping!
    Quote Originally Posted by Histidine View Post
    WoW is great.
    Not sure what game people are playing; I love the way things are.

  14. #214
    I've loved her ever since Starcraft 1.

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by darklady View Post
    It's changed because I no loner believe in her cause or story. She's suffering innocents to the same fate she suffered and robbing graves. She's the LK part 2, and it betrays her character. You can be a badass w/o being evil. I stopped playing my undead, so did a lot of the people in the guild that toon was in (or they race changed them to BE's.)

    It would have been better for there to be this silent understanding that the Forsaken are a doomed race. Keeping the population going by her current means....isn't likable. You don't like a race, you won't play it.
    She doesn't force them to be alive. if you want to die, you can. if you don't want to follow her, you don't have to. she rezzes you, but she doesn't enslave you like the LK did

    ---------- Post added 2012-05-01 at 12:24 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by ijffdrie View Post
    During the silverpine questline, an entire village that was planning an attack on the forsaken was killed and raised by the Val'kyr, joining the forsaken in battle instantly. No conversation, no suicides. The instantly joined their hated enemies. Now godfrey and stuff were clearly still independent to a degree, I admit.
    really? cause I remember conversations when peopel were raised(I don't remember exactly what was said) but it wasn't enslaved. basically once you are raised as undead, you are no longer accepted by your people(humans) but sylvanas gave you a second chance to live, most choose to follow her.
    What bosses will be in the Deathwing Raid?
    Quote Originally Posted by MauroDiogo View Post
    Leg 1, Leg 2, Hind Legs is a duo boss fight, Wings, Tail, Head and last Heroic mode only boss is his Chin. Totally optional and only for those hardcore enough. It's jaw dropping!
    Quote Originally Posted by Histidine View Post
    WoW is great.
    Not sure what game people are playing; I love the way things are.

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    I've loved her ever since Starcraft 1.
    I see what you did there.
    "Lordaeron belongs to the Forsaken. Always and forever!"

    Perfection is so horribly dull, don't you think?

  17. #217
    The Lightbringer Uennie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joodoc View Post
    She doesn't force them to be alive. if you want to die, you can. if you don't want to follow her, you don't have to. she rezzes you, but she doesn't enslave you like the LK did

    ---------- Post added 2012-05-01 at 12:24 AM ----------



    really? cause I remember conversations when peopel were raised(I don't remember exactly what was said) but it wasn't enslaved. basically once you are raised as undead, you are no longer accepted by your people(humans) but sylvanas gave you a second chance to live, most choose to follow her.
    One of the reasons I don't actually like her is because she sends you on a mission to massacre humans to raise them against their will (Silverpine Forest). It's one thing to wait for people to die, it's another to kill them just to raise them and say "Don't like it? Go kill yourself you're dead now anyway."

    Here's the quest: http://www.wowhead.com/quest=27097

    "You are to take Agatha with you to Fenris Isle and slaughter all humans. She will raise the fallen as Forsaken, bolstering our forces in the process."

    It's also strange that every now and again that as soon as you raise them they say pro-Forsaken things right away, while the vast majority lament over what you've done to them.

    But I also defend her as a character. I may not like her, but I like her story and character.
    Last edited by Uennie; 2012-05-01 at 06:51 AM.

  18. #218
    Shes hot.... nuff' said

  19. #219
    Field Marshal Senjai's Avatar
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    Honestly, I don't remember anyone caring too much about Sylvanas being under attack when Thrall was still around - Horde players would tend to protect him and not really worry about any of the other faction leaders, except on those occasions when they knew Alliance raids were forming for the achievement. Now that Thrall's out of the picture, Sylvanas is really the only suitable substitute, since Vol'jin isn't required for the achievement, and Baine and Lor'themar may as well be cardboard cut-outs.

  20. #220
    Cause out of all the horde leaders, she's the only good one left lore wise. and out of all female racial leaders is only one worth a damn anymore after Tyrande got Richard Knaaked.

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