I feel like the 2% spell damage reduction Meta gem is much stronger then the 2% armor at the moment, you gain what 1000 armor? Thoughts?
"One of our goals with our active mitigation tanking model is that you have opportunities to trade significant survivability for more damage when maximum survivability isn’t required. For example, a Warrior could opt to use their rage for Heroic Strike instead of Shield Block or Shield Barrier. This damage gain is intended to be relatively small, and not worth the loss in survivability when actively tanking.
However, for Protection Paladins, this trade-off was much too lucrative. For maximum survivability, Protection Paladins are intended to use Seal of Insight, since it provides a buff to their self-healing, and also provides a significant self-heal on their melee in combination with Vengeance. Unfortunately, when using Seal of Insight, their damage was too low compared to the other tanks. When using Seal of Truth, their damage was too high. So, we've increased Protection Paladin damage in general to compensate for Seal of Insights relatively low output, while simultaneously reducing the damage of Seal of Truth to bring it into line.
Holy Wrath now deals 100% more damage.
Avenger's Shield now deals 50% more damage.
Seal of Truth and Censure now deal 80% less damage for Protection Paladins only."
Blizzard intents for Seal of Insight to be used for maximum survival? Personally... I have never used Seal of Insight, Because it heals for so little even with Vengeance, and 5% extra healing is not a lot anyhow.. would the SoT/Censure nerf not just push us towards using Seal of the Righteous as our base seal? The other buffs to Holy Wrath and Avengers Shield are always nice and well received though.
Last edited by RexalLB; 2012-10-03 at 02:05 AM.
I dunno, I'm sure I've seen SoI heal for over 15k in 5mans, and it appears to proc off HotR splash too (confirmation required though). Would heal for considerably more with high vengeance levels (i.e. over 50k). Using SoI would make certain glyphs rather more attractive too...
Intel i5 2500K (4.5 GHz) | Asus Z77 Sabertooth | 16GB Corsair Vengeance LP 1600MHz | Gigabyte Windforcex3 HD 7950 | Crucial M4 128GB | Crucial M550 256GB | Asus Xonar DGX | Samson SR 850 | Zalman ZM-Mic1 | Western Digital Caviar Black 2000GB | Noctua NH-U12P SE2 | Fractal Design Arc Midi | Corsair HX650
Former author of the TankSpot.com Protection Paladin guide
The 100% buff to holy wrath makes the glyph of final wrath more attractive. According to Theck's sims, it was already out 3rd best DPS glyph (after arbablester shield and focussed shield).
I think the guide needs amending - the dps increase is not "tiny". Well, in gearing we do deal with small numbers but relatively speaking, I would not say it's a useless glyph. At least, I'm using it as it's a decent glyph for dps and the alternatives for the third slot (after arbalester shield and divine protection) are not compelling for me.
Damage during the execute phase can often be particularly important, as it shortens enrage periods and often synchronises with heroism/bloodlust.Originally Posted by Theckhd
Because of the high frequency of negativity and overall "my class/race/faction sucks" (both for IRL and ingame issues) across all boards, I have reverted to primarily lurking and only posting when I need help. I'm hoping this can be fixed, but if I don't do this, I will likely end up depressed and disgusted with humanity as a whole.
If we are supposed to use Seal of Insight now, glyph of battle healing is worth considering. Someone reported topping healing meters for a 5 man with it, so it may have a bigger impact than the typical glyph.
changes changes changes....
So with the recent tank changes im now thinking of using SoI as default seal and taking the following glyphs: Alabaster / Final Wrath / Battle Healer.
Stat priority: hit to 7.5% > Mastery > exp to 7.5% > haste = parry > dodge
Talents: HA and LH for extra cd loveliness.
Will be raiding for first time tonight and will report back results. Anyone care to critique?
That obviously leaves the magical spike issue, but even then the magical spell is hardly deadly on it's own. It's the combo melee hit + magic skill + melee hit that's deadly. And we have cooldowns to take care of those.
Overall, yes magic meta can be useful but unless you are willing to go around with two helms, one with magic and one with armor meta, then you'll get more use out of the armor meta in the long run.
No point in exp soft cap. It doesn't consern us tanks anymore. At all. If exp is better than haste then stack it up to hardcap (15%) as it'll prety much keeps the same value all the way up there.
Theck's last post on damage smoothing pretty much nails the coffin over the issue. Set #8 (heavy mastery with hit cap and hard exp cap) is pretty much the best hands down.
With set #7(trading exp for haste) arguably useful, once you start to overgear the content or for other DPS issues ( ...enrage).
(I think that past the point where you can trade #7 survivability for moar dps you are pretty much at the point were it doesn't matter anymore, just put pure DPS gear on )
Last edited by ayashi; 2012-10-05 at 01:36 PM.
Thank you kind sir
Is there any logic to having haste so low on your priorities while all theory crafting suggests that haste is on-par if not even better than mastery for hardcore raiding? It just seems like you are not willing to adapt and look at the facts. The fact that you even have on your guide an "Avoidance stat priority" seems to me quite odd. Its basically the most useless gearing right now. And as stated before, you do not even have a Haste Stat Priority.
Also why are you not even prioritising Glyph of Battle Healer even as a "good" glyph, it is just insane.
In my opinion Long Arm of the Law is far better option than the pursuit of justice on most fights as very few fights require consistant moving and the LAotL allows me to move alot faster when I actually need to move. 45% speed vs 15-30% speed depending on stacks is a clear choice for me.
I really disagree with your use of lights prism, for me that just seems incredibly stupid. Lights Hammer just works so much better for raiding and dungeons. The spell is just so much more versitile and useful.
All in all, your guide as a nice structure, but it is really really outdated and needs to be overlooked before it misguides fresh protection paladins. You should try to look at paladins with a fresh eye instead of being to conservative.
Last edited by Firefly33; 2012-10-07 at 01:51 PM.
About to do a bunch of updates once I pull my stuff out of the washing machine - I'll add in the haste build, shorten the avoidance section and add an extra bit about Lights Hammer. Reason being that I have to do some larger updating anyway because the expertise hardcap is the way to go now as well by the looks of things. Will also add a paragraph about seals, considering that SoI is now a very used (possibly more so than truth? Need clarification from someone who is doing so) ability, and therefore Glyph of the Battle Healer is great.
Thanks for the clarification you 2 About to do the updates now, had to educate an Australian of all people, in beer adverts. Due to that minor inconvenience, my washing was delayed but I'm now done so I'll go edit.
This reality is not conducive to guides as we know it, because the typical WoW forum guide culture is based entirely on lifting information uncritically from sources that are considered definitive (for example, pretty much the entirety of Icy Veins is like that). While that's perfectly fine for playing at a very low level being first introduced to something, there is so much nuance and subtlety to playing at a really high level and the demands placed on you situationally in those scenarios, that I'm just afraid protection paladin is a spec that is not conducive to this kind of treatment anymore.
Aside from that, I don't really know what else to do other than to just highlight all the available options. We could just abandon the thread but that seems somewhat counter productive as we'd get lots of little threads here and there. The misinformation is only classed as that because things change and things are going to change, like a lot, so the best I can do is to edit them out and bring the new and correct answer in as soon as I have the time and it becomes apparent.
---------- Post added 2012-10-10 at 06:05 PM ----------
Gah I got distracted, will try and update now quickly before food.