MMO-Champion Ultimate Showdown Match 9: Sauron vs. Optimus Prime

[Pendulous]

Brackets located here

Match 9 features Sauron





Sauron is the main antagonist in the Lord of the Rings series. Sauron is notable in that he never directly appears during the events of the trilogy. Nowhere is any detailed description given of what he looks like, other than in vague terms.

In the Silmarillion, Sauron is described as being a shape changer, and took many forms, including that of a serpent, a vampire, and a great wolf. After Morgoth's fall, Sauron appeared in fair form as Annatar, the Lord of Gifts, and maintained this appearance until the fall of Numenor, in which he was unable to ever take fair form ever again. Sauron's chief ability, deception, tricked the elves into creating the Rings of Power, and leading the Númenóreans into their own destruction under promises of eternal life. The extent, nature, and specifics of Sauron's power are largely left to the imagination. Like his master Morgoth, he is capable of altering the physical substance of the world around him by mere effort of will.

Versus Optimus Prime


Optimus Prime is the leader of the Autobot forces in the Transformers series. He is depicted as a brave, powerful, wise and compassionate leader who puts his talent to use improving the universe around him. Optimus is portrayed as having a strong sense of justice and righteousness and has dedicated himself to the protection of all life. On the battlefield, there are few who rival Optimus Prime's prowess. He is easily the strongest of any Autobot his size, and his ion blaster and his energon-axe are deadly weapons. Prime carries the Matrix of Leadership, a conduit for the power of Primus, the creator-god of the Transformers, serving as a means of access to the Allspark, the "afterlife" of the Transformer race, through which it can either bestow new Transformer life, or provide its wielder with a means of communicating with the deceased leaders who have come before them.

[Zoma]

To me, it seems like an easy Sauron win, but my knowledge of either character is low, so I'm going to wait until someone can give me a better idea of their powers before voting.

[Ace192]

Have to say Sauron just because Optimus Prime probably wouldn't even get to reach him before he's poofed out of existance.

Off Topic: Also, some of these matches are just plain bad. This isn't even a fair match. Like Link vs. Goku is just wrong.

[OrcsRLame]

Well, this fight would depend a lot on what version of Sauron is used. Tolkien believed that evil is inherently self destructive, and as such all evil characters in his setting weaken over time. And Sauron is over 40,000 years old. Sauron is a Maia, which is a subspecies of the Ainur, a species of gods made by Eru Iluvatar to help with the creation and governance of the universe and Arda specifically. It was their music that created the world. The Maiar are the lesser Ainur, while the Valar are the greater Ainur.

When Sauron was first created he was the most powerful of the Maiar. In fact, he was so strong he could even fight evenly against a Vala despite his obvious disadvantage. Both the Maiar and the Valar have the power to alter reality. A single Vala was able to make the Dwarves by himself, though they were initially flawed. So that should give you some idea of the limits of his true powers.

As mentioned, Sauron is a shapeshifter. He is also the master of fire, allowing him to forge things that other beings could only dream of. If it was Optimus Prime vs original Sauron, it'd be no contest. He could conjure fire as hot as the Sun right on top of Optimus Prime. To give you an idea, the Balrog seen in the movies is a lesser Maia, not even one of the original Ainur that created the universe. It should also be noted that Sauron is rather difficult to kill. Destroying his body isn't enough. In fact, he doesn't even die at the end of LOTR when the ring is destroyed. He comes back for Dagor Dagorath, the final battle of existence. His fate after that is unknown, but it's assumed Eru Iluvatar unmakes him when or shortly before he makes the second Arda.

I've read up a LOT on Optimus Prime, and while he is a powerful character, I just don't see how he can win this fight.

This is Sauron as he looked during the First Age. If I recall my LOTR time line correctly, he was over 10,000 years old at this point.



---------- Post added 2012-05-31 at 06:41 PM ----------

To me, it seems like an easy Sauron win, but my knowledge of either character is low, so I'm going to wait until someone can give me a better idea of their powers before voting.

See my post for Sauron powers. Optimus basically has a really big gun and an axe. He also has very strong will and increased physical power due to the Matrix of Leadership. He's also died more than once. One problem with Sauron's powers, like many competitors in this tournament, is that they're very abstract. His limits are almost entirely unknown.

[Korrina]

If it was a duel of just physical form vs physical form, I think Optimus might win. But overall, with nothing held back, Sauron would win. His magic is very strong and he is quite old. Optimus is old too, but not that old. And he's just a sentient machine. He can be broken down just like a biological one can be. But a spirit, or magical being? No, that requires a special touch. Or one slice of a ring finger? xD

[Temp name]

Sauron because i'm not a big fan of transformers and Sauron is just badass

[Reluctant]

Voted for optimus because i used the weak version of sauron portrait in the movie wo got his finger cut of by a regular man. Seemd more fair thenn the godmode version.

[OrcsRLame]

Voted for optimus because i used the weak version of sauron portrait in the movie wo got his finger cut of by a regular man. Seemd more fair thenn the godmode version.

Isildur was far from a normal man, and that was a magical sword. Even so, Optimus would basically have no way to kill or otherwise defeat Sauron.

[Reluctant]

Isildur was far from a normal man, and that was a magical sword. Even so, Optimus would basically have no way to kill or otherwise defeat Sauron.

Well i know very little from the lord of the rings besides seeing the movies. I reconed if a sword works Optimus should be able to blast him easily. After reading the comments here i see thats probaly not gonna happen. ( i would like sauron and gandalf more if they wheren't so powerfull as they apperently are it cheapens the story in my eyes )

[Deleted]

I don't think we can begin to discuss this fight until we establish what era of Sauron poor Optimus is up against. War of the Ring era? The Lost/Rebuilding years? The Fellowship era?

If it's this one:



Optimus doesn't stand a chance.

[OrcsRLame]

Well i know very little from the lord of the rings besides seeing the movies. I reconed if a sword works Optimus should be able to blast him easily. After reading the comments here i see thats probaly not gonna happen. ( i would like sauron and gandalf more if they wheren't so powerfull as they apperently are it cheapens the story in my eyes )

Gandalf being extremely powerful doesn't cheapen the story in my eyes. He was sent to Middle Earth as a guide to the mortals. It's his wisdom that he's valued for. When his father, Eru Iluvatar sent him to Middle Earth he made Gandalf swear that he wouldn't use his greatest powers. He's not allowed to just go in and solve everyone's problems by overpowering everything. This was part of why Gandalf initially feared Sauron so much. His father was asking him to go against a more powerful being, and NOT use his powers.

This is why you rarely see Gandalf use his powers for more than things like fireworks and smoking, and when he does use them in combat he uses them sparingly, always making sure to never go overboard. I think it makes him a more interesting character actually.

As for Sauron, you gotta figure that he was powerful at his maximum. I mean, did you think Elrond was just being a sensationalist when he said Sauron would cover the world in darkness if he regained his old powers?

[Ms Andry]

I don't think we can begin to discuss this fight until we establish what era of Sauron poor Optimus is up against. War of the Ring era? The Lost/Rebuilding years? The Fellowship era?

If it's this one:



Optimus doesn't stand a chance.

You don't think a giant robot could casually knock back a bunch of random people?

[Reluctant]

I would say he wasn't yust there as a guide he actively participates in battles ( killing the balrog was a pritty big deal ). Thenn in the battles thousands of people are dying around him and he doesn't do annything.

As a character he appears to want to help the people of middle earth but whenn it comes down to it its hit and miss sometimes he use his powers see the balrog, chasing of the nazgul, charge at helms deep those are major events so why can he use his powers there but won't do annything at other times.

If he is there to guide thats what he should do and yust watch the people solve their own problems with some guidence
him activily participating but half assed makes me lose respect for him.

Trouble getting out the right words i suck at debating.. annyways yust my 2 cents

[Deleted]

You don't think a giant robot could casually knock back a bunch of random people?

I just used that pic because of the callous badassery of that lazy mace swing.

But, the guy had all kinds of dark magics which could probably just crumple OptPrime up like an empty soda can. He could also shape-shift to look like Bumble Bee, make Prime let his guard down then shove a sword through his main processor.

I think Prime is too trusting/merciful to fight an opponent like Sauron.

[Arganis]

I guess Sauron, so long as Optimus doesn't cut off his fingers.

OT: They shoulda made Sauron seem more badass in LotR, one of my few grippes with the series. It's just hard to imagine how terrifying it would be for Sauron to have the ring again when all you have to do is cut the right finger for him to disappear for 10,000 years.

[Zaelsino]

Glory to Sauron!

[OrcsRLame]

I guess Sauron, so long as Optimus doesn't cut off his fingers.

OT: They shoulda made Sauron seem more badass in LotR, one of my few grippes with the series. It's just hard to imagine how terrifying it would be for Sauron to have the ring again when all you have to do is cut the right finger for him to disappear for 10,000 years.

... Did you just watch the movies, or have you read the books? "Just" cutting his right finger isn't as easy as it sounds. Narsil was one of only two weapons in existence, (the other one being Angrist) that was capable of hurting Sauron. Original Narsil was so powerful, it could cut anything, even Morgoth. Not to mention as Numenorean royalty Isildur was basically a demi god in his own right.

[Lightfist]

I have to say, Laurcus, you have a very impressive range when it comes to lore.

[OrcsRLame]

I have to say, Laurcus, you have a very impressive range when it comes to lore.

Thank you for the compliment good sir.

[Rigimi44]

I am a diehard Tolkien fan, and I think Laurcus has pretty much summed up all my arguments for Sauron winning. This badass was Morgoth's main guy, one of the first to be converted over, and his true powers are astonishing. I think a more interesting match up would be Gandalf (Olorin) and Sauron.