1. #1

    Valor Points in MoP

    So, not sure about anyone else, but I was under the impression that blizz wanted to get away from Valor being used to buy gear and replace it with the ability to upgrade gear ilvl with it. Now the daily factions offer epic gear at the cost of valor. Was anyone else under this impression? Regardless, if they put in epic raid level gear that you can purchase with valor at this tier, I guess we won't see the removal of valor gear this xpac. Mixed emotions on that.

  2. #2
    Scarab Lord Wrathonia's Avatar
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    I wish they would go back to previous expansions in how we dealt with points. The thing that has truly burned me for this expansion is the fucking valor cap. Make things expensive and give us ways to sink excess valor into crafting goods to make us doing heroics more, but ffs, don't keep the damn valor cap! This along with the guild rep cap has kept me from being active at all this expansion. I have yet to get a single character to exalted with my guild because I have a ton of alts that I play and I despise dailies, so I got a lot to friendly and honored and one at revered. But any time I actually choose to sit and grind for rep and find out I am capped already, it kills my motivation, especially when I get capped 2-3 days into the week.

  3. #3
    There isn't much details on valor yet, as far as I know.

    I thaught that they wanted to make it this way:
    Although you can buy non-raid gear with it, raid-gear will not be available for valor.
    The only thing you can use valor for on raid gear is increasing ilvl. How much, I don't know. But I can imagine that it will not be much, otherwise noone will grind the next tier.

    I also agree that the cap is very irritating. We have more ways now of getting valor but the cap is about the same.
    People who just, at a certain point, want to cap valor are done very quickly. Especially since LFR is giving half of it.

    I think we need more details on valor.... it would be great if they used them also in professions. I really think they should do something with professions, now it just seems useless after getting into the first tier.

  4. #4
    The Valor cap did, indeed, suck. I could get Valor capped in one day. Then a friend would want to do heroics with me, and I'd pass on doing them because hte reward was that I'd maybe get a stack of ore if I did 3 dungeons or something.

    I would much rather spend my $15/month by having to earn my way to high-end gear by playing more, rather than raiding one night, Valor capping another, and basically playing 10 days in a month because there was little of substance to do after that.

  5. #5
    Well, it appears that blizz will be doing the whole, last boss higher ilvl at the start of mop (or one of the raids will have lower ilvl), cause there are both 489 and 496 reg raid raid gear, then 502/509 heroic gear. LFR gear is 483. This means that the daily faction vendors do indeed sell normal raid quality gear.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by themaster24 View Post
    So, not sure about anyone else, but I was under the impression that blizz wanted to get away from Valor being used to buy gear and replace it with the ability to upgrade gear ilvl with it. Now the daily factions offer epic gear at the cost of valor. Was anyone else under this impression? Regardless, if they put in epic raid level gear that you can purchase with valor at this tier, I guess we won't see the removal of valor gear this xpac. Mixed emotions on that.
    It'll be far more effecient to get your gear from raiding and then to upgrade that with valor points than ever buying valor gear. Then consider that raid gear has set bonus. Valor is still pretty much a consolation price for those that don't raid or have bad luck with drops.

    edit: no valor cap was awful in t11. I was our main sub healer on our 25 man team and any time we were missing someone my warrior got shafted on raid gear and valor points becuase you could only get so many from running dungeons. I was penalized for helping my guild. It's an awful system and there's a reason blizzard got rid of it.
    Last edited by fengosa; 2012-07-04 at 09:23 AM.

  7. #7
    Bloodsail Admiral WarpKnight's Avatar
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    I agree. Valor cap is a horrible system and should be discarded. It discourages people from logging on - the tinfoil hat guy in me screams that Blizz is trying to prolong content while having us all pay for subs because everything is time-gated via this damn cap.
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  8. #8
    Warchief Sinndra's Avatar
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    maybe its possible to buy a full set of beginner gear with valor, ive not actually looked at every single vendor (my main focus is trying out some of the cool mounts first).. but at a cost of having to daily rep grind several factions. will raiders use this?.. of course they will. but its more inline with giving players different options to get gear.. which is what they said their ultimate goal was. and this is proof. raiders will use this "lesser" gear just as they will use LFR stuff.. to help speed up progression in Norms and HC. so the bigger picture here is getting worthwhile rewards to a larger audience of players. not everybody raids.. so their reward will be the lesser rep faction pieces.
    Quote Originally Posted by ablib View Post
    I do realize that this is an internet forum full of morons, however in real life, no one questions me, people look to me for the answer, look up to me, trust me. To have dipshits on a video game forum question me, is insulting.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by fengosa View Post
    It'll be far more effecient to get your gear from raiding and then to upgrade that with valor points than ever buying valor gear. Then consider that raid gear has set bonus. Valor is still pretty much a consolation price for those that don't raid or have bad luck with drops.
    It's not about efficiency. Also, only 5 pieces of the gear is a part of the set bonus. My point was is that they seem to have done an about face on this. Don't get me wrong, I'm aware that things change very easily in beta/development. TBH, having both raid quality gear purchasable via valor and this new system just defeats the whole purpose of introducing the new system. The is what blizz said the point of the news system was:

    "Over time, we have felt like Valor has taken on too prominent a role, to the point that it risks becoming more important than actual boss loot. This is particularly the case when the tier sets are available on the Valor vendors. We think killing dragons and ransacking their hoard is more epic than shopping at the magic armor store, so we want to shift back toward boss kills being the primary source of epic PvE gear."

    Currently, with the faction vendors available atm, you can buy an item for iirc every slot but chest and weapon. Yet there's still at least 1 more faction that hasn't been implemented that is supposed to have epics, although if they keep to what they said about that faction, you use tokens from their specific dailies for their vendor.

    Don't know what to call this other than a complete about face lol.

    ---------- Post added 2012-07-04 at 09:38 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Sinndra View Post
    maybe its possible to buy a full set of beginner gear with valor, ive not actually looked at every single vendor (my main focus is trying out some of the cool mounts first).. but at a cost of having to daily rep grind several factions. will raiders use this?.. of course they will. but its more inline with giving players different options to get gear.. which is what they said their ultimate goal was. and this is proof. raiders will use this "lesser" gear just as they will use LFR stuff.. to help speed up progression in Norms and HC. so the bigger picture here is getting worthwhile rewards to a larger audience of players. not everybody raids.. so their reward will be the lesser rep faction pieces.
    But the gear from the vendors isn't lesser. It's the same level as gear from raids. Now, as I said earlier, atm, the raids offer both 489 and 496 gear, which is most likely a simple end bosses drop higher ilvl gear thing. So what they've done is possibly put some of the best pieces you can get this tier, for all slots except chest and weapon (as well as heroic gear), on vendors that require you to grind rep. If they are going to go back on what they said like this, I'd rather them just have a valor vendor like on live. As it is now though, it's all to similar to the whole MF situation in D3. While not every raider in all of WoW will feel they are being forced to do these dailies, most will be.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Synstir View Post
    The only thing you can use valor for on raid gear is increasing ilvl. How much, I don't know. But I can imagine that it will not be much, otherwise noone will grind the next tier.
    It doesn't matter how much you can upgrade ilvl with valor ... the next tier will start at a higher base and, therefore, can be upgraded to a higher cap ...

    As in (example numbers): ilvl 400 tier upgraded to ilvl 420. Well ilvl 413 tier gets upgraded to ilvl 433. Will always be a reason to go for upgrades.

  11. #11
    To the people saying this contradicts their stated goals of reducing the importance of valour, I feel I should point out that this really is a reward for getting the rep, rather than get the valour. The only reason the pieces are costing valour is so that the rate of acquisition is controlled.

    TL;DR It doesn't contradict what they said about valour being less important because getting the required rep is the important part.

  12. #12
    Fluffy Kitten Millennía's Avatar
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    I am a bit confused by it in a way because they said that one of the reasons for removing head enchants entirely and shoulder enchants is because they don't want to force people into a certain faction first because they have to but buy adding certain gear on vendors then you are still forcing people because they will go with the faction that has the best upgrades for their character.

  13. #13
    Pandaren Monk Anyankha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Millennía View Post
    I am a bit confused by it in a way because they said that one of the reasons for removing head enchants entirely and shoulder enchants is because they don't want to force people into a certain faction first because they have to but buy adding certain gear on vendors then you are still forcing people because they will go with the faction that has the best upgrades for their character.
    I think this whole revered-with-x-faction+VP is a PH system, since the rep items were gonna be bought with special tokens u were supposed to get with the dailies. Makes no sense to have rep+VP and keeping the VP cap at 1000/week.
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Millennía View Post
    I am a bit confused by it in a way because they said that one of the reasons for removing head enchants entirely and shoulder enchants is because they don't want to force people into a certain faction first because they have to but buy adding certain gear on vendors then you are still forcing people because they will go with the faction that has the best upgrades for their character.
    Well, it's a little bit less of an issue now. Before it was (literally -- I saw posts in my two guilds' forums, or maybe I made them haha, posing this very question), "Do I go for (faction with my head enchant) or (faction with the most gear upgrades) ?" whereas in Mists it'll just be, "(whoever) has my best upgrades".

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Anyankha View Post
    I think this whole revered-with-x-faction+VP is a PH system, since the rep items were gonna be bought with special tokens u were supposed to get with the dailies. Makes no sense to have rep+VP and keeping the VP cap at 1000/week.
    Those 2 factions haven't been implemented yet. Those are the Craftsmen and the Elders. Their dailies are supposed to reward faction specific tokens. The elders were/are to give "power items", essentially gear, plus the token for extra chances at loot on any boss. The craftsmen were/are to give purely cosmetic items, like pets and transmog shit. I agree with the last part though. I think what they should do with the factions on beta atm is give them tokens similar to the FL dailies. Then they can have the other 2 that have their own tokens. This way valor is reserved for it's purpose of upgrading your gear.

  16. #16
    I am Murloc! The Glitch's Avatar
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    I just dislike the use of *points* I know it's silly really, but I much prefered getting badges. it felt better. I also prefered the way it worked back in TBC, I don't mind not getting raid gear from badges/valor but some nice vendor gear blues or epics it makes no difference so long as its progress over heroic dungeon gear, would be nice.

    I liked grinding out badges and being able to grind for as short or as long as i wanted, was good to beable to choose your own pace. what suited you, where as now you are forced to follow a path that someone else thought was *best*.

    I swear since they turned badges into points its really made me lose interest.

    (Sorry I know my point wasn't an exact match with what most of you are talking about, but I wanted to air my opinion on the points)

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