How challenging is the PVE content going to be?

[Newbryn]

There would also be the one where lieutenant kholer pulls you in and whirlwinds you to death before you can react. and the one shot deaths from the champion spider.

[Delias]

There would also be the one where lieutenant kholer pulls you in and whirlwinds you to death before you can react. and the one shot deaths from the champion spider.

That was interruptable with stuns and whatnot.

[Malthurius]

Since gear in the game has an easy to reach power cap, high level content can't get harder in terms of gear requirement, only in execution. Because of the nature of the game's combat (damage can always be avoided, and everyone is self reliant) dying is almost always your fault, and mechanics that unavoidably kill you are broken mechanics.

I have high hopes for difficult content outside of dungeons though. Since all content is viable at max level, even level 1 content, they can easily use this as a difficulty scale for players at max level. If one wants to have a real challenge they can do the level 80 zone(s). If they can't handle that, they have lower, easier, level zones to do.

You can't outgear content because of the nature of stat scaling.

[Newbryn]

That was interruptable with stuns and whatnot.

Well if these attacks are indeed interruptable then i will shut my mouth and wait and see.

[Malthurius]

It might be worth pointing out that going into a downed state isn't considered "dead". With that in mind, it's impossible to be 1 shot... only 2 shot.

[Delias]

Well if these attacks are indeed interruptable then i will shut my mouth and wait and see.

I didn't do it myself (or seen it done, didn't actually watch the whole video), was just something Kaeyi pointed out in the comments of http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLWIFpTmRy4

[Queen of Hamsters]

I think it comes down to the individual, actually. Did I feel challenged at times in GW2? Yes of course, especially before I had gotten into the fighting style and learned about traits and skills.

Did it feel HARD? No, there have only been a few times in games where I've thought "Man this is hard", and that is:

Heroic Ragnaros, WoW.

Personal story in the cave with tons of mobs respawning very quickly and aggroing if I moved even a bit, GW2 first 24 hours into the Beta. Not sure those mobs will respawn that quickly come live though, but as a completely new player to the game it was brutal both surviving fights, not pulling other mobs, watch out for respawns and micro-manage my pet to not pull stuff.

Dat about it . I imagine there will be aspects of GW2 that are considered very hard, and others that are not, but in the end it comes down to the players.

[Fencers]

Did it feel HARD? No, there have only been a few times in games where I've thought "Man this is hard", and that is:<snip>

The expo modes are indeed, "hard". Trash is as tough as bosses to be honest. Double necro or 1/1 monk & mesmer mobs are hair pulling difficult. Only way to deal with them smartly is to literally fill each player's bar with as many stuns/kds/dazes/confuses and kite each mob away from each other.

Dat AC monk. Holy flippin' shit.

Did you play expo mode?

[Maarius]

The expo modes are indeed, "hard". Trash is as tough as bosses to be honest. Double necro or 1/1 monk & mesmer mobs are hair pulling difficult. Only way to deal with them smartly is to literally fill each player's bar with as many stuns/kds/dazes/confuses and kite each mob away from each other.

Dat AC monk. Holy flippin' shit.

Did you play expo mode?

As freaking stupid as it sounds, my worries are that the explorable mode will be too easy as a lv.80 player. This worries me more than anything, because it would mean that those dungeons are only for the few hours I'm near their level instead of months later when running the dungeon as a max. level player.

Hope they don't come and say: we have 3 lv.80 dungeons for you to play. I think it's pretty hard to balance the dungeon for lv.35 AND downscaled lv.80(->35) players. I'll keep my fingers crossed that they will succeed with that.

[Fencers]

My true level in there was 42ish. Not nearly as big a jump as an 80, but still got 1shot often. For example, 2 lovers encounter had more damage output then you could possibly avoid at times. If they were close for even a few seconds- the entire encounter space became hell on Earth instantly.

I don't think being 80 will effect things too badly.

[Fencers]

Eh, you can make anything sound silly by just oversimplifying it like that. It doesn't sound any better than the PvPers who say PvE is nothing but standing still and facerolling your keyboard until the mob hands you loot.

PVP doesn't actually get any deeper than that though. It is is essentially a gotcha game based on CDs. The only differences are when player A used his stun and when player B or C reacted and so on.

I never played a PVP match and left thinking, "Whew! That was so much a challenge!" to any greater degree than walking out of a new raid. Inherent problem with PVE is it always is the same script where challenge is often diminished over time. PVE is basically water ballet.

Chest puffing of one game mode over another is flat out nonsense based on personal stupidity.

[Delias]

Fencers isn't saying PvP is easy, she's saying it's not some huge challenge miles ahead of any challenge PvE offers.. which is what a very large amount of strictly PvP players tend to believe.

At least that's how I'm interpreting it. If I'm wrong, /shrug.

[Fencers]

Again, that's quite a bit of simplification. You can talk that way about anything and make it sound completely trivial if you have motive to do so.

"Oh, chess really isn't that deep, it's just a game about pieces. Really all it's just when player A moves a piece and how player B reacts."

Anyway, I don't think anyone is chest thumping so much as just objecting to the painting with broad strokes that's going on.

Kinda missed the point. But I don't care enough to restate it for you.

[Maarius]

My true level in there was 42ish. Not nearly as big a jump as an 80, but still got 1shot often. For example, 2 lovers encounter had more damage output then you could possibly avoid at times. If they were close for even a few seconds- the entire encounter space became hell on Earth instantly.

I don't think being 80 will effect things too badly.

that's nice to hear, thank you!

[ScottsdaleHokie]

dynamic events without alot of people are hard.

DE difficulty scales based upon the number of people participating.

[Atelniar]

I don't mind dying but I would very much like those deaths to be my fault not because of something i had no control over.

In GW2 you have more control over when and how you die than in most other MMO's currently on the market. It's the basic design of combat. Mobility in combat, evasion-button, and the choice of being ranged or melee (for many professions) with the switch of a button. All of it makes GW2 combat stand out as one of the few MMO's where increased mob health and damage is not an instant counter which requires a certain gear level (in theory).

The indication circles may need some improvements. I struggled with forseeing if red vs. white colour had anything to say about it being a friendly spell or not. And if friendly spells are even indicated through those circles. That may just be me though.

---------- Post added 2012-06-13 at 07:43 PM ----------

DE difficulty scales based upon the number of people participating.

It doesn't scale on a 1:1 basis, that much is obvious. More players always make the content far easier. How much so is hard to tell, but I also noticed some events which were way too easy and probably broken in terms of scaling.

[Deleted]

I would say I found levelling up as a Elementalist on my own a little difficult, having to kite a lot to prevent damage. Much more difficult to any other MMO especially when you are like lvl 32 and can still die with 3 mobs on you in a lvl 4 area.

[Fojos]

Because not standing in fire and killing adds is hard.

You do realise PvP is essentially scripted in a way as well, right? There's only so much you can do. Developers could easily develop the perfect npc-vp player.

Oh hey! let's bring our elitist pvp pitchforks! because we've beaten all that EZPZ content that's linear... oh wait... gw2 isn't linear at all in regards to pve.

Most people claiming stuff like Oni haven't completed any of the hard PVE-content anyway.

[Merendel]

Yeah I know about that one, I'm referring to people who were saying things like "cheap boss tactics" or "artificial difficulty". You died because you've failed.. not because "it was unavoidable" ;s.

There are a few instances of massive attacks that are not telegraphed very well that can kill you in one hit. One of the clearest open world examples is the giant attack on the town of nageling in the Diessa Plateau (char 15-25 zone) The giant has 4 primary attacks aside from direct melee. He throws a rock, he roars for a fear, a ground pound that does some damage and knocks back, and a 1 hit kill stomp. The rock is very well telegraphed although you will die if you let it hit you. The fear is prety much unavoidable but is little more than a nusance. The last 2 are the kicker though.

For the KB he rears back and stomps then punches the ground several times. Its somewhat hard to avoid all of this attack as it runs for a fairly long duration and the giant spams this attack alot. While it wont one shot you it does some damage if you dont dodge the initial spike of it and your probably going to get punted back a ways even with a dodge. The 1 hit kill Also involves him rearing back for a stomp that is almost identical to the opening of the knock back. It is just fractionally slower in the windup and the arms are held at a slightly different angle but its hard to notice these differences if your not standing back out of range watching for them. If you dont dodge as his foot comes down on this stomp and you are within a 900 attack range you are dead, its a 360 radius. Due to the speed of the attack you have at most half a second to determine if any particular stomp is a lethal one and he spams the stomp opening moves far to often to dodge them all let alone haveing anything in reserve if he decides to bolder you. This is one case where I'd call it cheep boss tactics as most of the fight ends up revolving on the boss fakeing you out with his less lethal attack before firing off his lethal one a couple times in a row.

[Deleted]

There are a few instances of massive attacks that are not telegraphed very well that can kill you in one hit. One of the clearest open world examples is the giant attack on the town of nageling in the Diessa Plateau (char 15-25 zone) The giant has 4 primary attacks aside from direct melee. He throws a rock, he roars for a fear, a ground pound that does some damage and knocks back, and a 1 hit kill stomp. The rock is very well telegraphed although you will die if you let it hit you. The fear is prety much unavoidable but is little more than a nusance. The last 2 are the kicker though.

For the KB he rears back and stomps then punches the ground several times. Its somewhat hard to avoid all of this attack as it runs for a fairly long duration and the giant spams this attack alot. While it wont one shot you it does some damage if you dont dodge the initial spike of it and your probably going to get punted back a ways even with a dodge. The 1 hit kill Also involves him rearing back for a stomp that is almost identical to the opening of the knock back. It is just fractionally slower in the windup and the arms are held at a slightly different angle but its hard to notice these differences if your not standing back out of range watching for them. If you dont dodge as his foot comes down on this stomp and you are within a 900 attack range you are dead, its a 360 radius. Due to the speed of the attack you have at most half a second to determine if any particular stomp is a lethal one and he spams the stomp opening moves far to often to dodge them all let alone haveing anything in reserve if he decides to bolder you. This is one case where I'd call it cheep boss tactics as most of the fight ends up revolving on the boss fakeing you out with his less lethal attack before firing off his lethal one a couple times in a row.

Good attempt, but not there yet. You are looking at it from your point of view only - in that case, yeah it might be near impossible to defeat him without getting killed. BUT, if you consider you team then well.. you can cut through that boss like hot knife through butter and you don't need more than 3 ppl to do it. People are still not using the combat system properly.

Everyone is trying to embrace the "no tank and healer" philosophy - and that's cool, but they are forgetting about support :P. Stability, Aegis, blind (VERY under rated), forcefields and group defensive CDs are all forgotten. It is yours and your team8s job to use them. By design, in encounter with such bosses you need to relay on your friends to drop a barrier, blind that next attack and grant Aegis.

Practice that, and I assure you, you'll never feel like "I couldn't done anything to avoid it".