Obama asserts executive privilege on Fast and Furious documents!

[Orlong]

Republicans only spouting half truths again. Quality work good man. Bet you had nothing to say about all the corruption within the Bush administration. Right wing hatred and insanity is untethered in this country. I give up.

Im pretty sure there is just as much hatred from the far left toward the republicans. Both sides are guilty of that!

[vaeevictiss]

This whole FnF thing makes me furious. I was watching the news yesterday and they were talking with Eric Holder about "making a deal". Are you serious? What he did was potentially let innocent people get murdered by forcing FFLs to ignore the laws they are required to follow to maintain their federal licence (who they also later tried to prosecute them for it lol).

They were trying to use it for another futile future attempt at disarming citizens and banning guns by saying that they all came in illegally over the border...when looky looky it was our own government pushing them.

[Slammin Shaman]

Oh please the Congress isn't going to release everything in the documents to the public after they get them. Besides if they were going to get these cartel members WHY HAVEN'T THEY ALREADY DONE SO WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR MORE DEATHS?

Because somewhere, someone in the actual action based part of the plan messed up. I assume a simple google search is too hard, but I assure you, it's there. The superfluous use of caps lock on half of your sentence is extraneous, but I'll simply explain as to why they haven't. Look at my first sentence in this post. Explanation done.

[conscript]

In this specific scenario, You think with-holding documents to this extent is intended for some other purpose other than to hide something? If not, then do you think its ok for Obama to be executing this privilege?

Not necessarily, unless there was actual risk to damaging the already in progress operation. The operation itself should never have existed and is fascinatingly stupid, but this is exactly why EP exists, to stop Congress from making political moves which would damage investigations. Bush did this and worse to stalwart largely political moves by Democrats trying to damage him. Clinton did the same thing, god knows how he even thought it would work, to keep his ass from getting potentially impeached. Obama is doing it to stop the politicking of Republicans which could potentially damage an already in progress operation. It isn't necessarily right, but this has existed since Day 1 in America and serves the purpose of preventing political opponents from trying to damage the reputation of the sitting President, VP, AG, etc. Its dumb, but it is the American government's way of life and always has been.

---------- Post added 2012-06-20 at 02:21 PM ----------

They were trying to use it for another futile future attempt at disarming citizens and banning guns by saying that they all came in illegally over the border...when looky looky it was our own government pushing them.

Since when has Fast and Furious been about banning guns in America? I always thought it was just another futile attempt at winning the War on Drugs. I really, really doubt the federal government was actively trying to create anti-gun sentiment with these actions and there is no chance in hell they are going to claim that a gun store in Maine is stocking illegal weapons shipped in from Mexico.

[Clawtastic]

Why don't they just show the documents? Can anyone give me a logical reason why they won't show the documents? If they have nothing to hide, why not just release them? I don't get it and I don't get why some liberals still support this.

Because they don't have to. What they are claiming executive privilege on are documents that circulated throughout the Justice Department regarding how they were going to respond to Congress, which is covered under Executive Privilege.

[Vutar]

That is EXACTLY what Bush and Clinton did!
George Bush first used executive privilege to deny access to documents pertaining to then AG Janet Reno.
Bush used executive privilege to deny access to documentation about the exact nature of many meetings Cheney had with private energy companies (the ones that profited off the Middle Eastern wars)
Bush refused to turn over detailed documents about meetings with Harriet Miers and Sara Taylor prior to their contempt of Congress hearings
Bush used executive privilege to cover up the friendly fire murder of Pat Tilman, a true American hero!
Bush used executive privilege to get Karl Rove off the hook for firing federal prosecutors

Clinton tried, and failed, to use executive privilege to block people testifying against him in the Lewinsky case
Clinton tried to use executive privilege to control how he would be examined in that same trial

So again, how is ANY of this unprecedented? Bush and Clinton did much, much worse with EP than Obama has done. Bush used it to keep his cronies out of jail and to keep his energy buddies making billions. Clinton used it to try and keep himself from being kicked out as President. Stop making up phony BS and ignoring history to make things fit your agenda.

Stop excusing poor presidential behavior by pointing to other presidents who did stupid things.

[Clawtastic]

typical liberal response. Lets go back 4+ years and talk about what Bush did even though it is not even remotely relevant to this discussion. Brilliant sir!

It is relevant to the discussion...See Operation Wide Receiver

[ThunderPussy]

Obama asserts executive privilege on Fast and Furious documents!!!!!

Today in an unprecedented move President Obama decided to use his Executive Privilege on the Fast and Furious documents currently being subpoenaed by Congress. The Fast an Furious scandal deals with the US illegally smuggling guns over the Mexican border which were used to kill countless number of Mexican citizens and even some Americans. The thing is the Presidents Executive Privilege can only be used to protect the president which means there is something he is hiding and doesn't want the public to know. There is something in those documents that incriminates President Obama and Attorney General Eric Holder.

In my opinion this is the most corrupt President in United States history, from the Solyndra scandal, to legalizing millions of illegals with executive power and now this. When are the American people going to catch on to the fact that this "President" is clearly corrupt and unfit to hold the office of the presidency? He tarnishes our country every moment he is still in office. This is an absolute disgrace...PEOPLE DIED BECAUSE OF THIS SCANDAL! And before people start commenting on here I am also no fan of Bush. Having said that President Obama makes Richard Nixon look like Jesus in comparison. He needs to be voted out in November. Accountability and decency needs to be returned to the oval office. Below I have provided some links from multiple sources discussing this story. I am curious what are all of your opinions on this scandal, because I am royally steamed over this?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012...gainst-holder/

http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/20/politi...html?hpt=hp_t1

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news...documents?lite

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...docs-exec-priv

The bold part made me giggle. Sorry to break it to you but politicians are liars and corrupt. I'm pretty sure it's been this way since the beginning of politicians. Frankly, a new guy isn't going to change a damn thing. I'm not entirely sure why people think someone different will EVER change the way things are.

[Baratheon]

Not necessarily, unless there was actual risk to damaging the already in progress operation. The operation itself should never have existed and is fascinatingly stupid, but this is exactly why EP exists, to stop Congress from making political moves which would damage investigations. Bush did this and worse to stalwart largely political moves by Democrats trying to damage him. Clinton did the same thing, god knows how he even thought it would work, to keep his ass from getting potentially impeached. Obama is doing it to stop the politicking of Republicans which could potentially damage an already in progress operation. It isn't necessarily right, but this has existed since Day 1 in America and serves the purpose of preventing political opponents from trying to damage the reputation of the sitting President, VP, AG, etc. Its dumb, but it is the American government's way of life and always has been.

---------- Post added 2012-06-20 at 02:21 PM ----------



Since when has Fast and Furious been about banning guns in America? I always thought it was just another futile attempt at winning the War on Drugs. I really, really doubt the federal government was actively trying to create anti-gun sentiment with these actions and there is no chance in hell they are going to claim that a gun store in Maine is stocking illegal weapons shipped in from Mexico.

How do you know this is a political move by Congress and not the Obama Administration? It can go both ways. That's your perspective and that's fine if you feel like Congress is the one being corrupt even though it seems unlikely to me.

[Maruka]

Why did i think this was about obama scoring an executive producer roll in the upcoming fast and furious 6

[atroxes]

Sometimes while you're surfing the Internet you bump into content that is so shockingly, jawdroppingly stupid, that your view of humanity is once again, redefined onto a whole new lower level.

This was one of those times.

[vaeevictiss]

Since when has Fast and Furious been about banning guns in America? I always thought it was just another futile attempt at winning the War on Drugs. I really, really doubt the federal government was actively trying to create anti-gun sentiment with these actions and there is no chance in hell they are going to claim that a gun store in Maine is stocking illegal weapons shipped in from Mexico.

You really doubt it? Of all the shit this govt does you would be willing to toss aside the idea they would use this as fodder for increasing gun control?

[Eebok]

Oh yeah because that makes it ok. He only did that for his political gain because he didn't want Marco Rubio a Republican to get the credit for authoring a bill currently going through congress to do something similar to what Obama did with his power.

Double standard much? It sounds as though you'd be fine with it if it was done by Marco Rubio but not now since Obama did it first, and he really had no choice but to do it in this way, the process of going through Congress to get it accomplished will probably fail just like countless other reasonable initiatives because nothing is getting passed through there at all nowadays.

[Tinykong]

Executive privilege is a principle that says the executive branch can’t be forced by the legislative branch to disclose confidential communications when they would harm operations.

All Obama did was use his power to keep the plan going. Disclosing information on how they plan to track weapon purchases through the Mexican Cartel to the upper echelons would kind of put a damper in that plan.

Gun walking doesn’t work; after hundreds of deaths, anti-aircraft and other military grade weapons in the hands of the cartel, nothing has changed and no high level cartel members have been arrested, or had their operations disrupted.

If Obama and his administration had no involvement in the operation, which has since ceased, why the need to suppress the documents? Sounds to me like it would be easier for him to release a redacted copy that protects the names of those involved to prove his lack of involvement and the time at which he became notified of the operation.

[Jeina]

Refusing to release documents related to an operation aimed at curbing criminal activity is not indicative of said documents containing illegal information/activities. It is highly likely that the President is protecting the identity of agents who were part of the operation and were undercover and may still be undercover.

We don't need another Valerie Plame.

[Baratheon]

Refusing to release documents related to an operation aimed at curbing criminal activity is not indicative of said documents containing illegal information/activities. It is highly likely that the President is protecting the identity of agents who were part of the operation and were undercover and may still be undercover.

We don't need another Valerie Plame.

^^^ See, this sounds more reasonable than some filth that the entirety of Congress has planned this as a political move.

[Deadvolcanoes]

This could have actually been a productive thread if the OP didnt start if off with ridiculous, untrue statements like:

Today in an unprecedented move

this is the most corrupt President in United States history

He tarnishes our country every moment he is still in office

And My personal favorite:

President Obama makes Richard Nixon look like Jesus in comparison

---------- Post added 2012-06-20 at 02:37 PM ----------

Refusing to release documents related to an operation aimed at curbing criminal activity is not indicative of said documents containing illegal information/activities. It is highly likely that the President is protecting the identity of agents who were part of the operation and were undercover and may still be undercover.

We don't need another Valerie Plame.

+1 to you sir.

[Ironhorn]

Because somewhere, someone in the actual action based part of the plan messed up. I assume a simple google search is too hard, but I assure you, it's there. The superfluous use of caps lock on half of your sentence is extraneous, but I'll simply explain as to why they haven't. Look at my first sentence in this post. Explanation done.

If the plan has already failed then we don't need to worried about screwing it up by releasing the documents. Its already too late to catch the cartels in the act we have barked, and the birds have flown.

[Deleted]

Well, of course I'm an outsider, but I do have some opinions about U.S. politics as well.

The U.S.A. has a huge problem with it's lobbies be it oil, weapons, pharmacy on the industrial side or the Christians and the Zionists on the religious/ideological side.

It is nothing new, that you can't even get near to become a president, if you don't have HUGE amounts of money, that you only get, if you please these lobbies and from what I see Obama is by far the most liberal president the U.S.A. had. (Ok, only know the exact history of the last decade).

Setting a deadline to Afghanistan and Iraque made him an opponent of the weapon and oil industry, preventing a war against Iran was opposed by the zionistic lobby (I'm, really not someone who falls for conspiracies, but that the U.S.A. is really in favour to the country Israel is not really a secret). Then he tried to reform the Health Care System annoying the pharmacy lobby. And now he also angered the fundamental Christians with his open support for gay marriage anf the end of Don't Ask, Don't Tell.
Also the last actions regaring illegal immigrants (every American except the Native ones have ancestors who were actually illegal immigrants ;-) So the hypocrisy regarding that topic is hilarious). Then he at least tried to solve human rights problems like Guantanamo Bay, but as he is (thankfull of course) no dictator and hasn't any power without the approval of the congress, his hands were at least partially bound.

The only critics that I have are the human rights violations (shooting people all over the world without court decision) and the financial politics (throwing more money around for utopical endless increase of economy; though that is not only a problem of the U.S.A ;-) ).

So for the global development (and also for the average U.S. citizen, if they would be a little bit more comfortable with changes) he was a really good president and I really hope that the citizens of the U.S. give him another chance.

All in all Obama is really humanistic and he has to be as he won the Nobel Price for Peace and set his signature under their "constitution", which emphasizes human rights.

So he actually was uncomfortable for every of his sponsors. And he had to make huge compromises to be able to do anything at all, as the opposition blocks every reform on principle. I don't see how he is corrupt.

[Tinykong]

Refusing to release documents related to an operation aimed at curbing criminal activity is not indicative of said documents containing illegal information/activities. It is highly likely that the President is protecting the identity of agents who were part of the operation and were undercover and may still be undercover.

We don't need another Valerie Plame.

Redacting the documents would protect everyone who needs to be protected, and reveal the administrations involvement, without requiring the sweeping refusal to comply with the subpeona. If they have nothing to hide, that would clear everything up and answer the questions presented by the committee.