Game feels designed around RMAH

[quras]

At least it does to me.

Everything about the game screams "let's push for RMAH" :/

And you would be right. The game itself is rather monotonous and is a massive grind with only small improvements over D2. Where the real effort was put in this game was the RMAH and how far blizzard could reach their hand into your pocketbook.

Inferno was not made extremely hard to complete cause players wanted it. It was made difficult to push you into the RMAH and spend more to complete the game.

Call it, "pay 2 complete" instead of pay to win but there so close does it really matter. To bad gamers forgot we hate pay to win (complete) type games at the possibility of a little cash in our pockets.

[Veyne]

The way loot works is exactly how it worked in Diablo 2.

Exactly the same.

Exactly.

It's just now we have an auction house to trade items officially instead of doing so on shady websites.

But it's still exactly. The. Same.

[Dhurn]

The way loot works is exactly how it worked in Diablo 2.

Exactly the same.

Exactly.

It's just now we have an auction house to trade items officially instead of doing so on shady websites.

But it's still exactly. The. Same.

It's far from exactly the same. In D2 you could find a ring or gloves (Soj, Magefist) off NM Andariel that you could viably use for the rest of the game. Have you tried finding an item off NM Butcher that is anywhere near being worthy of Inferno? you can't. The notion of lower level items with good mods trumping higher level items and being useful throughout the game is gone.

In D2, the best way to progress was to MF for upgrades, or trade your way up because good items for high level builds dropped throughout the game. In D3, the best way to progress is to stack gold find and save up for gear with worthy stats off the AH. This is because the chances of finding something good enough for Inferno from even Hell Azmo or Diablo with 5 stack NV are astronomically small. If it is harder to find great items it creates a system where you are strongly encouraged to use the AH to progress further.

There is no question the AH came into the equation when they were creating the loot system. Bashiok said it did, this isn't even an opinion, it's just how it was done.

"The auction house obviously provides an incredible service to allow for very easy trades between characters, and essentially blows out the wide range of items you could have available to you at any one time. So, in fact, the AH has to be a factor in how we drop items. On one hand you have a huge benefit because you can buy and sell items very easily, as opposed to having to post up WTS threads in the old USEast trading forums, but on the other end it does impact the item pool economy with the inherent ease at which you can trade items. If the AH existed but wasn't a factor at all into how items dropped/rolled, the economy would be completely tanked within a matter of weeks."

-Bashiok

[Hoticehunter]

...that being said, if I happened to find an awesome as hell well-itemized weapon for a particular class I think I would much prefer to sell it for say 50 bucks for someone over a pile of gold.

I really doubt amazing inferno weapons will sell for more than $5 a pop. 50? You're dreaming. It would have to be the most perfectly itemized weapon possible, and even then it would be a hard sell at that price.

And I doubt any items from hell or below will sell on the RMAH at all.

[Orange Joe]

I really doubt amazing inferno weapons will sell for more than $5 a pop. 50? You're dreaming. It would have to be the most perfectly itemized weapon possible, and even then it would be a hard sell at that price.

And I doubt any items from hell or below will sell on the RMAH at all.

"awesome AS hell" not "awesome FROM hell"

[LordDios]

items will not sell for 50 dollars each because the amount of epople willing to pay that kind of money for in game items is so limited . . most items will go for 2-3 dollars at best

[Fencers]

well firstly the online thing to play, pretty much pushes everyone into an easily accessible AH

the archaic loot system - while "a diablo thing" .. it just feels so much worse when you're in Hell/Inferno because there's no minimum level of stats, thus a level 60 armour piece could theoretically give +1 intellect as it's only stat - just feels so dumb personally.

the fact that your chars share stash/gold so you can buy a RMAH weapon and 'pass it down'.

This doesn't make any sense. The random loot system & itemization is one of the key aspects to an ARPG. It's central to the design as is grinding. That is suppose to be the appeal of Diablo, and these sort of games; YEARS long grinding.

The people selling awesome drops in the AH [RMT isn't even functioning yet...] currently are just lucky players. Same as Diablo 2 where the black market was main reason you played it pass the first 3 years. High end D2 was bot farming, ladders and Jsp trading.

I got a Windforce once. It was awesome!

Blizz took the loot pinata off the bosses and made trading less shadowy than trading paypal & 'forum gold'.

Don't see either of those moves Blizz made as bad changes or pushing the RMT AH.



Shared stash has been in the genre for a long time now as well. Many ARPG vets enjoy.

[Lucifer Morningstar]

As much as I am willing to pay 50 bucks for a perfectly itemized piece of gear, I still think that's a lot of money for 1 peice. You are talking about more than 550 bucks for a good set. Now if you count a 1500 DPS weapon with perfect stats then lol... People are already idiotically pricing weapons with 950+ as 2/3/4/5 million / 14 million for 1200 weapon. I think with the RMAH those items are going to be listed at 100 bucks :/
At least that is what I am afraid of.

[Deleted]

yes grinding is fine, but grinding isn't fine when you could theoretically -never- see an item with more than +1 intellect. the way i would've designed it is that any piece of gear will have at least 1 attribute equal in value to your level, so that while levelling you always have something 'possibly worthwhile' that can drop. a 60 value of stat at level 60 isnt even "good" - if anything it's bad, but it's sure as hell better than getting +1/+2 which is entirely possible.

[Fencers]

yes grinding is fine, but grinding isn't fine when you could theoretically -never- see an item with more than +1 intellect. the way i would've designed it is that any piece of gear will have at least 1 attribute equal in value to your level, so that while levelling you always have something 'possibly worthwhile' that can drop. a 60 value of stat at level 60 isnt even "good" - if anything it's bad, but it's sure as hell better than getting +1/+2 which is entirely possible.

Oh yea, I think drops can be "smarter". For sure.

But wouldn't that person in the AH selling the 9001 Int helm just have been supremely lucky? I don't see how luck forces the issue of RMT any more than it did in D2.

Some items in D2 were like 1 in 2000, 1 in 10000, etc.

[tjanson]

I really doubt amazing inferno weapons will sell for more than $5 a pop. 50? You're dreaming. It would have to be the most perfectly itemized weapon possible, and even then it would be a hard sell at that price.

And I doubt any items from hell or below will sell on the RMAH at all.

I find this amusing because of the sheer amount of money people spend on things like non-combat pets and mounts in WoW. I think you're vastly underestimating the amount of money your average adult gamer will spend on things like this. I guess we'll see, won't we?

[Fencers]

I was just browsing an auction this morning where the bids for a unique ring in Diablo 2 was up to about $8 or so on softcore.

$8 for a minor ring in a "dead" game... yea, people will shell out much more in D3 RMT AH.

D2->D3->D4, grinding 'dem stats for decades.

[Deleted]

Its safe to say that you are right and its a damn shame!

The way of loot and farming in D3 is randomized to the point of insanity. You will be forced to use the RMAH one way or the other, if you ever want the really good stuff.

Its randomized to the point of Diablo 2 and Diablo 1 which didn't have any AH at all and people still managed to play them just fine. So your argument falls kind of flat there.

[Bombkirby]

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaa? I think the voice acting is brilliant, and most people I've spoken to have agreed with me, haven't heard anyone complaining about that so far...

I've noticed many many many people are far too spoiled when it comes to voice acting. There's some unbearable examples I could name... examples so bad that they make it nearly impossible to play said games without muting it.

-------------------------

I don't see the problem if the game is designed to encourage the RMAH. It'd be bad design if it didn't... they'd be setting it up to fail.

[lockedout]

my inventory is full.. cause nobody will buy my crap on the gold ah.. why in the name of @#$% would I expect anyone to buy the same crap on the RMAH?

Full of end game legendaries?

[GrieverXIII]

Its designed around trading, wich is a core mechanic of the Diablo serie since the begining.

RMAH is just there because someone HAD to provide that kind of service, if Blizzard didn't do it, some shady 3rd party websites would had done it.

[Squishy Tia]

What makes the game feel designed around the AH (either type) is the fact that no matter where you are in the game other than Inferno, the loot drops for your "level appropriate" area are consistently ten levels below your character's level and thus not worth putting on. The only way I've found a single upgrade for myself, ever, so far is to use the AH. The drops in any given zone aren't even close to level appropriate. They're "level appropriate" if you just rush through the content with a power leveler, but a) odds are you'll die left and right that way and b) that isn't really where the fun in Diablo lies.

Add to it that you have crafting costs, both JC and BS that are astronomically high (and require you to get loot from those level appropriate places to DE...er, I mean Salvage first, and the AH quickly becomes the best route, despite player greed and the already over-inflated economy. Add to even that the fact that the crafting abilities are abysmal across weapon and armor types and it really makes it look like Blizzard spent six years resting on WoW's laurels. Example: I have a demon hunter. Though I normally prefer 2H Crossbows, I will go for a normal bow if it's an upgrade. Well, I can't craft a normal bow other than the Apprentice one at the moment (BS LV 7). That's all that's offered. I can't craft an appropriate (Hell) level crossbow yet (will I ever get to?) since the last one I can craft is for LV 42ish. Even the hand crossbows are LV 42ish. And to train the BS further is 100k gold per level plus the tomes I've farmed up, which then eats up all of my tomes for crafting.

The entire loot and crafing system seems designed and revolves around the "chicken and the egg" paradox where you have to be about ten levels higher in area difficulty to get gear you need now because the drops in the area you're in now are designed for people ten levels below you.

It all just plain sucks. I don't feel like I'm exploring for gear to upgrade myself with, I feel like I'm exploring/crafting gear for sale on the AH to "save up" for enough to buy the next upgrade for myself. And the fact that I have to buy my upgrades to feel like I'm doing more than just tickling the mobs (because without the AH bought gear I do 1/10th the damage I'm doing now) just comes off as a really poor and lazy design.

I think that explains just why this game feels so tied to the AH/RMAH.

[Wilian]

The drops in any given zone aren't even close to level appropriate. They're "level appropriate" if you just rush through the content with a power leveler,

No they aren't, you can't just rush and enter Hell before hitting 50 if I remember right, and the drops in Hell are 43-46 (Atleast in first two acts) <.<

[rhorle]

I have fairly decent equipment for someone who only really farms act 1 all day long, but I have to admit that I am not wearing a single item that I personally looted.

With this in mind, it makes me feel like the Auction House is critical to my character's progression. It is too early to say yet, but if three weeks after the RMAH is released.. if the only upgrades I can get are exclusively listed on the RMAH I will likely be pretty irritated. Since gearing my character seems virtually impossible from solely looting equipment the idea of being forced to buy items with real life money would feel way too "pay to win" for me. Granted, this hasn't happened, and hopefully / likely won't happen. But I suppose it is entirely possible.

On the flip side I'm in act 2 of hell (doing act 1 for easier XP) and I'm only using one item I bought from the AH. A weapon and will use a legendary I bought once I hit 56. You aren't forced to buy any items to play D3. Buying items for real money or Gold simply speeds the process up. It doesn't change anything about the game at all since all items are player generated and require it to have dropped for some one. Trading happened in Diablo 2 (both for gold/items and real world money). The AH stream lines the process and allows for Blizzard to remove gold while allowing for easy, safe, and secure transactions between its players. If you want you can do it the old fashioned way and trade items and gold in games.

Its funny that you seem to dislike the AH but will get angry when you can't get the items you want off of the AH. Isn't that a double standard? Its fine when it serves you, but when it won't its bad? If you don't want to pay for the items then go play the game and kill elites to find those items or find items to sell. Then use the money you earned off your own items to purchase the stuff you want.

---------- Post added 2012-05-27 at 02:40 AM ----------

jersovic said it in a much clearer way than i did.

people wont use the normal AH for level 60 inferno items, they'll use the RMAH and the sucky thing about Inferno is that you need inferno items to compete in inferno

especially if you're behind the curve (like i am) due to exams or whatever.

So because you don't have the time to do it yourself, its bad that you could potentially skip ahead through the AH? If you don't want to buy something with the Virtual Wallet then run the game to get there and sell some stuff you find. It costs nothing to post an item to the RMAH. So run the game, get drops, and post stuff like everyone else.

Nothing is stopping you and being behind the curve won't hurt you at all. Just work your way there. This sounds more like you are complaining that you won't be able to quickly make a profit at the RMAH because you aren't 60 and geared like others are.

---------- Post added 2012-05-27 at 02:42 AM ----------

This could potentially screw over new players who won't be able to progress since they joined after the RMAH went live.

So what is stopping them from doing it the way everyone else did before the RMAH? You know actually playing for drops?. Not to mention they can post things for gold and then sell that gold to earn Battle.net Bucks to then buy the items. The RMAH doesn't stop items from being gained at all. Stop acting like it will be the only way.

[Duskmourne]

Back in Diablo 2, good loot was hard as hell to find. Back then, the primary way many people aquired gear was either d2jsp or sites like d2items. At d2items you paid real world money for diablo loot. It worked wonders, and people made a ton of money off it. Sure, a lot of people relied on their own drops, and others relied on their drops + trading with other players, but still, many many people used d2jsp and direct buy sites.

Blizzard didn't get any of that action.

They could't really fight it either.

Embracing the concept of selling items for real world money is brilliant. No matter what conspiracies you come up with, the truth is that loot drops were ridiculous and random in both diablo 2 and diablo three. Loot drops don't really feel any different to me. The only difference is that blizzard is wise enough to realize that people will sell items for real world money, and instead of pointlessly fighting against it, they are embracing it.

Edit: If there is any conspiracy going on in Diablo 3 - it's that the items required to truly allow your characters to bloom in inferno do not yet exist. Items that would allow you to dominate as a melee dps without fear of dying in 3 seconds, items that would let a witch doctor pet tank in inferno act 4... There will eventually be items like these added to the game. The real conspiracy is that endgame is a problem that doesn't have all the correct solutions (items).

Bliz is going to eventually release godly legendaries that will open up more possibilities to your character, and they will be a driving force in motivating people to play the game. Much like the uber rune words were in diablo 2.