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  1. #121
    I like when Atrahasis talks about inovation, it is rather ironic that same person likes Torchlight.

  2. #122
    Scarab Lord Frozen Death Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by u9k13tjc View Post
    in the past. now they somehow manage to both take ages to put stuff out and make it feel rushed and untested. time was Bliz was known for quality and polish, sadly those days are long gone and now its bug and long waits.

    As a smaller company they were really innovative and produced some really great games. but they grew big and because bogged down in stockholder returns and so one and lost their edge.

    Compare them to Trion or Anet, or even CCP. companies much more flexible and able to innovate because they are not as big as Bliz. Bliz has too much inertia, once they set course its very hard for them to change direction, and thats not good.
    Maybe you felt it was innovative back then because you had barely experienced those type of games? A good analogy would be the iPhone, for example. The technology for making such phones have existed for some time, but it was not until Apple put together every piece that set the standards for the market.

    This also applies to Diablo 1 and 2. The ideas behind them were not new, but Blizzard still managed to set the standard of future games by making two games that worked very well at what they were designed for.

    I personally think the reason you may have problems with Blizzard now is because they do not amaze you as much as they did when you first started playing their games. It's too familiar ground and so many games have come out since Diablo 1 and 2 that you have grown past the games they have been making since the very beginning.

    Diablo 3, whether you like it or not, is polished and well made for the audience it wishes to cater to. While not completely perfect, it does its job to make a lot of people like it, and while not as groundbreaking as it predecessors, Blizzard's games have been known to set new standards in the gaming world. You may not like those standards, but the influence will be there in the coming future.
    Last edited by Frozen Death Knight; 2012-05-26 at 01:00 AM.

  3. #123
    Over 9000! Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen Death Knight View Post
    Maybe you felt it was innovative back then because you had barely experienced those type of games? A good analogy would be the iPhone, for example. The technology for making such phones have existed for some time, but it was not until Apple put together every piece that set the standards for the market.
    You really don't wanna put apple and blizzard in the same boat. Theirs alot of ugly comparisons that could come out of that.

  4. #124
    Scarab Lord Frozen Death Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrahasis View Post
    You really don't wanna put apple and blizzard in the same boat. Theirs alot of ugly comparisons that could come out of that.
    Well, you are free to do so, then. Would be interesting to see what you come up with, especially if it is something unique between those companies that can not be said about other gaming companies like Bioware, etc.

  5. #125
    Goddamn wheel, fire, and electricity were already innovated. At least Blizz stuck with what they knew. I welcome our gaming overlords with open arms.

  6. #126
    Scarab Lord Frozen Death Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hailey View Post
    Innovation is the creation of better or more effective products, processes, services, technologies, or ideas that are accepted by markets, governments, and society. Innovation differs from invention in that innovation refers to the use of a new idea or method, whereas invention refers more directly to the creation of the idea or method itself.
    By this definition, Diablo 3 has innovated a lot more than the previous games. It has been far more successful on the market than previous titles, it is catering to a larger audience, and will also set new standards for games within that genre.

  7. #127
    Mechagnome Saeran's Avatar
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    Oh dear...

    No innovation? Compare vanilla WoW with the WoW of today? The innovation they have shown just in that game is a LOT (even if some people have mixed feelings about it)

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spurmwhale View Post
    altho its hard to blame them since fans of their core games seem to want the same game updated to todays standards, and that seems to be what we more or less got between Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3. I'm just not sure if they're over-catering to their rabid online ladder fanbase more than gamers as a whole by repeating the same successful formula to the point the games are almost identical to their predecessors.

    Obviously they have Titan on the horizon which will likely be something new but i can't help but be disappointed with their remakes of older games. I'm surprised they spent 7 years doing D3, and however many doing Starcraft2, where they more or less felt like graphical updated versions of their original releases. Granted i'm not Blizzard's typical B.net online ladder player, more than casual gamer that leans single player campaigns. ITs gotten to the point i don't think i'll be buying another Blizzard re-release again, feels like a complete waste of money more than many other games i've purchased. Haven't touched SC2 for a long time after finishing it, and D3 is going to wear out quick from what i can see...i just feel disappointed in how much work they supposedly put into them only for those games to feel so much like i've already played them :P
    They're a publicly traded company; they're beholden to their investors and shareholders, and those people (many of whom aren't gamers) aren't going to want to fund a project that takes risks. No, they're going to want a project that's essentially proven to sell. I think Blizzard does a great job within those confines, but I do think they're also an object lesson in why game developers should probably stay private. It's not like you can't be a private company and still be successful - just look at Valve.

  9. #129
    Valve was made by the guys who worked for Microsoft (and had a lot of financial backing to make valve into what it is today) many smaller companies can't do what they did.

    Still what they have done is awesome and I hope they stay as they are and continue to improve upon that

  10. #130
    diablo 3 does not feel like a graphical update of d2

    in fact it feels so different that i would go as far as saying it was made by a different devel-

    oh wait...

  11. #131
    Brewmaster Zombina's Avatar
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    Nothing wrong with sticking to yr strengths, sometimes

  12. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Saeran View Post
    No innovation? Compare vanilla WoW with the WoW of today? The innovation they have shown just in that game is a LOT (even if some people have mixed feelings about it)
    the innovation in WoW is non-existent.

    the true innovators are the ones that originally created the addons and MMO's that WoW drew upon for its UI and systems improvements.

    It's not a *bad* thing (especially for a AAA gaming company) to let someone else try new things before you incorporate them into your games, but don't mistake Blizzard adding something new to *their* games for actually adding something new to the gaming genre as a whole.

    If you want an example of something that can be added to a sequel thats 'innovative', try unit queueing in an RTS. Blizzard's RTS didnt contain that mechanic until SC1 (if memory serves), though it was actually innovated by a different company entirely. (the name of the game slips my mind).

    WC1 did not contain unit queueing, WC3 did. It wasn't innovative on Blizzard's part, because it had already been tried and tested, but it *could* have, if Blizzard were the sort to innovate.

  13. #133
    Well, um, they are sequels, to expect something nothing like the first (especially if it's good) is very very stupid and foolish, and then you get more complainers saying it isn't what they expected.

    TBH, I'm not entirely sure what took them so long for Diablo 3...compared to a WoW expansion or Starcraft 2, it doesn't seem like it's anywhere close to as demanding of a project in terms of man-hours, nor is there really all that much balancing needed with only 5 classes (I enjoy the game and minus the server issues I don't really have any complaints). That being said, it's hard to disagree that they do a phenomenal job at balancing Starcraft 2, and I think it's a good step up from the original in terms of gameplay while still keeping the same feeling.

    Case in point, even if aspects of their games seem 'casual' the effort is there to try and make the customers happy that most developers just don't give a shit about. As your OP is about innovoation, I suppose you have a point, but they really do need a new IP for that and well they are working on that with Titan as you said. They don't make a bajillion games like many developers do, but in terms of quality-per-game, Blizzard is number one by far IMO, which I suppose isn't that hard when you only have 3 IPs and billions of dollars, but, still, their games aren't bad quality, and there is something to be said for that.
    Last edited by PBitt; 2012-05-30 at 12:35 AM.

  14. #134
    The problem with innovation these days is a small portion of gaming consumers appreciate it.

    The number of gaming consumers is growing and with that grows bad taste and games. It's a harsh reality but the world wouldn't be in the state it's in if it wasn't for mouthbreathers outnumbering sane individuals.

    Gaming companies are seeing green; they're always out for new customers.

  15. #135
    Blizzard do not innovate. Well, not in the typical sense. The one innovative thing they do is they make the best game they can. They have never been risk takers though.

    What it boils down to is that there are risk taking companies out there, that aim for innovative mmo experiences. Just from the sounds of it, you aren't taking risks either. Try the weird games.

  16. #136
    There's a thin line between innovation and gimmickry.

    I'd much rather them put out a polished game than try making something "innovative" that is of poor overall quality. Most "wow killers" fail for this reason, they're just WoW with extra focus in one area and a lack in the rest / one novelty of dubious quality.

    Frankly, it's nice having a company that just delivers high quality games without trying to reinvent the wheel, having every other game that comes out claiming it's going to revolutionise the genre get's old quickly, especially when they rarely deliver. I'm not saying innovation is bad, the gaming industry would be in a terrible place without it, but not every game (nor developer) needs to be innovative.

  17. #137
    I am Murloc! Thelxi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TEHPALLYTANK View Post
    Stop playing single player so much and play with friends, the games become much more enjoyable.
    The whole point of me playing video games is to catch a break from my social life and just relax fooling around with pixels. Not everyone's goal playing games on the internet is to make "friends" and be "social" through our screens.

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    D2 without LoD was just as short, so I must admit that I find people claiming that D3 is too short a notch silly really.

    Speaking of terms that I am new to the D series of games D3 is very short. Ive played single player rpg/hack an slash on ps2 that were longer, Bauldars gate/ champions of norath to name a couple of my fav. ( spelling butcher ) Now when you get to inferno the game will take forever to beat unless your in that 1% that is the best of the best. The two games i mentioned are similar in style whereas loot is random you start on the avg difficulty and take your character an gear into the next level of difficulty. Still yet the game is short.... when thats all there is to do is campaign... with them having said there will be no expansion... with some kind of pvp feature coming later on... this is the shortest hack n slash game ive ever played. not to mention complete and total lack of character customization out side of gender. its fun... im mad at myself for doing the annual sub seeing what they are going to deliver in MoP but I would have been even more upset if I had actually paid retail for this game. But hey its whatever floats ya boat
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