1. #3801
    Legendary! Huntingbear_grimbatol's Avatar
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    crit trinket still acting all retarded
    As far as I've gone through all specs (including healers) lost the reduced raid wide cds thing with their trinkets. Guessing blizzard saw some problems occuring :P For now think of the CD reducing trinkets as a personal gain trinket only, well some utility like hand of freedom... lol (actually laughing)
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  2. #3802

  3. #3803
    Anywho, trinkets need changed some classes are sustaining retarded high dps with them not just us. Very retarded scaling issues. Fix the fucking trinkets before you put out more raid encounters. Why they are intentionally skewing their data is beyond me. You can't fucking tune dps like this.

    I'm all for interesting procs but this expansions trinkets are just getting so retarded I'm about to beg them to throw in the towel and do some generaic fucking procs from the first tier only and call it a day.

  4. #3804
    Legendary! Huntingbear_grimbatol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revvo View Post
    HoFreedom, dafuq
    Yeah I was going through and thought they'd maybe give us reduced cd on Light's Prism / Execution Sentence / Light's Hammer or maybe even Blinding Light... but no, hand of freedom.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Anywho, trinkets need changed some classes are sustaining retarded high dps with them not just us. Very retarded scaling issues. Fix the fucking trinkets before you put out more raid encounters. Why they are intentionally skewing their data is beyond me. You can't fucking tune dps like this.

    I'm all for interesting procs but this expansions trinkets are just getting so retarded I'm about to beg them to throw in the towel and do some generaic fucking procs from the first tier only and call it a day.
    Only thing I can think of atm is that they intend the crit trinket (and the caster 85% mastery and shit) to work like this, but that kinda makes them mandetory which they've said so many times they try to avoid (making certain pieces mandetory). They're going to start 10hc tuning soon so IDK what they're doing... they would have to redo or calculate a lot of shit if they're much slower on balancing the different trinkets...

    I like interesting as far as Rune (which I'm planning to pick up for masterybuild and then going like mad mental on the TVs and aoe build next tier) and to some degree the stacking per second trinkets like feather but when it's *proc* now you win by default it's boring... like the PTR crit trinket.

    The only issue with theese kinds of trinkets is that they're so insanely strong for some specs (lol 100% crit trinket for demo locks...) that they also tend to be mandetory. It's just a minor thing though but we've seen a couple trinkets (and other non legendary items) up the time that would absolutely change the spec. TAJ in ICC for rets, armor pene trinkets for warriors and so on. Think blizzard should plan theese trinkets carefully :P
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  5. #3805
    I don't see a 85% mastery caster trinket. I DO notice they get a int stacking trinket that is basically a amped up op version of Feather 2300 int at normal mode < depending on tooltip accuracy> lasting 20 seconds and stacking 10 times. If it stacks per hit after proc well..... that is atleast 10 seconds with the 23k++ int it provides. Maybe it has hard ICD though. Someone shuld ask for relevant trinket data this patch since they have done it for all others. And see if this crit shit is fucking intended.

    IMO spam tweet GC. Hey are these trinkets supposed to be a blatent passive 40% crit. Little broken yoyo. I personally would actually like some choice in my trinkets otherwise shit like the passive str / haste proc ones are pointless to even implement into the game.

  6. #3806
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    I don't see a 85% mastery caster trinket. I DO notice they get a int stacking trinket that is basically a amped up op version of Feather 2300 int at normal mode < depending on tooltip accuracy> lasting 20 seconds and stacking 10 times. If it stacks per hit after proc well..... that is atleast 10 seconds with the 23k++ int it provides. Maybe it has hard ICD though. Someone shuld ask for relevant trinket data this patch since they have done it for all others. And see if this crit shit is fucking intended.

    IMO spam tweet GC. Hey are these trinkets supposed to be a blatent passive 40% crit. Little broken yoyo. I personally would actually like some choice in my trinkets otherwise shit like the passive str / haste proc ones are pointless to even implement into the game.
    Not to mention that having the trinket will be the reason your DPS sucks or not comparatively.

  7. #3807
    As I sit here i ponder a few things one very important one being. IF vp upgrades are not live with the patch. 543 VS 556 you MAY be better off not taking tier just this moment and sticking with TV. We may be better off during the "gear transitional" period that happens until you can EASILY get full T16 trinket wise. I see no reason NOT to opt for the CDR trinket since we will still be flowing holy tv's and such. Crit trinket and stats trinket may but the ultimate goal but the CDR trinkets shining performancer is in this normally 1-2 month gear transition period where you... don't have storm spam and thus far less GCD bloat and by needing 0 tier synergy DP is clearly NOT a winner at that point in time.

    Something to think on I suppose. I'd guess that during this time CDR and feather could have quite potent together. As you replace both HoW should lose some considerable steam.

    I'm sure that during progression everyone can appreciate the defenses gained from the CDR aswell.

    The most important add fight this tier <Garrosh H> comes pretty late in this large tier. for MOST heroic raiders we would be transitioned into atleast half n half heroic tier 16 by then ready to cleave the shit out of him and his adds.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-07-11 at 05:08 AM.

  8. #3808
    Assuming the trinkets themselves are acting as they're intended to (disregarding that the crit one seems bugged), would the feather still be at the very least a bit competitive? Or are the new trinkets going to act like the feather did against previous trinkets, and be a massive boost in itself as well?

    Can't say I'm fond of the new trinkets at all, but at least they're trying something new.

  9. #3809
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    I don't see a 85% mastery caster trinket. I DO notice they get a int stacking trinket that is basically a amped up op version of Feather 2300 int at normal mode < depending on tooltip accuracy> lasting 20 seconds and stacking 10 times. If it stacks per hit after proc well..... that is atleast 10 seconds with the 23k++ int it provides. Maybe it has hard ICD though. Someone shuld ask for relevant trinket data this patch since they have done it for all others. And see if this crit shit is fucking intended.

    IMO spam tweet GC. Hey are these trinkets supposed to be a blatent passive 40% crit. Little broken yoyo. I personally would actually like some choice in my trinkets otherwise shit like the passive str / haste proc ones are pointless to even implement into the game.
    Well I suspect that the crit trinket won't just keep REPEATEDLY proccing, that just seems too absurd to me, but maybe they envision that it's necessary for melee to keep up, I dunno. 50% up-time would be reasonable to me, but hey, I could be wrong.

  10. #3810
    Quote Originally Posted by UnderworldSoup View Post
    Assuming the trinkets themselves are acting as they're intended to (disregarding that the crit one seems bugged), would the feather still be at the very least a bit competitive? Or are the new trinkets going to act like the feather did against previous trinkets, and be a massive boost in itself as well?

    Can't say I'm fond of the new trinkets at all, but at least they're trying something new.
    the stats trinket passive synergy gains are too powerful. It's MAX potential depends on the REAL intended mechanics of the crit trinket. Well beable to have a more concrete idea when the post trinket mechanics FAQ on ptr hopfully soon like the other times.

  11. #3811
    Legendary! Huntingbear_grimbatol's Avatar
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    The trinket that increases our stats by 14% (up to 20% I guess with HC+"TF"+valor) is going to make haste less wanted for us. I mean we could easily hit 20k haste next tier without it, with it we're looking at anywhere between 23-26k haste which is too much iirc. Think we're gonna see a "sweet spot" on around 19.5k haste where things just fall into eachother and that's without considering how retardedly strong mastery will be next tier because of setbonus (for aoe) and other trinkets.

    Which means we're going to use the crit trinket by default unless it gets changed and then the stat increasing trinket as a second, cd reducing one as a third trinket but it might take priority for single target fights (but I doubt it, the crit trinket is retarded).
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  12. #3812
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Oh no faction champions. Better not hit divine storm cuz holy wrath is op
    anaxie, maybe my examples weren't the best there are. but I remain convinced that requiring an AoE move in a single target rotation is bad design. If a fight isn't AoE friendly, either through adds which shouldn't be hit or through a reduction in AoE damage taken by the targets, having an AoE spell in our single target rotation reduces our DPS and can even cause a wipe. already some frost DKs are complaining about the splash damage from howling blast.

    also, dark animus mini golems take reduced AoE damage. if we still used DS single target, you would also complain about that. We don't yet know enough about SoO bosses to know if any boss there also has a reduced AoE component.
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  13. #3813
    Quote Originally Posted by Temperance Brennan View Post
    anaxie, maybe my examples weren't the best there are. but I remain convinced that requiring an AoE move in a single target rotation is bad design. If a fight isn't AoE friendly, either through adds which shouldn't be hit or through a reduction in AoE damage taken by the targets, having an AoE spell in our single target rotation reduces our DPS and can even cause a wipe. already some frost DKs are complaining about the splash damage from howling blast.

    also, dark animus mini golems take reduced AoE damage. if we still used DS single target, you would also complain about that. We don't yet know enough about SoO bosses to know if any boss there also has a reduced AoE component.
    I don't get it.

    If our DPS is calculated and balanced around using AoE skills in ST (like DS used to be back then), then let's assume we are hitting a boss and his aoe-damage-reduced adds. We are still doing 100% of our "normal" dps against the boss, and still gaining some damage against adds. Albeit it can be argued that it's useless damage if adds aren't meant to be dps'ed, it's still a small gain in the "top dps race".

    Why would DKs complain about Howling Blast ? As far as I remember, it deals something like x% damage against the main target and y% damage against all other targets in the area. Who cares if "y" is reduced or not, it's still damage gained (and I won't even talk about the deseases spread).

    Although, I must admit there are some cases where AoE skills can suck in certain situations (hello Meteor-like abilities like Holy Wrath or Fists of Fury).

  14. #3814
    Mechagnome Neldarie's Avatar
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    "Why would DKs complain about Howling Blast ? "

    Because storm is a finisher while HB is just a resource expendeture (all dk abilities are). There is a big difference really.
    Another big difference is the Ret "execution of abilities" model is very different to what it was in say ICC with those free storms.
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  15. #3815
    The point here is not whether or not the "free" divine storms granted by the 4pT16 are viable and flow nicely into our current rotation, but whether or not AoE abilities are a bad choice and design when forced into a ST situation.

  16. #3816
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    all i know is, with the glyph of INQ, our new 4 set, and about a 70% crit chance with those trinkets...... GG to any cleave/ AOE fight.
    As to attaining said crit trinket, i think i'm gona have to kill both our warriors in the guild to get it cause people will think that paladins wouldn't want it cause crit is lol or some bull shit.
    Also, yes inq DOES gain a timer increase on boss add kills such as the dogs from the twin shamans and what have you. its very possible with a fight like heroic garrosh that we will NEVER have to reactivate inquisition as long as we are getting kills. ( and with our AOE damage, i think we very much WILL be getting those kills)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Alviarin View Post
    The point here is not whether or not the "free" divine storms granted by the 4pT16 are viable and flow nicely into our current rotation, but whether or not AoE abilities are a bad choice and design when forced into a ST situation.
    as far as im concerned, its only a bad design if they intend it to be. Take spine of deathwing for example, if you need to AOE to single burn the amalgamation, its gona kill your raid. That would be bad design. If your divine storm did lesser damage if non at all or there were no adds that could explode like that and kill you all, then its not harmful to the game. At this point, it all depends on where they want to go with this. i could be bad or not, we just don't know yet for sure.

  17. #3817
    Mechagnome Neldarie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alviarin View Post
    The point here is not whether or not the "free" divine storms granted by the 4pT16 are viable and flow nicely into our current rotation, but whether or not AoE abilities are a bad choice and design when forced into a ST situation.
    Yep exactly. I'm very sure its very viable just extremely dumb and unpracticle. Fights where it would be lethal are rather rare but they do happen. I guess that limits the design of encounters somewhat.
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  18. #3818
    Quote Originally Posted by Neldarie View Post
    Yep exactly. I'm very sure its very viable just extremely dumb and unpracticle. Fights where it would be lethal are rather rare but they do happen. I guess that limits the design of encounters somewhat.
    Oh it's a big concern I mean right now THIS tier every single ability we have is well defined espeically with the tier pieaces. Next patch Templars goes back to having no real identity and DS gets plucked in too. It's just so awkward. I hope they understand how the tier made our class function THIS patch is an ideal step they need to take with future class changes towards interesting gameplay. Does anyone NOT love seeing holy TV procs?

    Also at Reg....... sigh..... You understand EVERYONE gets these crit trinkets don't you? And some classes scale more insanely with said ratings. It not a good thing for the game for this thing to even exist atall.

    I'm still holding onto a delusion that they will actually balance them.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-07-11 at 10:06 PM.

  19. #3819
    I also kind of doubt warriors will want it considering they will be crit capped regardless.

  20. #3820
    Quote Originally Posted by Revvo View Post
    I also kind of doubt warriors will want it considering they will be crit capped regardless.
    actually, I think warriors will take this trinket and gear for haste and mastery. The crit they get from gear and raidbuff will bring it to 50%, which means 100% crit on BT. that is, if the trinket isn't bugged.
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