Test and give logged ptr feedback. He clearly is ignoring anything but.
Keep pushing the hit rating issue if need too.
Well, as far as the sustain dps expectations are concerned, I wouldn't hold my breath...It seems that some theorycrafters in EJ have no problem whatsoever with the huge discrepancy between burst and sustain phases. Given the fact that it has become quite funny that many blue answers have followed feedback and concerns expressed from said forums, I get the feeling that burstadin will never change. At least not as long as EJ squad is fond of the current situation.
Looks like Balfail just talking to himself over at EJ. Burst is better to have then sustained he says? Oh lawdIt's actually better imo to have roughly the same average output but do with burst highs and lows rather than flat sustained dps - let's you take more advantage of burn phases, e.g. H-Wind Lord or the end of H-Elegon. See also ret's burst on Spine in DS.
Insulting another forum user is never acceptable. - Malthanis
The changes aren't on the PTR yet but as soon as they are I'll be doing a shit-ton of dummy tests. I guess like 7 minutes every time? or something. It'd be way better if they still had the raid test dummies...
I think it's maybe time for some of you to get over yourselves with this "sustained" circlejerk. Currently, assuming SW which is likely to be used in most cases, we're looking at 1m 30s of "downtime". I'm having a hard time figuring out in what situations this leaves us so severely behind. Please enlighten me if you have obvious examples from this tier and the next. Currently I only see a problem with our aoe and cleave abilities and from what we hear adjustments are inbound there as well.
In 5.1 we've been middle of the pack, only outclassed by specs known by all to be op. Somehow I feel many of your worries boils down to the feeling like it should be our turn to be top dog.
Also you're using the word sustained differently. Let me clarify.
Burst + Sustained = Overall Damage
We wanted higher overall damage or what most people mistakenly call "sustained." Every melee class above us also got buffed (warriors were buffed and nerfed) which is why most rets feel we still need more overall dps now. Look at frost DKs for example, they had better single target, cleave, and AoE damage than us and still got MORE buffs than we did.
The biggest thing is that Retribution players DO NOT WANT to have to rely on cooldowns.
And to be honest, I am more worried about the gear itemization for then next patch now after the most recent changes to Retribution.
Last edited by Dmchomerun; 2013-02-21 at 01:29 AM. Reason: -
Exorcising Undead in the name of the Silver Hand!
I just want them to stop making our class solely reliant on burst. It would be nice to see just a solid sustained dps tier where cooldowns seem so "in the past". I just really hate them to the point where the class is so boring and all i think about while dpsing is "On to the next AW...".
Who gives a shit about how ya deliver those numbers in one big bulk of burst or sprung over 2min of ABC juggling? Middle of the pack single-target you say? Check again, you're wrong.
Bottomline is simple. Total output is the only thing that matters not BURST or SUSTAIN or w-e the fuck else ya wanna call it.
The 2 min AV cd is all fine and dandy but it doesn't help at all in our sustained dps issue, which fights do we pop CDs as soon as they come up? Patchwerk fights or fights with no "down time" or no "burst phases" and it's in theese kinds fight we actually can say that shorter burst cd = higher average DPS.
But encounters don't work like that, Lei Shi is a great example, there's frequent down phases and damage potential fluxiate alot. I've hold on to AV for 30+ seconds just because I know there's a burst phase or hero coming up in that time, then the overall dps is effectivly dropping because rets rely on their CDs to have "competeative" overall dps, which is stupid beyond imagination.
They can make so many changes or atleast try them now that PTR has been running for a good month but instead they sit around waiting for us to quiet down.
Does the 2 minute AW change mean we'll be using Sanctified Wrath most of the time now? And should they fix that tier of talents to even it out some? I'm not sure of how they really rank currently. I've been Protection most of this tier and haven't kept up. I thought that we used HA if we had the 2-pc and SW if we had the 4-pc. I'm just trying to ascertain how this change affects that tier of talents. Thoughts?
If you're 600 or more over hit cap, would it be adavantageous to use haste gems instead of hit?
I have a gear set that may be a dps increase if I could trade the hit for something else.
im tempted to keep t14 till heroic with the 10% judgment/seal damage change going on our old 4pc bonus. not sure if t15 normal is better than 517 t14.
Not only does this question the viablity of Rets during progress but it's also the main reason I personally don't enjoy the spec as much as I do playing a dot class that is all over the place or just wrecking everythinig with AoE damage.
Thats the thing even if you don't bring any utility to the raid (rets actually do) and do the best overall dmg you will still get a spot. What I was refering to was the class performance which is very irrelevant in what it comes in terms of dmg (burst or sustain) as long as the grand total is big enough. Middle of the pack would actually be quite great for a ret to validate the spot. Sure damage isn't everything when you are evaluating that said role, but it is a major aspect/contribution/what ya bring to the raid.
Main problem with this game is how it favours ranged. If you want to design interesting encounters with new and fresh mechanics you will favour ranged by default. So what I do not understand is why melee dps aint overpowered as it SHOULD be considering the "high upkeep". And yes t14 was really boring fights as a whole. Let's see if ToT changes it and where melee (ret specificly) end up in terms of demand in progress raiding.
Most guilds have atleast 2 holy paladins (25man) so devo and hand abilities doesn't exactly have a great value vs warrior banners and hp buffs and higher dps.