Guildwars 2 PvE Endgame Reality Check!!!

[nbm02ss]

The GW community had better not harp on me for liking wow. Otherwise I may consider not playing.

Community seems pretty rebel But that how swtor was. Lets hope it doesn't happen here.

You're going to get flamed for it in game. You really shouldn't expect anything else when it comes to online interaction with other people. Everyone has an opinion on everything and they don't mind voicing it, regardless of how well received it is or not.

[vicious796]

The only time we (those of us here at MMOC) will harp on you for liking wow is if you constantly go "this isn't like wow and I don't like it" or "wow does this better" or the like, without reasons. If you give reasons for your thoughts, you'll be fine, but mindlessly trying to compare GW2 to WoW (or any other game for that matter) is going to cause irritation and shunning.

Or trying to make threatening posts using the terms "I won't play if x, y, or z does or does not happen" as though it matters.

[DStrukt]

This isnt a "will GW2 have endgame?" thread. No this is educating people about how much endgame Guildwars 2 has to offer. Because so often I see people commenting that well Guildwars 2 doesnt have the same amount of endgame as other MMO's particully World of Warcraft. Im here to put this into a more defined perspective.

[Edit] This isnt a WoW vs GW2 thread trust me I played and Loved WoW for 6 yrs. Its just most MMO's are very simular too WoW and WoW is the most reconizable and understandable for the masses.


WoW's Gear Grind vs GW2 Titles & Priestige Items this is a small insignificant portion of my argument but ill briefly touch on the subject, There both fun...There I said my piece on that LoL.

But The real argument isnt about what system offers better rewards its about actual play time. Ill break the 2 games down into how much endgame content your allowed to do.

World of Warcraft Raids:

Number of Raids = Average 1 - 2 (at anyone time most players only run the most current raid tier to obtain more powerful gear)

Number of Difficulties = 3 (Normal / Hardcore/ Looking For Raid)

Number of times a raid can be completed = Once per week (when a raid is completed or a boss dies the raid / boss becomes locked out until the raid resets)

So WoW Players are getting Limited Endgame experience because of raid lockouts / item level gear tread milling.



Guildwars 2 Dungeons:

Number of Dungeons = 8 (3 max level and 5 lower level but none of that matters because the downscale system makes all the dungeons challenging and worthy of your time and skill, not to meantion since theres no gear grind system you run dungeons for cool esthetic skins / priestige / titles, which each dungeons have thier own unique rewards)

Number of Difficulties = 2 Story normal mode / explorable hard mode

Number of times a dungeon can be completed = AS MANY TIMES AS YOU WANT opps I typed that in caps LoL ( there are no raid lock outs)

So Guildwars 2 Players get 8 dungeons with unlimited playtime.



Conclusion WoW's gear grind / raid lockouts only give the illusion that theres alot to do at endgame. Where as Guildwars 2 none gear grind / no raid lockout system isnt an illusion it actually does provide alot of endless PvE endgame.

Both games are fun but one game truly offers more endgame and thats Guildwars 2....

LOL WTF Mate?
Ive never read so much rubbish before in my life

You say WoW only has 2 raids because according to you, thats all people do just the two raids, no other end game content.. but then when you start banging on about guild wars 2, you start talking about dungeons and even include low level dungeons to make guild wars sound better haha.
So what are you trying to say? Guild Wars 2 doesnt have any raids, only dungeons.. and you even include low level ones.

In that case lets do this fairly and equally,

WOW has maybe 50ish dungeons and maybe 20ish raids? Guild Wars 2 has 8 dungeons and 0 raids.

Nice try

[rhandric]

LOL WTF Mate?
Ive never read so much rubbish before in my life

You say WoW only has 2 raids because according to you, thats all people do just the two raids, no other end game content.. but then when you start banging on about guild wars 2, you start talking about dungeons and even include low level dungeons to make guild wars sound better haha.
So what are you trying to say? Guild Wars 2 doesnt have any raids, only dungeons.. and you even include low level ones.

In that case lets do this fairly and equally,

WOW has maybe 50ish dungeons and maybe 20ish raids? Guild Wars 2 has 8 dungeons as you say.

Nice try

If you actually read the thread, or knew anything about GW2, you'd know that, due to downscaling and the loot system, all 8 (32) GW2 dungeons are relevant (challenging, rewarding), while in WoW, only the latest expansion at the most is relevant, and usually only the latest patch (YMMV)

[Bahska]

Guildwars 2 none gear grind / no raid lockout system isn't an illusion it actually does provide a lot of endless PvE endgame.

Well GW2 doesn't have raids so it wouldn't need raid lockouts.

So Guildwars 2 Players get 8 dungeons with unlimited playtime.

How long until the majority of people get bored of those dungeons especially when they realize there getting gear for the "Pretty aspect" not to progress there toon though?

After you get your gear and get bored of those dungeons there isn't a lot left except pvp which i agree the server vs server stuff is cool but not everyone likes pvp.

For me the lack of end game content i.e. raids and the fact your forced into questing (Yes 'dynamic' events are still just quests) to gain talent point's is what put me off of this game.
That was the big reason i stayed away from SW:Tor i dislike questing, i would rather level in other ways, i don't wanna be forced into it.
I will if i have to say for a enchant or something but i wont play a game that's solely based around questing.
I know im probably in the minority on the questing reason but that is what i look for in a MMO. Good raiding and not being forced to play a aspect of the game i dislike.

[DStrukt]

I read the thread, and I am in the GW2 beta. Just been playing it and I think the game is a complete mess atm actually

[Deleted]

You made a lot of grammar errors OP. I don't want to be a douche but I feel that I really should point that out as it's making it really hard for me to read your post and take you seriously.

I advise you check out at least one of the links below. I think they'll help you with your grammar errors.

http://www.fourmilab.ch/documents/apostrophe/
http://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/apostro.asp

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/misspelling
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/apostrophe

Some words that aren't mentioned in these articles that you misspelled: particularly, similar, to, recognizable, prestige, LoL=League of Legends in internet "slang" (but i'll assume you meant lol), (what system offers better rewards) which system..., mention, aesthetic, whereas.

I'm not trying to appear as some sort of self-declared language guru or anything. I'm not that brilliant either to be honest so please don't take this as a personal offense. I make mistakes too but I tend to correct them if I learn of them.

The reason I posted this was because your post was literally hard to read and while people in this thread seem very understanding, that is many times not the case on other forums or in any kind of formal letters. Not to mention that a nicely written post will usually spur a nicer conversation rather than pointless bickering. It also shows how much you care.


On topic: WoW's lockout periods can be excused because they are needed for raid progression. If raids reset every day people would never be able to progress to the end of it. On the other hand I guess they could just implement some sort of a raid extension manager that would let raid leaders lock the raid for up to two weeks or until they finish it. GW's dungeons however, can all be completed in a few hours, I believe. I'm not 100% sure of it but I've been told so from several sources.

So if i'm correct you're more or less comparing raids with dungeons, which is kind of pointless.

[Deleted]

they will add new dungeons also. Its not 8 dungeons forever.

[Barcasaur]

I can run dungeons infinitely on WoW aswell. What is your point?

I think his point is you have fun doing it in guild wars 2, i mean............ WUT

[Larynx]

I can run dungeons infinitely on WoW aswell. What is your point?

WoW dungeons aren't endgame content.

[Deleted]

WOW has maybe 50ish dungeons and maybe 20ish raids? Guild Wars 2 has 8 dungeons and 0 raids.

WoW has 2 raids and 3 dungeons that provide anything above faceroll challenge for people in 378+ gear.

GW has 6-8 explorable dungeons (18-24 paths), and lots of open world content that should provide above faceroll challenge. The reason I am saying 6-8 dungeons is because I realize that level 80s will have a trait advantage when downscaled to dungeons like explorable catacombs. But really, I don't think 45 (80-35) levels of traits will make things facerollable from what I have seen so far, so 8 is probably the safest bet.

[Newbryn]

Yeah, it's gonna depend heavily on your raid group. When I played, we did the "Clear in one night, everyone go take the week off." stuff, but other guilds at the same time would still be working on heroic modes, farming some normals, doing dungeons together for valor points, hitting LFR together, etc.

Lots of different perspectives in the mix. =D

Seems people are hellbent on comparing swotor with guild wars 2 in terms of design philosophy which is just plain wrong, sure they made a story driven game but at the core it was the traditional rush to max level and raid crap, nothing new the comparison between the two is simply unfair. prolly meant to quote your previous post but w/e.

[DrakeWurrum]

WoW has 2 raids and 3 dungeons that provide anything above faceroll challenge for people in 378+ gear.

So much this.

On top of that, counting WoW has having dozens of dungeons and raids, even ignoring the fact that all but a tiny handful are not current, challenging content...
WoW has been out for 7 years, and is going on it's fourth expansion.

Compare vanilla WoW, level 60-only, launch-only content, to GW2's launch-only content that is unrestricted by level.

[leperhyena]

Greetings
Actually i am not goin for any comparison between the games & all i want to talk about is GW2 PVE Game-play..
Although i appreciate alot of the great things in the GW2 gameplay (specially PVP), i would say it badly sux in PVE.
1st of all ) as i saw in the dungeons game play movies, there is no such ROLE thingy in the party system and kinda doesnt sounds like a MMO.
I greatly admired the will to innovate the new system instead of the holy trinity and i liked the way it sound (Support-Control-Dmg) but i dont see any of those means in the party game play system of GW2. just it is like phew phew boom boom + bunch of huge spell effects which makes impossible to undrstand who is who on the battle field.
2nd ) As i observed the 1st boss of the mentioned movie above ( spider ), it compeletly lacked of tactics standing in a position and just random spawn of some little spider whithin the huge AOE spells of players blah blah... more like D3 bosses. well if all the remaining bosses will be such, then i would say ... .
Plus a facts that Designs of Mobs in the Dungeons zones is not good enough.
3rd) I read in some topics above GW2 is differ from other MMOs and have omit the repeatedly rotation spaming and have made players to use more of their own skills.. but all i saw in the movie was spaming the 1button and self heal once in while.
-------------------
Seriously we can NOT name a game MMORPG when none have defined role in multiplayer battle system and every one does on its own..
and the only reason players gather to do a dungeon will be the courage of simpling the game and achieve more XP or blah blah.
At the end as it is a B2P game definitly worth of a play specially for Imba pvp and good DEs.
But there is a fact which can not be denied, and it is GW2 isnt a decent MMORPG.

Kind Regards

[ShadowCrafter]

But there is a fact which can not be denied, and it is GW2 isnt a decent MMORPG.

Kind Regards

Neither was cataclysm, in terms of PVE endgame rift is the best by far if you looking at raids. Wow just has a lot of players that can't let go because of the vast amounts of time they have put into there chars. It's gonna be sad day for these people when sub numbers dip again after the initial MoP release and they realise there is no coming back for wow.

[Dezerte]

Guild Wars 2 doesn't have an endgame, it has an fullgame.

Seriously though, it will be interesting to see what new features we'll see. I'm one of those people who don't really view "x new raids/dungeons/zones" as meaningful content, it's just more of the same often. What I want to see is new game systems, and by that I mean things like grouping-tools and other things that enhance the core of the game.