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  1. #1

    MoP Epic Gems - Blizzard's solution to primary color stacking?

    In recent builds, people have dug up new epic gems which are different gem names from the already previously data-mined superior quality gems. What is even more intriguing about these gems is the stats they give.

    In Cataclysm, a primary stat gem would look like this:


    Brilliant Inferno Ruby: +40 Intellect

    A hybrid Purple, Green and Orange colored) stat gem would look like this:

    Purified Demonseye: +20 Intellect +20 Spirit

    However, in Mists of Pandaria the hybrid gems stat allotment seems to shift. This makes it so you actually get more bang for your buck (number wise, at any rate) from using a hybrid gem than you would from using a primary gem.

    In Mists of Pandaria, a primary stat gem of Superior quality looks like this:

    Brilliant Primordial Ruby: +160 Intellect

    A hybrid gem of the same quality (superior) looks like this:

    Purified Imperial Amethyst: +80 Intellect +160 Spirit


    Effectively, you have the choice of having 160 of one primary stat, or having mix of two stats which equals 240. Obviously, in Cataclysm, primary stats reign supreme, but in MoP things might begin to change. Perhaps Blizzard is trying to push us in a direction where we actually match ALL of our gem sockets? Perhaps this is their solution to red gems being so high priced with almost all other gem colors being dirt cheap?

    Now onto Yellow and Blue gems. These two colors are currently giving TWICE the stat allotment of the red gems. Meaning, while a Primordial Ruby would give +160 Intellect, a Sparkling River's Heart gives +320 Spirit and a Quick Sun's Radiance gives +320 Haste.

    One final interesting fact is that Blizzard is also introducing EPIC gems from the get-go. However, you can ONLY get epic quality gems in the following colors: Purple, Green and Orange.

    This means, during tier 14, you can have 1 superior quality gem red gem which gives you +160 in a primary stat, OR, if you can get an epic quality gem, you can have the following stats instead:

    Purified Zyanite: +100 Intellect +200 Spirit

    Thoughts? This could effectively keep people from stacking red gems. But on the reverse, it could also mean people will begin stacking the epic hybrid gems instead, effectively rendering the idea of gem balancing moot. What would you like to see with the gems in MoP?
    Last edited by Servasus; 2012-06-26 at 02:57 PM.

  2. #2
    Bloodsail Admiral Tsundere Pejo's Avatar
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    You have to remember that secondary stats have been adjusted so you feel weaker after 85. It takes more of a secondary stat to gain the same benefit once you past level 85, thus it is probably just a bit stronger than before. I'll pull up some examples but at work, so may be slow in edit.

    Edit: If we compare these links, http://www.wowhead.com/item=56417 and http://mop.wowhead.com/item=81188 , you'll notice 162 haste netted you 1.27% haste at 85 while 600 at level 90 only gives you 1.2%. This means that at 90, haste is only worth .002% per point while each point was worth .007% per point at 85.

    I'm hoping it will solve the issue, but I will have to see how much primary stats have been decreased in effectiveness to really gauge it. All gems should be viable versus red.
    Last edited by Tsundere Pejo; 2012-06-26 at 03:00 PM.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Pejo View Post
    You have to remember that secondary stats have been adjusted so you feel weaker after 85. It takes more of a secondary stat to gain the same benefit once you past level 85, thus it is probably just a bit stronger than before. I'll pull up some examples but at work, so may be slow in edit.
    Doesnt really change much, as int will lose it's value as well.

    The point is that secondary stats have half the 'statcost' of primary, while on live they have the same. As the OP mentioned, on live youre choosing between 1 int/str/ag vs 1 haste/mast/crit/hit/spirit/exp/.... So unless they make secondary stats even more crap compared to primary (as they are on live) then this change will hopefully make hybrid gems optimal depending on socket.

  4. #4
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    Interesting... We'll have to see how this works out. I'm a tad worried this will just lead to Secondary stacking.
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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    Interesting... We'll have to see how this works out. I'm a tad worried this will just lead to Secondary stacking.
    Especially with Spirit being so valuable come MoP for healers. I'm almost thinking healers are going to be stacking +320 spirit gems ALL the way.

  6. #6
    Brewmaster smegdawg's Avatar
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    Wait, so I won't have stacks upon stacks of useless gems sitting on my alts in mists???

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Servasus View Post
    Especially with Spirit being so valuable come MoP for healers. I'm almost thinking healers are going to be stacking +320 spirit gems ALL the way.
    That's relative. You still want spellpower, which you don't get from spirit.

    You might stack full spirit, it will give you more regen, but if ur heals are hitting quite a bit less it will keep it even.

    As a healer I would stack : red = intellect / blue = intellect + spirit and yellow = int + mastery/haste.

    I doubt any sane healer would stack full spirit.

  8. #8
    This is certainly a better solution than the stupid crap they tried to pull with meta dps gems at Cata launch. Remember "must have more blue gems than red gems"??? Yeah...
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  9. #9
    The Patient Mizzow's Avatar
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    I believe its they're plan to make secondary starts feel well, "Secondary",

    So it above makes sense after you take into context of the importance of primary over secondary,

    I'd like to see how this will turn out, very interesting,

    I'm very OCD with the gem colour system anyway, so I'll be using orange/purple in all yellow/blue slots just cause I like to :P
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  10. #10
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    To be honest, if intellect isn't increasing my mana pool*, then I'll just be stacking secondaries anyhow. Healing numbers in themselves are rarely an issue, but longevity usually is. Haste and regen will far outweigh intellect for overall throughput without the ability to bloat your mana pool like you could in expansions prior.

    * = While I was doing beta testing, I had not noticed any intellect increase or decrease actually giving me more or less mana. Perhaps if they are doing so, it is a very minimal amount, of which case my point still stands.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by belgicanofl View Post
    That's relative. You still want spellpower, which you don't get from spirit.

    You might stack full spirit, it will give you more regen, but if ur heals are hitting quite a bit less it will keep it even.

    As a healer I would stack : red = intellect / blue = intellect + spirit and yellow = int + mastery/haste.

    I doubt any sane healer would stack full spirit.
    Sounds like you don't play a hpally.

  12. #12
    I just REALLY hope they even out the colours this time.

    It was kinda stupid that by the end of cata, red gems were about triple the price of everything else and some gems u were practically better off vendoring.

  13. #13
    I might see red gems losing their special status for healers at least, because they're removing mana gained from int. Time will tell if that holds true for DPS as well. I'd sure like to see gems other than reds being used more often. But I can definately see yellow sockets being worthwhile to go for with the new epic gems. 200crit/haste/mastery + whatever socket bonus in exchange for 60 primary stat is a good deal. Now I just hope those epic gems are transmutable and you don't have to rely on RNG to get them.
    All in all I like the changes they're implementing in MoP. Having red gems be the best option by far for all DPS and healers (to the point where you only go for socket bonusses if you'd get free stats) was stupid. It made all other pure and green gems pointless, with the exception for tanks. I vendored most blue and yellow gems I found, the Resi/Stamina/Mastery cuts would occasionally go over vendor value on my realm, so managed to sell a handful.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pejo View Post
    You have to remember that secondary stats have been adjusted so you feel weaker after 85. It takes more of a secondary stat to gain the same benefit once you past level 85, thus it is probably just a bit stronger than before. I'll pull up some examples but at work, so may be slow in edit.
    That's been the case with every expansion though. You needed ~46 crit rating for 1% crit in Wrath, in Cata you need ~179 crit rating to get 1% more crit. While levelling my hunter (with around 50% crit rating at 80) in Cata, my crit chance took a nosedive everytime I levelled.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Pejo View Post
    You have to remember that secondary stats have been adjusted so you feel weaker after 85. It takes more of a secondary stat to gain the same benefit once you past level 85, thus it is probably just a bit stronger than before. I'll pull up some examples but at work, so may be slow in edit.

    Edit: If we compare these links, http://www.wowhead.com/item=56417 and http://mop.wowhead.com/item=81188 , you'll notice 162 haste netted you 1.27% haste at 85 while 600 at level 90 only gives you 1.2%. This means that at 90, haste is only worth .002% per point while each point was worth .007% per point at 85.

    I'm hoping it will solve the issue, but I will have to see how much primary stats have been decreased in effectiveness to really gauge it. All gems should be viable versus red.
    But what you're not keeping in mind is that the haste you get on an MoP gem is quadruple or more of what you would get on a Cata gem.

    At level 85, +40 Haste gives .28% haste. At level 90, +320 haste (the yellow MoP gem) gives .64% haste. This means relatively, MoP secondary stats on gems are worth more than twice as much as Cata gems.

  15. #15
    The gems giving 320 stats are the jc only gems not something you can put in every spot.

  16. #16
    I've been saying this for weeks. it'll solve all problems. Get rid of main stats on gems. If it's all secondary stats on gems, then people can "choose" what they want, instead of being forced into one gem. And sure there'll still be min maxing, but different colors would be good or bad for different classes/specs making more gems viable options and give jewelcrafters more options as well. It's not even a hard implementation.
    Last edited by beanman12345; 2012-06-27 at 12:24 AM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Iracor View Post
    Sounds like you don't play a hpally.
    I play every healer class in-game. I wouldn't stack full spirit on either of them.

  18. #18
    502 haste with level 90 are 1%, just incase anyone wanted to know

  19. #19
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by belgicanofl View Post
    I play every healer class in-game. I wouldn't stack full spirit on either of them.
    Given the fact mana is set now, I'd much rather stack spirit for long fights instead of SP for big heals.
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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by wow View Post
    The gems giving 320 stats are the jc only gems not something you can put in every spot.
    That's incorrect. The gems giving +320 secondary stats are the Blue and Yellow colored superior quality gems. They have nothing to do with being a jewelcrafter other than you need Jewelcrafting to cut them. The JC only blue and yellow colored gems give +480 to a secondary stat.

    Here's proof:

    http://mop.wowhead.com/item=83149

    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    Given the fact mana is set now, I'd much rather stack spirit for long fights instead of SP for big heals.
    Especially as a raid healer.

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