What happened to the horde?

[Auxora]

Everyone else kind of hit it on the head. EMFH led to mass horde->ally transfers of the better horde pvp'ers, which lead to alliance winning more. That fed more xfers because people generally like to win and many (many) went to the fotm ally side for pvp. In pvp it's also a bad cycle because as one side wins more it just exaggerates the advantage as they get more hp/cp at a faster rate and the gear advantage becomes greater.

For folks that say "I won 5 in a row yesterday", that's great but you just got lucky in a small sample size. Overall Alliance across all bgs and realms is winning at least about a 60/40 clip, and it's probably a bit higher imho. Thankfully I'm on a realm and faction that dominates TB, which helps offset the pain. We'll see how the wpvp in MoP goes, without a realm-specific bg like we had with Wintergrasp and Tol Barad. The new undead racial might also help balance it out. I REALLY don't want to have to play pve horde and pvp alliance just to not get rofl'stomped all the time in standard BGs, and that's bad balance on Blizz's part if that's the case.

[Justignoreme]

@OP

Welcome to the skill-level of the current playerbase. This is the world of the casuals now... dont expect it to change any time soon :P

Bgs were always the playground for casuals, always.

[Deleted]

I'm pretty happy with my win ratio (alliance). But last weekend i lost 14 bg's in a row :/

[Deleted]

good horde pvp players wait for guild wars 2. me and my guild (50 ppl) cancelled account for quit in favor of guild wars 2. Wow is not innovative anymore under pvp aspect so that's why many good players quitted.

[Thalais]

http://www.wowhead.com/spell=59752,

This happened to the Horde.

Second this.
Nothing is more OP than a DPS that has higher def than you and deals more damage than you.
Human Racial is the most OP racial in the game for PvP because it gives you more OVERALL bonuses than any other racial could.
Now in PvE, humans have some of the worst racials in the game. I personally think the human racial needs to only remove Stuns & Incaps. This works like the racial the gnomes have and make the human racial a 1 min 30 sec cd.

---------- Post added 2012-07-26 at 12:18 PM ----------

When I play on my Alliance Shaman, I really only want AV & Isles. Why? Because horde don't play well in BG's which there isn't much PvP action.
When I play EotS, WSG, AB, any of the 2 new places, I have below 50% win ratio compared to my 90% win ratio with the 2 largest BGs

[meathead]

cry me a river with your human racial is so OP'ed bull shit.why should it be nerfed?to make another race of your choice have the best racial in game?the orc racial scales now,its gives over 1000 AP if im not mistaken,right?thats like having a 2nd trinket and in some cases a 3rd trinket "pve" in its self,so you better nerf that 1 to.

if you do not like the way the horde plays in pvp/bgs then stay out of it.

[Nicola]

cry me a river with your human racial is so OP'ed bull shit.why should it be nerfed?to make another race of your choice have the best racial in game?the orc racial scales now,its gives over 1000 AP if im not mistaken,right?thats like having a 2nd trinket and in some cases a 3rd trinket "pve" in its self,so you better nerf that 1 to.

if you do not like the way the horde plays in pvp/bgs then stay out of it.

You sound like a 1.2k rated human frostdk to me....

Human racial completely nullifies the need of a pvp trinket while the orc racial is just a small dps boost, one that's highly outdone by the current pve trinkets because it's not a %-based increase.

I have no problem at all with some racials being stronger then other but the human racial is pretty gamebreaking at higher rating due pve trinkets being vastly superior to the current pvp trinkets. The difference in damage done by me with CotC hc + pvp trinket and CoTC hc + WoU hc or CotC hc + IotC is very big.
For casters, the human racial pretty much allows you to have an extra 990 int or 517 int + 3278 haste proc! That's a crapload compared to the 584 spellpower the orc racial...

In my case, using WoU instead of a 2nd pvp trinket, gives me a 15% increase in intellect and bout 1.5% extra crit. No other racial can come even close to this. Every racials give less then 1.5% dps increase while this racial easily crosses a 10% damageincrease in pvp for casters.

[Itisamuh]

Anyone who's PvP'ed a lot through the years can tell you it comes in waves. Horde will dominate for a few months, then it shifts and suddenly Alliance is. Some days it's pretty even, but for the most part it's trendy, and evens out over a stretch of time. I do think Alliance have had the better end of the stick for most of Cataclysm. Ever since that several month period where BG queues were bugged and Blizzard wouldn't fix it, a ton of people transferred to Alliance and they've had higher quality players ever since. And they've always had more healers. Then there's the fact that AV and, to a lesser extent, IoC are inherently Alliance-favored by design. And they have better racials. But still, it's not as bad as some will have you believe.

[Thalais]

As Niberion said, the human racial is so OP in PvP that i will boldly say it is more powerful than all the hordes combined for PvP.

If the horde was ranked they would be an 5 out of 10 compared to the 10 out of 10 human racial.
As of right now, there is only 1 racial in MoP that could counter the human racial and that is the Panda racial for food being double the property.

The human racial just gives too much DPS gain from the extra trinket that they could either increase their resilience or increase damage burst

[meathead]

You sound like a 1.2k rated human frostdk to me....

Human racial completely nullifies the need of a pvp trinket while the orc racial is just a small dps boost, one that's highly outdone by the current pve trinkets because it's not a %-based increase.

I have no problem at all with some racials being stronger then other but the human racial is pretty gamebreaking at higher rating due pve trinkets being vastly superior to the current pvp trinkets. The difference in damage done by me with CotC hc + pvp trinket and CoTC hc + WoU hc or CotC hc + IotC is very big.
For casters, the human racial pretty much allows you to have an extra 990 int or 517 int + 3278 haste proc! That's a crapload compared to the 584 spellpower the orc racial...

In my case, using WoU instead of a 2nd pvp trinket, gives me a 15% increase in intellect and bout 1.5% extra crit. No other racial can come even close to this. Every racials give less then 1.5% dps increase while this racial easily crosses a 10% damageincrease in pvp for casters.

lmfao,nice try at a cheap shot slick dick,but your not even close.the human racial is fine as is.like i said b4,i want the orc racial nerfed because it is a dps increase,unlike humans.orcs racial is more then just a small dps increase,its like having landslide on your weapon.actully its stronger then landslide,blood fury is what 1169 ap,lmfao nerf it. dont give me that crap about not needing a pvp trinket as human,thats just the way it is.orcs make the best dps class in pve,right?so bang nerf them,its only fair.i play a human and i think its unfair orcs have 3 dps trinkets,see what id id there?you dont see me crying because everything being equal,an orc can out dps a human.

i bet you liked it/would like it if blizz made the human racial useless again.how about this give humans blood fury so we can get the almost 1200ap,that would be fair right?then we could also change the human +rep racial for hardness "orc" because i think its unfair that orcs have better stun resist then humans.so if we changed that,then we would have to change our little friends the gnome racial.then we could change blood elfs racial Arcane Torrent, because we dont want blood elfs to be able to silence and stun lock anyone down to zero in mop.

hell why we are at it,why just not make all racials in the game the same;that would be fun.

[Dazzlie]

I've always been told Horde was for PvE and Alliance for PvP. As simplified and narrowminded as it may have been there might be some truth in it after all.

[meathead]

As Niberion said, the human racial is so OP in PvP that i will boldly say it is more powerful than all the hordes combined for PvP.

If the horde was ranked they would be an 5 out of 10 compared to the 10 out of 10 human racial.
As of right now, there is only 1 racial in MoP that could counter the human racial and that is the Panda racial for food being double the property.

The human racial just gives too much DPS gain from the extra trinket that they could either increase their resilience or increase damage burst

here come the humans with there OP'ed racial s run!

there is great pvpers on both sides,play what you like.if they made the human racial worthless again,and yes it was worthless,what then?everyone knows orcs and humans make the best dps races.if you changed humans then you have to change orcs.

you guys are acting like you cant kill a human player in pvp.i have been killed by every race and every class in pvp b4.does that mean said class and racial is OP'ed?no,it means they killed me.again their is top pvpers on both sides,pvp is so F'ed up in wow "and its only going to get worse in mop" and you guys want to bitch about racials.racials is the least of wow pvp problems,you want balance,then start with classes,not racial's.

---------- Post added 2012-07-26 at 11:18 PM ----------

I've always been told Horde was for PvE and Alliance for PvP. As simplified and narrowminded as it may have been there might be some truth in it after all.

for years i heard horde was/is the best pvp fraction in wow.then you look up your own win/loss ratio in bgs and see everything is pretty balanced.one thing i do think happened,is when blizz allowed fraction x-fers.i think alot of little kids/bad pvpers went horde thinking they would get a free ride in bgs,but thats not the case.i use to think horde was the best pvp fraction myself.so i made a horde alt and seen that its all the same.

[painweaver]

Bgs were always the playground for casuals, always.

I'm guessing you haven't been playing this game for very long...

[Cows For Life]

I should hope that it's obvious that EMFH has a certain draw to the min-maxers. Combine with newly available faction changing and you get this mess. That and alliance have always had more healers in random BG's for whatever reason.

It's funny how the clueless blues will drone on about realizing how powerful PVE trinkets can be in PVP and completely stay silent on their decision to let one race use TWO of them without any drawbacks.

Part of me thinks they'll nerf it next expansion and give something similar to another race to try and extract more money from the min-maxers.

[Flaks]

EMFH is a great racial. It's only problem is that it's unique to one race. The ability should be baseline for EVERYONE. PvP trinkets are mandatory in PvP. There should be a beginner tool tip telling new players how/when to use that specific ability. It would go a long way in balancing the game for everyone. Give humans a new racial that is beneficial in both PvE and PvP like blood fury.

[inboundpaper]

Both my Warrior and Death Knight have around a 40% win rate from a lot of time as both factions, so clearly the other side always wins.

[marinos]

If you are good at pvp not being human wont cause you a problem to get high rating.If you are bad,then you come here and make a thread and the rest of the baddies join to qq with you.

[meathead]

If you are good at pvp not being human want cause you a problem to get high rating.If you are bad,then you come here and make a thread and the rest of the baddies join to qq with you.

bingo!well said!racials do not make wow's pvp unbalanced,the class/skills do that.its really dumb some people cry about the human racial.like i said b4,its not like you cant kill a human player in pvp.again,orcs racial is the best dps racial in game,you cant dispute that at all.its like having 3 trinkets in pve "best in game" and 2 trinkets in pvp.1200ap from blood fury,is hands down the strongest dps increase in the game.give humans blood fury and i would be happy.

RUN HERE COME THE HUMANS AND THEIR OP'ED RACIALS!

[Justignoreme]

I'm guessing you haven't been playing this game for very long...

Lol curb your arrogance

I've been playing this game for, over 5 years. Rated BGs are new to cata and are in a class by themselves anyways. BGs were always for casuals; you hop on, queue up for whatever BG you needed medals from and grinded them out in the timeframe you had and that was it. The ease of getting gear through BGs was a point of contention when S2 gear, easily farmed out of BGs was better than anything tier 4 for PvE purposes. You have anything else you care to bring? Or are you content with ignorant one-liners which offer nothing constructive?

[Rorke]

EMFH isn't really the problem. The problem is that in wotlk there was no insignia trinkets that have a chance to increase your strength/intellect/agility by X amount. When Cataclysm launched, the insignia trinkets were released and were taken advantage of by good players. I'm pretty sure somewhere around that time or maybe late in wotlk blizzard made EMFH a 2 minute cd. Now with 4.3, human players use the insignia trinket as is or replace it with an X pve trinket at the loss of resilience.

Horde was the dominant faction in wotlk. There were some really superb alliance players they were probably around the 2% of the entire faction, but back then most people considered the horde to be the "place to go" for pvp. At lot of older players were horde and this stemmed back since Vanilla wow. Old Horde were very elitist and competitive, very hipster with the fact that they play "the ugly races". Old horde hated the addition of Blood elves for that reason. They weren't "unique" or special anymore and didn't want the "alliance kiddies" joining their ranks. The next point I would like to bring up are the "Youtube/Twitch Stars" and how they impacted the pvp community.

Back in Wotlk there were popular Youtubers for sure, but they weren't really known as well by the pvp community as they are today. Plus you also have to take into affect that faction changing didn't exist until 3.2.0. Most people who pvp'd just stuck with horde for the rest of the expac anyway. For some odd reason when Cataclysm Launched, these Youtube players got much more popular. Maybe it was because the game changed and people were looking for the best tips to play the game. I really don't know. Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that people wanted to either play with or compete with those Youtube stars and become part of the drama scene. That led to these overpopulated pvp servers like KT, Tich, Sargeras, Darkspear. Then there was this whole TTTT "Together to the Top" crap from idiots like Athene that horsed around weaker minded idiots into believing they could be apart of the scene. Just really stop and look at all of those famous pvpers. Almost all of them play Alliance now.

It created a community. Part of it in my opinion is that somewhere during in late wotlk, the young (18-21 year old) FPS crowd began to play wow and pvp. You can go on KT now and then watch old Youtube videos from BC or wotlk and you can see how the community has changed. Most good pvper's today, are playing female humans, half of them have "qt" in their name and the non human classes are either dwarves are Draenie. You get all of these trolls shouting "Free swifty" and other people wasting their time talking about how Samulex farmed Woundman or how X warrior is better than Y. Pretty much dominated by younger people, and now the older people have either moved on with the game or join in the fray as Alliance players.

The old horde still exists. Some of them exist on Illidan/Kil'jaeden. If you BG on US you'll almost notice that most horde players are either from Kil'jaeden or Illidan. But most of them just switched up to Alliance. This again are my theories why Horde suck now. They are not facts, but from my experiences only.