1. #1641
    Quote Originally Posted by Neldarie View Post
    Wrong. They said they had issues with balancing dps numbers with amount of rage berserker stance used to generate in all dmg taken encounters (such as good old Ultraxion). It never had anything to do with macroing things and forgetting it. There is still plenty of that stuff around nowadays. Also try and imagine how op stances w-o GCD would be now in MoP with how potent protection stance is.

    And ye I agree with making seals off GCD. Probably the only safe way to go around and making SoR being used frequently.
    What spec are you talking about? Arms warriors were a macro-and-forget stance dancer.

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  2. #1642
    Stood in the Fire Neldarie's Avatar
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    Any spec. HS spam on top of everything else with spending 90% of the time in berserker stance as arms or well 100% fury. They still go berserker stance nowadays at some points of some fights but its nowhere near where it used to be back in cata and such. Also some AE abilities are default filtered out as rage-gen via berserker stance.

    But ye I got some warrior alts so experienced it and also remember some bluepost around that whole business.
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  3. #1643
    Well you had to go to Battle Stance every 15 seconds at least to refresh Rend, not to mention Overpower procs? Sooo....

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  4. #1644
    Stood in the Fire Neldarie's Avatar
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    What are you talking about ? I explained why it was nerfed = Blizzard didn't want to balance stuff around excess AoE dmg taken generating too much rage for warriors. I just said above that you spent most: 90%+++++++++++ time in berserker stance. And rend was auto-refreshed by MS I think it was towards the end of cata.

    That was the main reason why Arms used to trump everyone on meters on H:ultrax and H:madness (yes together with tenticle forests but those weren't the main reason).
    Last edited by Neldarie; 2013-03-01 at 05:23 AM.
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  5. #1645
    I think this explains what I'm talking about.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsDUZpnxZHY

    That is no where near 90% in berserker. You're right, I forgot about MS refresh, but Overpower still needed BS to be used, and it procced fairly often.

    Sha of Fear Melee hit You 372908 Physical. (766625 Overkill) (Critical)
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  6. #1646
    Stood in the Fire Neldarie's Avatar
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    Well 70-30, still a big deal.

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/ixclc...?s=4338&e=4531

    or 79-21:

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/s93vx...6/?s=156&e=353

    All that offtopic stuff out of the way, I don't see why Seals have to be on global cooldown at all. There is no "gamebreaking" about having em off it.
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  7. #1647
    The Lightbringer Requital's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revvo View Post
    I think this explains what I'm talking about.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsDUZpnxZHY

    That is no where near 90% in berserker. You're right, I forgot about MS refresh, but Overpower still needed BS to be used, and it procced fairly often.
    The confusion here is Neldarie is stating the reason for the change had nothing to do with stance dancing it had completely to do with being able to take extra damage in a stance and then use that to inflate DPS because of the extra rage you get. Ultraxion is the perfect example for this I use to out DPS most people on my Warrior because I would get all the free rage from the AE damage and the berserker stance.

    Also stance dancing was way more DPS than just hit it and forget it.
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  8. #1648
    Idk, I just remember Blizzard taking a stance against stance dancing at the end of Cata. Not 100% sure, but whatever. However, for most warriors it was macro and forget it. You just macro'd the Stances into the spells, and never thought about it again. For MOST warriors.

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  9. #1649
    May we stay on topic, please?
    People who frequent this thread aren't really interested in how Warriors used to play.

  10. #1650
    The Lightbringer Requital's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snuzzfizzle View Post
    May we stay on topic, please?
    People who frequent this thread aren't really interested in how Warriors used to play.
    the conversation was based on the theory craft that's the title of the thread, Of why we probably won't see Seals ever removed from the GCD. It's on topic it's pretty relevant to know why we won't see it not just say we won't see it then end.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
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  11. #1651
    Quote Originally Posted by Requital View Post
    the conversation was based on the theory craft that's the title of the thread, Of why we probably won't see Seals ever removed from the GCD. It's on topic it's pretty relevant to know why we won't see it not just say we won't see it then end.
    It's unfortunate, but I believe this is true. We will most likely never see them removed from the GCD, and it's a shame.

    Sha of Fear Melee hit You 372908 Physical. (766625 Overkill) (Critical)
    Begging us to buff is sometimes easier than trying to beat the boss.(Source)

  12. #1652
    Quote Originally Posted by Revvo View Post
    It's unfortunate, but I believe this is true. We will most likely never see them removed from the GCD, and it's a shame.
    The funny thing is, using those kinds of macros would be stupid anyway. You would never want to macro Seal of Righteousness into Divine Storm or Hammer of the Righteous because there's situations you use those abilities where Seal of Righteousness just sucks, like at 2-3 targets. Putting Seals off the GCD is not mindless at all, at this point. Even trying to seal twist with Seal of Justice and Seal of Truth wouldn't be able to be macro'd to much effect - and there's obviously ways to prevent that kind of thing, like I suggested before. Their entire argument against it is flawed.

  13. #1653
    Oh, I'm quite aware. I would never do that, but I'm sure there are plenty of people that would. You know who they are.

    Sha of Fear Melee hit You 372908 Physical. (766625 Overkill) (Critical)
    Begging us to buff is sometimes easier than trying to beat the boss.(Source)

  14. #1654
    Seal twisting is almost non existent, and to whatever extent of it exists today brings some of the challenge on choice of seal correlating to dps, removing that would just make this class stupid. But then again various arguements could me made for taking seals off the gcd or leaving it as is.

    Also in anticipation for 5.2 I will be putting together a Weak Auras thread that will encompass ICD, Proc, Ability Cooldowns, Boss Mechanics to some degree, A Holy Power tracking bar that may or may not include sound ques, and some other raiding essentials, as well as an FAQ on UI if anyone wants that. Anaxie has convinced me to come out of my shell and be more helpful ~.~
    Last edited by Vigilanti; 2013-03-01 at 09:26 AM.

  15. #1655
    I am Murloc! Huntingbear_grimbatol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vigilanti View Post
    Seal twisting is almost non existent, and to whatever extent of it exists today brings some of the challenge on choice of seal correlating to dps, removing that would just make this class stupid. But then again various arguements could me made for taking seals off the gcd or leaving it as is.

    Also in anticipation for 5.2 I will be putting together a Weak Auras thread that will encompass ICD, Proc, Ability Cooldowns, Boss Mechanics to some degree, A Holy Power tracking bar that may or may not include sound ques, and some other raiding essentials, as well as an FAQ on UI if anyone wants that. Anaxie has convinced me to come out of my shell and be more helpful ~.~
    Wait for 5.2 if you're not quick and prepare with seal changes you're gonna fall behind like a rock.
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  16. #1656
    I never said I don't seal twist when it's necessary, I was simply stating that there aren't as many instances where you do twist, except for the end of Sha for example, twisting between trying to keep a 5 stack while AoE-ing down Dread Spawns.

  17. #1657
    Quote Originally Posted by Vigilanti View Post
    I never said I don't seal twist when it's necessary, I was simply stating that there aren't as many instances where you do twist, except for the end of Sha for example, twisting between trying to keep a 5 stack while AoE-ing down Dread Spawns.
    Is there even any point in doing that over keeping 5 stacks of censure on 2-3 targets? It's not like it's an amazing amount of adds to cleave with SoR.

  18. #1658
    I think I explained my self improperly, Although there are times where i might roll a 5 stack on 2-3 targets i was referring to rolling a 5 stack on Sha while twisting to SoR between when adds are in and out of a good cleave range. I mean seal usage on that fight is circumstantial and you have to judge when to use the correct seal based on the current circumstance. Also what is unnecessary padding, and what is going to get the boss killed.

  19. #1659
    And I questioned even switching to SoR at all for that fight.

  20. #1660
    depends on how necessary the dps is at the moment, i.e How fast do the adds need to die, are there enough targets that are an actual dps gain or enough to warrant a Seal swap for burst. A lot of seal twisting this tier is either for padding/actual dps gain, or to make sure something is dead and in the ground before someone dies or someone gets pissed.

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