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  1. #201
    Titan MerinPally's Avatar
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    I'm so excited, this is the nerdiest day of my life knowing that I wrote the OP's

    Could we get a title change to "Guide" or something rather than Talents and Glyphs? ^^
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...nicus/advanced
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Oh shut the fuck up you spack cunt.

  2. #202
    Moderator Malthanis's Avatar
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    Done. Also, the WoWDB now has it's own talent calculator, and at the risk of sounding like a Curse shill, I like it a lot better than WoWhead's. It also looks like it'll be kept up to date using the data-mining from the Curse client, so I daresay it might be updated faster than WoWhead's too. I'd recommend altering your links to point to it (also, it has shiny tooltips!).

  3. #203
    Titan MerinPally's Avatar
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    Anything that is shiny comes above all else. I just transmuted a hideously large number of Inferno Rubies in preparation for tomorrow to regem (and I got a 5 proc!) but this takes priority. Doing it now. Thanks for the title adjustment.

    Edit: Links fixed!
    Last edited by MerinPally; 2012-08-28 at 02:39 PM.
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...nicus/advanced
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
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  4. #204
    Moderator Malthanis's Avatar
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    I've also gone ahead and deleted my posts at the start of the thread, so you have the first few posts all to yourself.

  5. #205
    I've been reading on different websites that Mastery is still better than Dodge & Parry. Are you sure that Mastery is the third stat to prioritize?

  6. #206
    Mechagnome ayashi's Avatar
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    @ Zerdus: on a absolute physical damage reduction point of view, yes.
    Mastery is strictly worse than avoidance (dodge/parry) in that case, but as said a few times in the thread, mastery build will give you more control and smouth your damage intake, which is arguably more important that taking 1-2% less damage overall.

    Theck roundup post which is always a good read.
    He links to an other guide, but i've found plenty of small mistakes in it ... dafuq?


    [note] Merrin, the guide might benefit from a "what should i use" part.
    For exemple seals. Light for self-healing and progress where dps is not the issue. Truth for single target. Rightousness for AoE (4 and more targets).
    Lastly, a Rotation and/or HP usage part ? My suggestion would be:
    CS->J->X -> CS->X->J -> CS->X->X, siting on your SoR's WoG buffs, and stacking HP up to 5 before using them, so that you will always have at the very least 2HP and will only ge one GCD away from a SoR or a buffed WoG if something goes wrong.
    Last edited by ayashi; 2012-08-29 at 12:52 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    the average wow player is only a step above eating glue and a step below doing basic addition. Right about being able to operate scissors fairly properly is the sweet spot.

  7. #207
    Titan MerinPally's Avatar
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    @ Zerdus, seems Ayashi (he's either American or doesn't sleep (or australian!)) has answered your question.

    @ Ayashi, yeah I will add that section, I was actually planning to wait until the EU servers come up so I can have a more indepth play then get it done before the raid tonight as I felt more comfortable testing it on live rather than PTR due to various issues. Rotation and then Seals was the last section I was planning to add
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...nicus/advanced
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Oh shut the fuck up you spack cunt.

  8. #208
    after the servers came up today in EU and after all the fuss with "Character Not Found" issues, i got in to my Prot Pala, and noticed that Im WAY off on the CTC, I lost over 40% according to my Datainfo Plugin. and this is the Stats I have now
    Dodge: 13.10%
    Parry: 28.44%
    Block: 34.61%

    and the stats I had before patch was:
    Dodge: 16,32%
    Parry: 17,60%
    Block: 62,86%

    I know that we get from Shield of Righteous a dmg reduction based on our mastery
    but the duration isnt all that great (3sec) considering we need 3 HP to use it, and it has a 1½sec CD
    But I can be wrong. And I havent dared to do anything with my gear before i check with the community...
    so I would appriciate anyhelp and suggestions

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by Thylos View Post
    after the servers came up today in EU and after all the fuss with "Character Not Found" issues, i got in to my Prot Pala, and noticed that Im WAY off on the CTC, I lost over 40% according to my Datainfo Plugin. and this is the Stats I have now
    Dodge: 13.10%
    Parry: 28.44%
    Block: 34.61%

    and the stats I had before patch was:
    Dodge: 16,32%
    Parry: 17,60%
    Block: 62,86%

    I know that we get from Shield of Righteous a dmg reduction based on our mastery
    but the duration isnt all that great (3sec) considering we need 3 HP to use it, and it has a 1½sec CD
    But I can be wrong. And I havent dared to do anything with my gear before i check with the community...
    so I would appriciate anyhelp and suggestions
    It is no longer a goal of ours to achieve full CTC because it's not really possible anymore.

    Use the stat priority in the OP and you should be fine.
    Last edited by Maester; 2012-08-30 at 02:08 AM.

  10. #210
    Titan MerinPally's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thylos View Post
    But I can be wrong. And I havent dared to do anything with my gear before i check with the community...
    so I would appriciate anyhelp and suggestions
    CTC no longer exists, as Zerdus said just follow the stat priority and you'll be fine.

    HOWEVER

    Looking at the stats you had previously, your survival will be fine, and you could do what I did. Just for fun, I reforged to get hit and expertise caps as soon as possible, and then after that followed the stat prioirty - just because for these next 4 weeks, you'll probably be ok as you outgear heroic DS, so you may as well enjoy smashing some faces Is what I did, worked a charm.
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...nicus/advanced
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Oh shut the fuck up you spack cunt.

  11. #211
    Titan Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    So if CTC is no longer necessary and Mastery is no longer king, is it worth it to reforge? Or just deal with it until the 25th?

    And Sacred Shield; if there's a holy paladin the raid with this talent, should I let him place this on me and ignore my own SS cooldown? Or let him place it on the off tank (which in my guild is about 100% guaranteed to be a warrior) and I'll take care of my own?

    If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers. -Cracked.com

  12. #212
    Titan MerinPally's Avatar
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    Sacred Shield stacks so you could kind of do both. What I was doing last night (Although we didn't have a holy paladin) was if only 1 tank was going at the time then I'd sacred shield him if it was him, and then swap back to me when it was me, and I'm sure the hypothetical holy paladin would have done the same. It's all dependent on how much damage the tanks are taking. If you're both taking the same then yeah sure 1 on each, but if there is a major discrepancy, stack them. There's no reason at all not to use your own one, those 2GCD's a minute for all that is nice and it's a wasted talent if you don't.

    And for the reforging... I don't think it's worth it really. I'd recommend getting hit and expertise capped but apart from that just ignore it until the 25th, I was only doing it out of some weird desire to do so.
    Last edited by MerinPally; 2012-08-30 at 12:15 PM.
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...nicus/advanced
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Oh shut the fuck up you spack cunt.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    CTC no longer exists, as Zerdus said just follow the stat priority and you'll be fine.

    HOWEVER

    Looking at the stats you had previously, your survival will be fine, and you could do what I did. Just for fun, I reforged to get hit and expertise caps as soon as possible, and then after that followed the stat prioirty - just because for these next 4 weeks, you'll probably be ok as you outgear heroic DS, so you may as well enjoy smashing some faces Is what I did, worked a charm.
    I will do that and try it out since i have DS raid tonight

  14. #214
    Titan Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    Sacred Shield stacks so you could kind of do both. What I was doing last night (Although we didn't have a holy paladin) was if only 1 tank was going at the time then I'd sacred shield him if it was him, and then swap back to me when it was me, and I'm sure the hypothetical holy paladin would have done the same. It's all dependent on how much damage the tanks are taking. If you're both taking the same then yeah sure 1 on each, but if there is a major discrepancy, stack them. There's no reason at all not to use your own one, those 2GCD's a minute for all that is nice and it's a wasted talent if you don't.

    And for the reforging... I don't think it's worth it really. I'd recommend getting hit and expertise capped but apart from that just ignore it until the 25th, I was only doing it out of some weird desire to do so.
    Alright, I'll tell our holy paladins and let them decide if they want SS or not. I just assumed it didn't stack because I didn't really get a chance to test out whether it stacked and it didn't stack in Wrath. At least, I don't think it did. And yeah I've been using SS every cooldown about, giving more priority only to ShoR and any HP generator.

    If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers. -Cracked.com

  15. #215
    I don't know about you but I'm finding it harder to hold aggro off of another tank now, I just did a guild DS run tonight and our other tank(Bear) was just over there chillin' while I was working my butt off trying to hold my own. I never had this problem pre-patch and I don't know if anybody else has. Here's my guy http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Rorath/simple I don't know if I should just try reforging to hit/exp cap, if tankadins are gimped till 90, or if the bear is leet right now.

  16. #216
    This is great. Now do the PvP part and its complete.
    Rock: "We're sub-standard DPS. Nerf Paper, Scissors are fine."
    Paper: "OMG, WTF, Scissors!"
    Scissors: "Rock is OP and Paper are QQers. We need PvP buffs."

  17. #217
    Mechagnome ayashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Delegon View Post
    I don't know about you but I'm finding it harder to hold aggro off of another tank now, I just did a guild DS run tonight and our other tank(Bear) was just over there chillin' while I was working my butt off trying to hold my own. I never had this problem pre-patch and I don't know if anybody else has. Here's my guy http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Rorath/simple I don't know if I should just try reforging to hit/exp cap, if tankadins are gimped till 90, or if the bear is leet right now.
    Assuming equal gear level, you only have three things :
    -"skill": in this case it's mostly " do you have the new rotation in hand?". It is by far the most probable "problem", missing GCDs , "lagging" behind your GCD and such are a huge overall loss of threat (and dps )
    I know that for myself going from CS every other GCD to every third is weird, SoR/WoG off GCD also makes me "miss" a few GCD because i just forget i can use two skills at the same time at that point. You might also lose some holy power due to how the cap changed from 3 to 5.
    Perhaps bear rotation changed less than ours ? Either way, new rotation mean some time to understand it and get used to it.
    -"touch ratings" : Hit/Exp (hard) cap would obviously help since that'd give you anything up to +20% threat, maybe the other tank is capped or at least have more rating in it than you do. The loss of the SoT glyph is particularly obvious on this point, 10 exp loss, considering how used to it we became.
    -lastly, and somewhat related to the skill thing, maybe you do have the right threat management, and/or do not use all your tools (hand of sacrifice and hand of salvation are skills most tankadins forget about)

    Blues stated that Paladins are mostly were they want them to be, and other tanks are to be brough down (or up) to their level.
    Last edited by ayashi; 2012-09-04 at 09:37 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    the average wow player is only a step above eating glue and a step below doing basic addition. Right about being able to operate scissors fairly properly is the sweet spot.

  18. #218
    Titan MerinPally's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tullkas View Post
    This is great. Now do the PvP part and its complete.
    Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Maybe.

    @Delegon - it's not like it used to be, where your offtank could continue mashing their rotation. If they are continuing their boss rotation, they will get aggro back. They need to sit there and be boring. I noticed this issue but then just told the offtank to stop or I'd do it to him. No problems since. But we have other tools to manage this sort of thing like Hands, and nasty swear words down vent/mumble.
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...nicus/advanced
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Oh shut the fuck up you spack cunt.

  19. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by ayashi View Post
    Assuming equal gear level, you only have three things :
    -"skill": in this case it's mostly " do you have the new rotation in hand?". It is by far the most probable "problem", missing GCDs , "lagging" behind your GCD and such are a huge overall loss of threat (and dps )
    I know that for myself going from CS every other GCD to every third is weird, SoR/WoG off GCD also makes me "miss" a few GCD because i just forget i can use two skills at the same time at that point. You might also lose some holy power due to how the cap changed from 3 to 5.
    Perhaps bear rotation changed less than ours ? Either way, new rotation mean some time to understand it and get used to it.
    -"touch ratings" : Hit/Exp (hard) cap would obviously help since that'd give you anything up to +20% threat, maybe the other tank is capped or at least have more rating in it than you do. The loss of the SoT glyph is particularly obvious on this point, 10 exp loss, considering how used to it we became.
    -lastly, and somewhat related to the skill thing, maybe you do have the right threat management, and/or do not use all your tools (hand of sacrifice and hand of salvation are skills most tankadins forget about)

    Blues stated that Paladins are mostly were they want them to be, and other tanks are to be brough down (or up) to their level.
    Yeah I pretty much have the rotation down, it is a lil getting used to still. Guess I gotta go hit that dungeon grind again to make sure everythings up to par next week. Yeah, I mostly only use my hands just to mess with people, like BoPing the melee or something, guess I better get used to being proactive with em : /
    I just looked and the bear tank is hit capped and almost exp. capped, so I'm gonna do some reforging and see how it goes.
    @MerinPally Haha yeah, I just told him that if this continues in Panda I'm just going to say a few nasty things to the boss then bubble hearth.
    Last edited by Delegon; 2012-09-04 at 03:40 PM.

  20. #220
    Thanks for the guide has made setting up my Paladin cake!

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