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  1. #21
    The Lightbringer leaks's Avatar
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    This sounds pretty boring, it's just copy pasted abilities from other tank specs. You also left out several important details like how are they supposed to hold aggro? Do they have to manage mana? ect. You also seem to have their "tank" stance give extra damage which seems like it would cause all types of balance issues.
    "Terror, darkness, power? The Forsaken crave not these things; the Forsaken ARE these things."

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by fhnhf View Post
    Why all the hate at having a caster tank?
    I already answered that question;

    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    They are not going to add a new role through a glyph in the same expansion that they split Feral into two seperate specs.
    If Warlocks can ever tank (don't bet on it) then it'll be as a fourth spec, same with Shamans.
    It is also far too late into the development process now to add in a new tank class balanced entirely around stats that no other tank uses.

    In a future expansion maybe but it will never happen in Mists of Pandaria and couldn't even if they wanted it to without significant delays to release, so please stop asking for it.

  3. #23
    Mechagnome Shadzta's Avatar
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    http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...w-im-level-89/

    starting to piss me off...GC says " if healers dont see spirit on gear they shouldnt automatically say there isn't any healer gear...healers should have a mix etc " yet he gets all up in arms saying derp derp we can't make gear sharable among dps and tank warlocks thats too hard thats not right. Really dude?!?! i mean cmon your okay with now making healers chase dps gear but not making warlock tanks chase healer gear.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadzta View Post
    http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...w-im-level-89/
    starting to piss me off...GC says " if healers dont see spirit on gear they shouldnt automatically say there isn't any healer gear...healers should have a mix etc " yet he gets all up in arms saying derp derp we can't make gear sharable among dps and tank warlocks thats too hard thats not right. Really dude?!?! i mean cmon your okay with now making healers chase dps gear but not making warlock tanks chase healer gear.
    1) He said that healer gear actually exists, not that healers should roll on all DPS gear, so this has nothing to do with warlock tanking at all
    2) More than one type of class uses healer stats
    3) The above means that Blizzard already know how to balance healer classes with healer stats
    4) No healer class is activated using a glyph
    5) No tank class uses intellect, haste, crit and mastery as their main stats
    6) It would not be as easy to balance a tank with intellect, haste, crit and mastery as their main stats as you seem to believe it would be, especially as Blizzard did not expect nearly the support that they received for the concept of a Warlock tank. Game development cycles are not flexible enough that you can just insert a new spec this far into the coding process, it would break balance and it would break the game.

    Blizzard went on record with saying that they really didn't think Warlocks wanted to tank until they released this glyph.
    They are now definitely aware that a fairly large number of people would be interested in a warlock tanking spec.
    I'd say that the chances of them investigating warlock tanking further is actually fairly high however it definitely won't happen in Mists of Pandaria.

    You just can't add in specs without any notice! It doesn't work that way!
    It's a shame, but Blizzard have neither infinite staff or an infinite amount of time.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadzta View Post
    http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...w-im-level-89/

    starting to piss me off...GC says " if healers dont see spirit on gear they shouldnt automatically say there isn't any healer gear...healers should have a mix etc " yet he gets all up in arms saying derp derp we can't make gear sharable among dps and tank warlocks thats too hard thats not right. Really dude?!?! i mean cmon your okay with now making healers chase dps gear but not making warlock tanks chase healer gear.
    I see no connection between that discussion and this. GC is responding there to some complaints about an extreme lack of spirit cloth drops/rewards while leveling, which has priests feeling that their mana regen is suffering while they're nearing 90. He is right that priests don't need every piece to have spirit, though the complaints about a shortage sound legit. As long as a piece doesn't have hit, it is potentially a healing piece.

    That is a far cry from discussing how to adapt gear to give a class an entirely new role, one that is foreign to the armor type. It's not gear issues that are holding them back. As Imnick said, the simple fact is that lock tanking is not the plan right now.

    Copping an attitude isn't going to help the cause. If we really want warlock tanking in the future, we need to stay positive, show Blizz what we can do with it, and convince them that we're still interested. Blizz does seem to be flirting with giving classes new things to do. At one point in this beta, holy paladins were half-decent caster DPS.

    I'm hopeful that the next expansion will either see several classes getting new specs viable in progression, or more "emergency modes" like DA that players could utilize full-time for old content, farming, and having fun with friends.

  6. #26
    Guys, epic Warlock nerfs on mainpage


    /runs crying

  7. #27
    Demo nerf was invevitable,

    Demon hunting glyph like wtf, dunno whats the point of this glyph anymore.

  8. #28

  9. #29
    I made a post discussing. The nerfs aren't too terribly bad if the straight damage is still competitive, and there are some buffs tossed in.

    Glyph of Demon Hunting needs some serious direction.

  10. #30
    Legendary! Callace's Avatar
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    Damage taken is down to a mere 3.8%, looks like any chances of tanking are dead in the water.

  11. #31
    Wait and see for the mastery scaling. Just want to remind you that Dark Apotheosis damage reduction was null before. It wasn't working at all. So in any case I won't see it as a nerf.
    www.youtube.com/Spygnesy
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  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Ysen View Post
    Wait and see for the mastery scaling. Just want to remind you that Dark Apotheosis damage reduction was null before. It wasn't working at all. So in any case I won't see it as a nerf.
    I won't disagree. Its fun just to be able to go into perma-meta during solo.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Ysen View Post
    Wait and see for the mastery scaling. Just want to remind you that Dark Apotheosis damage reduction was null before. It wasn't working at all. So in any case I won't see it as a nerf.
    Heh. Can't nerf zero. Maybe this means Blizz is starting to get it into some kind of balance.

  14. #34
    Notice how those reminding us of how easy it is have to make so many changes just to make it fit.
    People want warlock tanking because its deemed to be cool.
    It is not required, nor supported by the lore.

    Just change this, and this, and this, and this ... and then you will get a warlock tank.
    At which point how much of the warlock do you actually have left.

    Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    1) He said that healer gear actually exists, not that healers should roll on all DPS gear, so this has nothing to do with warlock tanking at all
    2) More than one type of class uses healer stats
    3) The above means that Blizzard already know how to balance healer classes with healer stats
    4) No healer class is activated using a glyph
    5) No tank class uses intellect, haste, crit and mastery as their main stats
    6) It would not be as easy to balance a tank with intellect, haste, crit and mastery as their main stats as you seem to believe it would be, especially as Blizzard did not expect nearly the support that they received for the concept of a Warlock tank. Game development cycles are not flexible enough that you can just insert a new spec this far into the coding process, it would break balance and it would break the game.

    Blizzard went on record with saying that they really didn't think Warlocks wanted to tank until they released this glyph.
    They are now definitely aware that a fairly large number of people would be interested in a warlock tanking spec.
    I'd say that the chances of them investigating warlock tanking further is actually fairly high however it definitely won't happen in Mists of Pandaria.

    You just can't add in specs without any notice! It doesn't work that way!
    It's a shame, but Blizzard have neither infinite staff or an infinite amount of time.
    People didn't want it before, and only jumped on the bandwagon because it was the new cool toy.
    They endlessly repeated about how a tiny number of niche encounters with mechanics completely contradictory to normal tanking supported the role, and how a tank shortage which is entirely community driven and not in any way reduced by the ever-popular death knight was again a reason for it.
    People don't want something until its made interesting.
    Last edited by ComputerNerd; 2012-05-13 at 12:33 PM.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by ComputerNerd View Post
    Get over it.

    People didn't want it before, and only jumped on the bandwagon because it was the new cool toy.
    They endlessly repeated about how a tiny number of niche encounters with mechanics completely contradictory to normal tanking supported the role, and how a tank shortage which is entirely community driven and not in any way reduced by the ever-popular death knight was again a reason for it.
    People don't want something until its made interesting.
    At the same time, people did want it. The bandwagon has found lots of new passengers since the glyph debuted, but there have been small numbers of people wishing for years for this sort of thing to come about. A lot of folks enjoy dreaming up new ways to play, or figuring out how to use what's already in game in unusual ways. It's fun for those involved, and no harm to those not interested.

  16. #36
    Epic! shokter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inactivity View Post
    Unleash Earth distracts, but does not taunt. Seems minor but having soloed with a pet, the difference is quite major.
    Unleash rockbiter absolutely taunts...mobs or bosses. If you UE with rockbiter active the target will attack you. It is a taunt.
    "Brevity is...wit"

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by shokter View Post
    If you UE with rockbiter active the target will attack you. It is a taunt.
    Yes, but not permanently. Hence it's not a "true" taunt, merely a taunt aura.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Jtree View Post
    At the same time, people did want it. The bandwagon has found lots of new passengers since the glyph debuted, but there have been small numbers of people wishing for years for this sort of thing to come about. A lot of folks enjoy dreaming up new ways to play, or figuring out how to use what's already in game in unusual ways. It's fun for those involved, and no harm to those not interested.
    That community who had such strong beliefs were incredibly quiet prior to the glyph, so yes they jumped on the bandwagon because it was cool.
    Not because of prior beliefs.
    Yes it is harmful to those not interested because of the adjustments to DA for balance, and to the rest of the spec to simply make it fit.
    DA has done irreparable damage to the demo spec.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by ComputerNerd View Post
    That community who had such strong beliefs were incredibly quiet prior to the glyph, so yes they jumped on the bandwagon because it was cool.
    Not because of prior beliefs.
    Yes it is harmful to those not interested because of the adjustments to DA for balance, and to the rest of the spec to simply make it fit.
    DA has done irreparable damage to the demo spec.
    I'd imagine people jumped on it because previously they hadn't considered it to be a serious possibility. I know I've always thought the idea of a demon hunter tank was cool, but until recently though it would never be possible.
    Now? I wouldn't be incredibly susprised if Blizzard gave it more thought after MoP ended, though I also wouldn't cry if it never sees the light of day.

  20. #40
    Warlock tanking is nothing new. If you think so, I guess your lock has been around for a very short time (1 or 2 expacs)
    During BC I was on the top pve guild of my server and remember Mtanking at least 2 encounters. 1 in ICC (princes).
    For any old school lock:
    a) that likes to solo old raids
    b) that knows how locks suck without pocket healer in today's pvp
    c) that have a lot of tanking experience with other classe and would welcome the change to help their guild without switching main

    ...then this glyph was a bit of fresh air and good news. We never thought it would be implemented and that's the reason why few players actually talked about it. Also, I think most old locks (main since at least 2007) are not teens anymore and aren't crying of forums to push their ideas. And no, that's not what I am doing right now ^_^. I would welcome the change and but I will still play my lock, even if I do think they completely broke Demonology on Beta.
    1) it works fine live and it's piss easy compared to what it used to be. Why would they fix what is not broken?
    2) first they make a strong glyph and enable tanking
    3) then they screw up everything, cut dps with a chainsaw, destroy the glyph, leaving Demo as a clunky and underperforming spec both in pvp, pve and solo

    Hopefully, everything will get fixed with time. But pretending lock tanking is a new thing / bandwagon is pure ignorance imo

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