1. #2301
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Rein binders You need as little hit as possible.

    ---------- Post added 2013-04-08 at 04:31 PM ----------

    looking again at Primordius VS feather in full BIS you are going to have to forgo 5 blue gem slots for str/stamina gems because you have to make the bonus because 120/180 str is just too powerful bonus wise. We could do Primordius and in full TF + upgrades still be below hitcap. With Ji-s we come close to wasting a full 1000 rating. Any more info on this proc trinket / Rikh are you still getting consistent proc results with the don't release on death tactic, can anyone else replacate this?

    Another huge factor is Ra-den ring isn't exactly going to be the easiest item to come acoss so having an additonal 600 hit from Megera ring is another reality the can be delt with without the item.

    I'm recheck boots 541 tide boots might beat ra-dens since the blue socket is useless and its crit/expertise.

    549 2/2 upgraded stats +Gems/reforged

    Tidal Force Treads
    1481 strength
    925 haste
    445 mast
    668 Crit
    Sabatons of the Superior Being

    1513
    674 haste
    531 Crit
    915 expertise

    It would be nice the only Ra-den item we need being a the ring. Cloak can be ignored cuz of legendary ofc.
    I'll do upgraded crafted boots real fast for some perspective.

    530 2/2
    Haunted Steel Treads
    1232 Strength
    1124 haste
    762 mastery

    ---------- Post added 2013-04-08 at 05:15 PM ----------

    Looking at these numbers loss of expertise from ra-den shoes directly hits mastery reforges on other items... However with Bo-ris you gain expertise and 1225 mastery un Upgraded.... I still stand by my suspicion that at 549 weapon levels + 4 set + Ji-procs that mastery is going to overtake haste and 40%+ levels.

    Even more when you consider ANY aoe scenario or high damage buff wings scenario <Ji-kun nutrients, Jin'rhok, Horridon burns between gates with wings.>

    Shockingly with legendary cape and a mastery prio we are able to hit 60% mastery % and maintain around 29-30% haste.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-04-08 at 05:35 PM.

  2. #2302
    High Overlord Rikhx's Avatar
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    You will always get a proc on pull with feather if you don't release, like literally every single pull. Unless the primo trinket is really good and you can easily keep up 3-5 stacks and even then I don't think I'll see me ever giving up feather no matter what kind of hit rating I get. I can't get over getting 1mil+ execution sentences in starter bursts either.

    Also Feather > Spark in my eyes right now, but once I get 4pc sustained dps will increase a lot which is what spark already does which will just further boost that. But yeah, I don't think primo will live up to the same capabilities of these two. But who knows, further testing is required on it at this point.

  3. #2303
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikhx View Post
    You will always get a proc on pull with feather if you don't release, like literally every single pull. Unless the primo trinket is really good and you can easily keep up 3-5 stacks and even then I don't think I'll see me ever giving up feather no matter what kind of hit rating I get. I can't get over getting 1mil+ execution sentences in starter bursts either.

    Also Feather > Spark in my eyes right now, but once I get 4pc sustained dps will increase a lot which is what spark already does which will just further boost that. But yeah, I don't think primo will live up to the same capabilities of these two. But who knows, further testing is required on it at this point.
    I think futher testing with 549 ji+spark, 4set, and a 549 weapon need looked at too and how it affects mastery. 60%+ just seems too good for how much % of damage hand of light is now pushing that up an additonal 50% shouldn't be ignored.

    Would you say Rikh that Ji-kuns power + guardian effectively doubles the power of our first wings set if not more.

    ... did some gear checks again... with legendary cloaks and upgrades you can nearly hit 75% mastery..... yikes.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-04-08 at 05:55 PM.

  4. #2304
    High Overlord Rikhx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    I think futher testing with 549 ji+spark, 4set, and a 549 weapon need looked at too and how it affects mastery. 60%+ just seems too good for how much % of damage hand of light is now pushing that up an additonal 50% shouldn't be ignored.

    Would you say Rikh that Ji-kuns power + guardian effectively doubles the power of our first wings set if not more.

    ... did some gear checks again... with legendary cloaks and upgrades you can nearly hit 75% mastery..... yikes.
    yeah not to mention how good guardian goes with feather, since you're most likely only gonna get 2 guardians per fight you should always try to line em up together as good as possible, first one will always be lined up if used on pull.

    I'm really curious to see what kind of bursts I can do once I get 4pc and a heroic weapon seeing as I can already pull almost 400k, then throwing in some holy TVs into the mix, and if one of them crits close to end of the feather, it's gonna spike up so hard.

  5. #2305
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikhx View Post
    yeah not to mention how good guardian goes with feather, since you're most likely only gonna get 2 guardians per fight you should always try to line em up together as good as possible, first one will always be lined up if used on pull.

    I'm really curious to see what kind of bursts I can do once I get 4pc and a heroic weapon seeing as I can already pull almost 400k, then throwing in some holy TVs into the mix, and if one of them crits close to end of the feather, it's gonna spike up so hard.
    with the 75% mastery value i was looking at a Critical TV would be 1350% weapon damage counting HoL not counting SoT however.
    a funny thing i noticed.... pushing mastery nets us a 20-22% haste value making it a perfect 50% with bloodlust. I'm sure starter cooldowns on Horridon 200% damage taken burns would look hilarious with 50% haste and 75% mastery. Is feather even modeled correctly yet in simcraft and has anyone ran full 549 bis profile with a proper JI-kun modeling and a 549 weapon to with mastery prio to see what weights look like or dps for that matter.

    There is a strong chance we could push Hand of light upwards of 40-45% of our total damage done.

    ---------- Post added 2013-04-08 at 08:53 PM ----------

    I could just be having a wild fantasy like I normally do. But I'm keen to test this myself. Of course once I acquire the 3 tools needed. Trinket/Weapon/Tierchest for 4set.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-04-08 at 06:41 PM.

  6. #2306
    I'd just like to add in my 2c that primordius trinket is absurdly RNG reliant, even more than I'd assumed when I first looked at it. There are fights where it never goes above 3 and doesnt line up with wings, and there are fights where i get a 5 stack lined up with wings. Spark is a pain and RNG whether or not it lines up, but at least you definitely get the buff at a relatively predictable interval

    tl;dr - imo primordius trinket is crap, average dps potential outweighed by stupid and (imo) not-fun RNG

    PS is there any data for the deltas on these? I know I could sim it for myself but just in general

  7. #2307
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    That is my experience. Zandalari while it needs to stack has actually turned out very predicatable when and what cooldowns it will proc with on average.

  8. #2308
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    That is my experience. Zandalari while it needs to stack has actually turned out very predicatable when and what cooldowns it will proc with on average.
    I'd say it depends on the fight. Fights where you switch targets a lot (Horridon, Tortos, Ji-Kun if on nests) aren't too favorable for building up stacks. Last week's parse shows me 3 warriors on Tortos (bats), 5 on Megaera, 3 on Ji-Kun (nests duty), 5 on Primordius (2 even consequent on first mutation).. Get the picture ?

  9. #2309
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    not really because I havn't had that issue. Try cutting your downtime.

  10. #2310
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    not really because I havn't had that issue. Try cutting your downtime.
    Well, that's weird, because I don't leave Tortos until bats are in front of him and proceed immediately to AoE them and at Primordius, I'm constantly hitting stuff: adds, then Primordius when mutated then adds again for bloods etc.. Only autoattack gets shafted by these changes, but I doubt Spark gets stacks only from autoattacks so.. it feels weird to me..

  11. #2311
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Anyone having fun with this awesome secrets quest? I love clearing 25ToT for a month and having 7 while our rogues are finished with the spear quest. WHOO!!!

    Still rocking 517 shin and 2pc T14


    yeah we are having same problem I'm stuck with Heroic Starshitter 2/2 and 2pc while we gave a heroic Bo-Ris to our DK tank lol...we haven't really seen many plate DPS drops most of them have come from bonus rolls. As for the legendary quest I'm at 11 a guildy is at fuckin 19 and he missed a week cause of PAX.

  12. #2312
    High Overlord Rikhx's Avatar
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    Just some random fight I did at the dummies and I got insane feather procs :P Ended on 140k~ sustained dps(only might as buff obv) on dummy because of that! Fight lasted something like 4min.

    An example of how insane procs you CAN get
    Last edited by Rikhx; 2013-04-09 at 09:10 AM.

  13. #2313
    Oh my god i need this trinket

    Btw rikh your paladin looks exact same like my
    Last edited by Flowe; 2013-04-09 at 11:31 AM.

    EU-Frostwolf Reckless T14: 16/16Hc T15: 13/13Hc T16: 14/14Hc

  14. #2314
    Which one of these do you guys think is possibly the best at this moment? DP/HA/SW? Sorry if this question was already asked but I cannot find it literally anywhere, I see a lot of different votes on that. Majority seems to be going with SW and I personally tend to run with HA, few people I know are sticking with DP so I'm bit confused.

  15. #2315
    Well, I didn't keep the logs from my UH DK (where I have Feathers of Fury), but it did have high number of procs, with Lei Shen's and Rune of the Fallen Crusader. It was delicious, let me tell you that..

    Quote Originally Posted by Quanee View Post
    Which one of these do you guys think is possibly the best at this moment? DP/HA/SW? Sorry if this question was already asked but I cannot find it literally anywhere, I see a lot of different votes on that. Majority seems to be going with SW and I personally tend to run with HA, few people I know are sticking with DP so I'm bit confused.
    This question appears again and again every few other pages. HA provides higher burst (with GoAK and AW), but SW provides higher overall DPS (my observations). DP might prove useful in sparse adds duty (Horridon), but last phase (Jalak+Horridon) is more important, IMHO.
    Last edited by SirRaven; 2013-04-09 at 11:44 AM.

  16. #2316
    Hey guys i was just wondering while this thread is about HA/SW what the priority would be for 4pc t15 on either of the talents. Would it be worth weaving in exorcism or keep spamming cs as a hp builder to try and proc those big tv's? i've done some tests myself and had better results with just using cs - but i still have the feeling it came down to some rng, so other input would be greatly appreciated.

  17. #2317
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikhx View Post
    Just some random fight I did at the dummies and I got insane feather procs :P Ended on 140k~ sustained dps(only might as buff obv) on dummy because of that! Fight lasted something like 4min.

    An example of how insane procs you CAN get
    so there we have it. Feather BIS by a margin so large it's comparable to old abomb jar.

    Only thing better then 541 Feather is a 541 weapon.

    Also HA sucks. RPPM trinekts could be up whenever SW has longer duration. Autos, CENSURE, and proc infused ES's aren't affected by HA nor are holy powered TVS. Seeing as how you cannot CS for every TV and with loss of 2 set T14 those spammed tvs are much weaker..... Why would anyone take HA ever? Go SW and hammer>CS>hammer>TV>Hammer>CS.Hammer>TV Start SW with 0 HP if your CS doesn't proc push to 5 HP and dump tv and weave in your first exo.

    Also if you are using CLC this tier you are going to lose a couple thousand dps as a result.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-04-09 at 01:42 PM.

  18. #2318
    Quote Originally Posted by Rikhx View Post
    Just some random fight I did at the dummies and I got insane feather procs :P Ended on 140k~ sustained dps(only might as buff obv) on dummy because of that! Fight lasted something like 4min.

    An example of how insane procs you CAN get
    Do a 10min test instead, 4mins makes everything look like they got massive uptimes.
    "Remembrance of things past is not necessarily the remembrance of things as they were."
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    T11 WR: 115, T12 WR: 45, T14 WR:44, T15 WR:37, T16: WR:28

  19. #2319
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juicy View Post
    Do a 10min test instead, 4mins makes everything look like they got massive uptimes.
    uhhhh that is 8 feather procs in 4 mins. It shows the potential of the trinket enough because even 8 procs in TEN mins would be godly. 8 in 4 means you just won the game.

    0 trinkets can do this for ret currently. It's broken overpowered
    and with mechanics like this if we got a NON hit tier next tier and u get a 541 feather and turn it to 549 I highly doubt it gets replaced.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-04-09 at 02:03 PM.

  20. #2320
    Epic! Fredzilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    uhhhh that is 8 feather procs in 4 mins. It shows the potential of the trinket enough because even 8 procs in TEN mins would be godly. 8 in 4 means you just won the game.

    0 trinkets can do this for ret currently. It's broken overpowered
    and with mechanics like this if we got a NON hit tier next tier and u get a 541 feather and turn it to 549 I highly doubt it gets replaced.
    Or they'll nerf it in 5.4, since they don't seem to keen on us really using gear in tiers past their prime.

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