Enchanters are already at a disadvantage because most of our mats for the good enchants comes from group content. On top of the mats being harder to acquire, we then "give" 80% of the mats to other people. Sound fair?
Now obviously, everybody in the group is entitled to the item that dropped (provided it isn't an upgrade for anyone). But does that mean that everybody is entitled to the shard/crystal that only the enchanter can make? That's where it gets fuzzy.
The fact is, I can (hypothetically) group with an enchanter from my realm, gather a bunch of mats using THEIR profession, take the mats to THEM, and get a high-end enchant using the mats that THEY created all for a measly tip. I call that "using" someone.
Those other four people helped me get the item. I think they deserve a fair roll on the shard.
The reason enchanting itself is profitable is because of low cost of mats. If you want to go back to the days of 5 figure prices for power torrent, be my guest, but big costs don't really go paired with big profits per se. The disenchant button is a nice way to have a decent amount of cheap mats flowing into the economy. If you want it to be removed best you can ask for is make disenchanting a seperate profession.
What happened before the disenchant button? Everyone greeded on greens (and blues/purples if nobody needed), sometimes the enchanter would shard everything and have people roll off at the end. If not, everyone would vendor the gear they won.
What happens now? Greens and other drops that people don't want are sharded automatically, people vendoring them if no de is present.
Nowhere along the line did those mats suddenly become property of the enchanter. It took a group effort to down that boss, so the group will roll off of them. Nothing has changed. Also, I love how enchanters bitch about "amg getting mats is soooo hard, i needz them!!1". Well, what does a greater influx of mats mean? That's right, cheaper prices. It's just another one of those things that people bicker about for no logical reason. And if you wanna pout about people skinning shit in instances and you not being able to roll on it - well, guess what? That skinner can go easily round up a mountain of mobs, aoe them down, and then get the exact same materials from them. Where can you get shards? Instances.
Having said that - what would happen if all skinning, mining and herbing done in instances went to a random instead of the skinner, miner or herbie ?
Would that be ok ?
Blizzard should probably implement rolling on skinning, mining, herbing, and deconstructing (engineer thing) to make it fair.
Or, give the enchanter a bonus enchanting mat, like so:
Everybody rolls, the non-enchanter wins the DE, then both the non-enchanter and the enchanter get their own copy of the DE mat.
With 2 max level enchanters I have no issue with the current setup. I'd like, however, to be able to have a Disenchant button available when I'm soloing old content so I don't have to DE it myself later.
Having max level toons in other professions does piss me off when it comes to BoE recipes I do not have. I wish someone with that profession who has not learned the recipe could roll need and it would become BoP and they could learn it, while the rest of the group could only roll greed. If they have the recipe learned then by all means gray out their ability to roll 'need' and let the group FFA roll it out for the AH/alts/guildmates/etc. I twice saw one of the rare enchanting schematics before I'd learned them in a 5man and lost one of the two rolls (50agi to bracers) to someone who left the group seconds after winning the roll.
Why do Enchanters feel like they own every piece of unwanted gear in the instance?
First off, no one should be rolling need or DE on BoE greens.
In the case of BoP drops from bosses, you young folks may not remember, but it was very common for these shards to be rolled upon at the end of an instance. Any enchanter who refused to do this would quickly find himself blackballed from the PuG scene.
Either de-enchanting should be made a separate proffesion... and for good messure also have an new gathering proffesion for cloth.
Or otherwise have the other gathering profs rolled into the crafting ones: skinning into leatherworking, herbalist into alchemy and inscription, and lastly minning into JC, forge and engi
However, you don't get a 'raw' node or something with no enchanter. These are not analogousInstances with mining nodes, herbs, and skinnable creatures don't have a feature for the mining node to be mined for the group. If a miner is present he gets that node for himself.
If you hadn't been able to use his DE to get mats, you wouldn't be able to go to him for the enchant, which means he would never have gotten your tip. It costs him literally nothing to DE the mats during the run.
There is absolutely zero negative impact to having this option in the game. Not to the community, not to the game, and not to the economy.
It is selfish only when I have the same choice as everyone else, and then deny others that opportunity.
I have neither at this point.
Doesn't cost a miner or herbalist to gather, but they still don't have to share.
So your point is what exactly ?
You have none.
Our source of materials is by far the most viable from one which unlike anyone else has to be competed for with a group, and with far lesser rate of return than anyone else's.
Ours is reliant on groups, yours is not.
Ours is therefore forcing us into competition.
Yours is not.
Last edited by ComputerNerd; 2012-07-12 at 05:00 AM.
I like the DE button. I just think it would be fair to the enchanter if there was a roll bonus (15 or 20) that allowed them to benefit more from their own profession than the people who aren't enchanters.
I cannot get into this again. I have said my piece. Mining gets smelting for what? What does Smelting have to do with mining? Isn't that a Blacksmiths job? I don't see coal miners refining coal. So why does Mining get Smelting? Mining also gets slight stat benefits. Seems pretty slated.