1. #821
    Quote Originally Posted by mels View Post
    Question, I currently have Heroic Starshatter and Normal Shin'Ka, Execution of Dominion WITH Legendary Gem, is Heroic Starshatter still better than Normal Sha of Fear weapon even with a gem?
    I would like to know this as well since I am in the same situation and can only afford 1 dancing steel enchant.

  2. #822
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balhale View Post
    There is no set % haste to stop gemming haste at - it depends on your strength/weapon/trinkets/other secondaries.
    Well we are gemming for haste because the value of strength is not yet at double of that of haste (Since gems give twice as much haste than str), right? So shouldn't reaching a certain % of haste degrade its value in terms of strength? I've seen a few sims of different people, and they each had different ratios of haste-strength. Some had ratios with which strength was double the value, so wouldnt that person not gem for haste?

    My thoughts would be that after a certain, uh, "plateau" lets call it; haste's value decreases somewhat "exponentially", dependant on your current value. Other than of course haste proc/on-use trinkets and maybe a specific weapon, don't other variables come into play here?


    Quote Originally Posted by JeanJacket View Post
    I would like to know this as well since I am in the same situation and can only afford 1 dancing steel enchant.
    Look at the strength gains, and compare the two weapon damages. Starshatter is good for the expertise gain, but a Normal Shin'Ka might pull ahead given its superiority through strength (mainly because of the legendary gem). If you're currently struggling with reaching the exp cap, Starshatter may be better just to reach that cap.
    Last edited by Saferis; 2012-11-21 at 11:11 PM.

  3. #823
    Hello Anaxie,

    was wondering since the start of t14 since haste has such value over str isnt it worth considering using tier shoulders and either nullification greathelm or the legs from will of the emperor even if they are lower ilvl but higher haste value in our bis list?

    Does anyone have a character profile with bis gear and reforge just to see the stats thanks

  4. #824
    Banned anaxie's Avatar
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    i suggest using Tier shoulders IF you own a Heroic Kings' guard chestplate. You should be able to get all heroic items except H:E: neck, Dread shadow ring, H:T15Helm, H:T15 Shoulders and hit overcapping should not be an issue even for draenei.
    When you decide to take the Dread ring and Heroic Tier helm is when you need to be ready to swap to misshaped / H:T15 Chestplate.

    Also sidenote doing some rough napkin math of the stats... more specifically HIT items will gain with the +8 ilvl VP upgrade system. For draenei atleast you should be fine taking all normal items on list + swapping everspark H elite neck for congealed neck off Garalon + 180 Crit to cloak or if tailor just enjoy that.

    This pretty much leaves you at less then .1 over hit which is fairly easy to ignore considering how bloating stats are currently.

    Non draenei are perfectly fine taking H everspark and turning it into a 524 item. You might need to replace a lightning jade in the assault belt with a quick suns if overcapping enough that most of the hit is wasted. This is factoring in the VP upgrade system obviously.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-22 at 01:15 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Stary View Post
    Hello Anaxie,

    was wondering since the start of t14 since haste has such value over str isnt it worth considering using tier shoulders and either nullification greathelm or the legs from will of the emperor even if they are lower ilvl but higher haste value in our bis list?

    Does anyone have a character profile with bis gear and reforge just to see the stats thanks
    Those could be in the bis list... if you want a huge drop in strength and 11% hit.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-22 at 01:18 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by JeanJacket View Post
    noob question, whats better normal sha of fear axe with the 500 str gem in it, or heroic starshatter?

    Starshatter H:
    1294 str , 20413 wpn damage

    Shin'ka N:
    1223 str, 19,303 wpn damage
    + 500 str gem

    Shin'ka +429str VS Starshatter +1,110 wpn damage

    Take starshatter

    Also VP upgrade that shit in 5.1 and it will almost be 21900-22k top end. mmmmm delicious.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-22 at 01:39 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Saferis View Post
    I was simply putting the emphasis for the sake of putting emphasis. I guess I've just been excited about finally switching back to wings after a long time with HA. I just got my two piece t14 and have switched back to HA, now, however. As much as i like the original "Zealotry", it won't be as good as SW with the 4 piece, and i currently feel like I'm missing something.

    It just irritates me how they now decided to drop the 4 piece in the upcoming patch; 1 min 35 sec cd wings was what i was looking forward to.

    Anaxie, there's one question I thought I'd ask: At what percent haste do we stop gemming for haste>str? I know its probably something above 20% or so, but does it also vary upon your current str rating? (For example, if someone had full BiS but 18% haste)
    Getting higher ilvl wpns will inflate rating stats. if haste is losing value it's because of the weapon. I wouldn't be surprized in T15 getting a 26-28k Top end weapon if Mastery starts climbing above strength too.

    If it's not the weapon it's likely the lack of 4set.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2012-11-22 at 01:40 AM.

  5. #825
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    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Also Rikh. Correct me if I'm wrong but i think mastery > haste on wind lord. Confirm or deny?

    I bet mastery wins. Sadly you cannot sim it you can only test because of the sheer burst associated with the phase.
    Mastery could probably be better on that single fight yes but I'm probably never gonna bother to reforge for a single fight unless it's something the guild is working on for several days.
    Last edited by Rikhx; 2012-11-22 at 02:28 AM.

  6. #826
    So I currently have Normal Darkmist Vortex, Normal Lei Shin's Orders and Relic of Xuen, which ones would be better to use or would it have to be fight specific or just personal preference? I'm leaning more towards Darkmist Vortex and Relic of Xuen, just because the haste proc just seems really powerful atm, but I would love to hear your guys' opinion/advice on this.

    I can't post a link to my armory so, just look me up, Mel on Mug'thol-US

  7. #827
    Lei Shin's > all for ret. Take Lei Shin and you really ought to sim Vortex/Xuen since they are really close.

  8. #828
    Thanks for making another one of these threads Anaxie some seriously great stuff.

    This is my first tier playing as Ret I'm holding my own in the raids I've done. I'd like to improve my damage and I'm curious if the lfr tier helm and chest should be used over my current items to obtain 4-set asap or should I wait until I get the normal versions? I'd lose a lot of haste which I currently don't even have much of right now since I'm in a rather slow progression guild. My armory is in my signature.

    Any help is appreciated!
    Last edited by Joeseidon; 2012-11-23 at 06:50 AM. Reason: Cleaning it up

  9. #829
    Balhale, is aoe supported in simulationcraft?
    I imported my character (did not respec/retalent for aoe), changed number of enemies and edited priorities list (Crusader Strike -> Hammer of the righteous, Templar's Verdict -> Divine Storm) and got following results:

    3 enemies:

    6 enemies:


    edit: significantly different results with 100 seconds fight length, as anaxie predicted.
    Last edited by Pinkcrusader; 2012-11-22 at 01:05 PM.

  10. #830
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    So simcraft has been telling me that crit is currently a tenth or two of a point ahead of mastery for my weights right now, and that its just barely worse than haste (1.26 haste vs 1.22 crit). Anyone else have this come up, and is there any reason I should pursue such a course (which also includes gemming for strength again, as its at like 3.0 compared to 1.26 haste), or ignore it and go with haste gemming and mastery > crit?

  11. #831
    Quote Originally Posted by Joeseidon View Post
    Thanks for making another one of these threads Anaxie some seriously great stuff.

    This is my first tier playing as Ret I'm holding my own in the raids I've done. I'd like to improve my damage and I'm curious if the lfr tier helm and chest should be used over my current items to obtain 4-set asap or should I wait until I get the normal versions? I'd lose a lot of haste which I currently don't even have much of right now since I'm in a rather slow progression guild. My armory is in my signature.

    Any help is appreciated!
    Honestly get 4 set asap. Its so OP right now that it pretty much doesn't matter how much haste you lose if you are upgrading to 4 set. Although 5.1 might change that, but I don't think it won't.

  12. #832

  13. #833
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonkura View Post
    That's not always 100% accurate, but it gives a fair depiction ratio-wise.

    I doubt rets will be 2nd last (2H WW and arms dont count), but they definitely won't be as high as they are currently.

  14. #834
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    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Also sidenote doing some rough napkin math of the stats... more specifically HIT items will gain with the +8 ilvl VP upgrade system. For draenei atleast you should be fine taking all normal items on list + swapping everspark H elite neck for congealed neck off Garalon + 180 Crit to cloak or if tailor just enjoy that.
    Getting a heroic elite neck will be pretty impossible for a long time for most people sadly

  15. #835
    Mechagnome Proxeneta's Avatar
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    Any opinions on what I should upgrade next with VPs, choice is pretty much between:
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=89055
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=89345
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=89420

    My armory link: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...oxeneta/simple

  16. #836
    Quote Originally Posted by Pinkcrusader View Post
    Balhale, is aoe supported in simulationcraft?
    I imported my character (did not respec/retalent for aoe), changed number of enemies and edited priorities list (Crusader Strike -> Hammer of the righteous, Templar's Verdict -> Divine Storm) and got following results:

    3 enemies:

    6 enemies:


    edit: significantly different results with 100 seconds fight length, as anaxie predicted.
    Don't see anything unusual about that. AoE = more dmg = stats are worth more. As you hit more targets HoTR and DS become more of your dmg and so mastery is worth more compared to crit. And yes, all AoE is implemented, incl. HoTR, DS, MassExo, SotR, LH. Your link is the obvious result of a really short sim where scale factors are not very accurate.

  17. #837
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    No trinket from Lei Shi hc, prot pala used coin and got it.. like okay ?

  18. #838
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    Yeah I saw that Kaya, gratz on Lei Shi kill tho:P I'm using the normal one atm, doesn't seem to be a big difference between it and DMC card. Then again I don't have 4 set yet and with a bit of CD allignment I assume the trinket off Lei Shi will pull ahead.
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  19. #839
    Very useful thread, thanks a lot.

  20. #840
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    So we killed the windlord again and i had a bug there i used my macro für Light's Hammer and the whole fight long i only had damage from 3 use of it. It happens that when i use it there is no ring and it has CD, but i can't see any damage incomeing and looking at recount says the same: only 2m damage cause of it

    This is my macro:

    #showtooltipp
    /use White Tiger Gauntlets
    /cast Light's Hammer

    Maybe its because i use the ingi, gloves with it? Just a site note: 4er Bonus, yay D:

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