1. #881
    Quote Originally Posted by Helai View Post
    I have never enjoyed dodge, parry or mastery. Haste feels amazing. I love it. I'm going to make an eu appeal on the official forums.
    Indeed, that's my point. No one has ever enjoyed dodge, parry and hardly even mastery. The role of haste for a prot paladin this expansion has been one of the best changes to a tank class in a long time. I'll sign your appeal if you get it going, because this shit is just depressing.

  2. #882
    Brewmaster Xothic's Avatar
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    Post a link if you do Helai, I'll post a copy in the US forums, giving you credit obviously.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asphyxes View Post
    Taco dinner, movie at my mancave then I'll surprise her with a TCG tabard and tell her I love her.
    Xothic - Prot Paladin - Expired at the end of 5.1, returned start of 5.4, left again. Returned again, left again, returned again. You know how it is.

  3. #883
    Did my question get overlooked amidst the blue post discussion or is it that stupid of a question?

  4. #884
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonland View Post
    Did my question get overlooked amidst the blue post discussion or is it that stupid of a question?
    All your spells cooldowns are scaled with haste aswell as GCD.

    Your Judgment CD is 4 GCDs
    CS CD is 3 GCDs
    Holy Wrath is 4 GCDs
    etc.

    Making your question kinda irrelevant as you do not have to wait.

    2 exceptions:

    1. You got over 50% haste
    2. You use a spell or item that is not on melee GCD but spell GCD ( i.e. level 90 talents, a heal, cleanse, whatever, you get the point )
    Though the only thing that will do is to delay your next spell.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  5. #885
    Epic! GenaiTN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xothic View Post
    Post a link if you do Helai, I'll post a copy in the US forums, giving you credit obviously.
    Cheers buddy. I will do. I'll post it on my lunch break. I'll make sure it's on the general forums too. Ghostcrawler stated once they don't look at class specific forums.

  6. #886
    The Patient
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    Nerfing haste will be shit. Our dps is already unbelievably low (at least compared to a monk tank) (edit: okay, not unbelievably low, but less than optimal) unless dropping hit and expertise for maximum haste.
    I wonder what this will do to us, make us even worse for 10mans? Most likely so.

    Also, I approve of the video link in the previous page.

  7. #887
    Meanwhile at Blizzard HQ

    Sir! We got reports that paladins are tanking.

    Yes, so?

    And they are enjoying it!

    WHAT?! THIS MUST BE FIXED!
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  8. #888
    Epic! GenaiTN's Avatar
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    Only two points of fun for Paladins tanking.

    Spell Power tanking in TBC.

    Haste tanking in MoP.

    Vanilla? Non existent.
    Wrath? Had its moments.
    Cata? Had its moments.

  9. #889
    Quote Originally Posted by Xothic View Post
    Post a link if you do Helai, I'll post a copy in the US forums, giving you credit obviously.
    You can attach the following to it too if you want (attribution to Fetzie@Maintankadin and TankSpot):

    Quote Originally Posted by Fetzie@Maintankadin/TankSpot
    • Haste gives us more control over our incoming damage. The loss of haste firstly removes any benefit we gain from bloodlust, and makes for a much slower (i.e. more boring) play style
    • Haste allows us to further reduce our damage taken by a reliable amount through the scaling of Sacred Shield
    • There is no way to make Dodge and Parry attractive enough that we would take them over Haste or Mastery. If Haste and Mastery become less attractive than Dodge and Parry all we will do is go back to the Stamina stacking of WotLK
    • Haste makes the game-play more dynamic and more active.
    • Why do we need to have avoidance stats on our gear? Diminishing Returns are so strong even at low rating levels that the amount of avoidance you get per point simply isn't worth it. Why not simply scrap tanking stats altogether and allow all tanks to use a combination of haste, mastery and crit and remove a bit of bloat from the loot tables? We get a lot of Parry from Strength anyway, and two of the 5 tank classes don't even use those stats at all, they already tank with DPS gear (druid, monk).
    • This expansion was meant to be about giving the tank more personal responsibility over their damage intake and self-healing. Active Mitigation was the buzz-word of the beta with regards to tanking. Are we really going to see that scrapped in favour of passive damage reductions and random effects? That seems contrary to everything said in the last 12 months.
    • Finally, Haste is a fun stat. It increases the amount of buttons we can press in a given time frame, it allows us to show off on the damage numbers every now and again and you can see your potential survivability going up. Dodge, Parry (and to a lesser extent Mastery) do not do this. Isn't "it is fun" a valid argument anymore?
    and perhaps link to the discussion on maintankadin, starting at this post: http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.c...rt=375#p754247
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  10. #890
    Epic! GenaiTN's Avatar
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    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6444175401#1

    Help, I need somebody,
    Help, not just anybody,
    Help, you know I need someone, help... me appeal for our tanking rights! Xothic, feel free to c+p it and credit xoxo

  11. #891
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    I'mma bump yo thread, yo! Hope our US friends can make one too.


  12. #892
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    I'mma bump yo thread, yo! Hope our US friends can make one too.
    Cheers buddy.

  13. #893
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helai View Post
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6444175401#1

    Help, I need somebody,
    Help, not just anybody,
    Help, you know I need someone, help... me appeal for our tanking rights! Xothic, feel free to c+p it and credit xoxo
    Your class/spec needs YOU! <insert picture of big pointed fingered american chap>
    Keeping it url since 1864.

  14. #894
    Quote Originally Posted by rawhammer View Post
    Your class/spec needs YOU! <insert picture of big pointed fingered american chap>
    Abraham Lincoln dressed in T6 wielding a bad-ass sword and shield combination (T2 covers the face so you wouldn't know it was him)?
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  15. #895
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    Abraham Lincoln dressed in T6 wielding a bad-ass sword and shield combination (T2 covers the face so you wouldn't know it was him)?
    So much yes.

    Appeal still needs help.

  16. #896
    Brewmaster Xothic's Avatar
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    Posted: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7709232267#1

    Plis read blizzard ;_;

    Also why do the US forums have such a stricter limit on thread title character amounts? Silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asphyxes View Post
    Taco dinner, movie at my mancave then I'll surprise her with a TCG tabard and tell her I love her.
    Xothic - Prot Paladin - Expired at the end of 5.1, returned start of 5.4, left again. Returned again, left again, returned again. You know how it is.

  17. #897
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    All your spells cooldowns are scaled with haste aswell as GCD.

    Your Judgment CD is 4 GCDs
    CS CD is 3 GCDs
    Holy Wrath is 4 GCDs
    etc.

    Making your question kinda irrelevant as you do not have to wait.

    2 exceptions:

    1. You got over 50% haste
    2. You use a spell or item that is not on melee GCD but spell GCD ( i.e. level 90 talents, a heal, cleanse, whatever, you get the point )
    Though the only thing that will do is to delay your next spell.
    But doesn't it delay the next HP generator?
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but let's say melee GCD is 1.2s and I do this:
    0.0s Crusader Strike
    1.2s Judgment
    2.4s Avenger's Shield
    3.6s Crusader Strike
    4.8s Consecration
    6.0s Judgment
    7.2s Crusader Strike
    8.4s Cleanse
    9.9s (0.3s delay) Holy Wrath
    11.1s (0.3s delay) Crusader Strike
    12.3s (0.3s delay) Judgment

    Should I drop the last Holy Wrath in favor of casting the following holy power generators on time or am I worrying too much about it?

  18. #898
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonland View Post
    But doesn't it delay the next HP generator?
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but let's say melee GCD is 1.2s and I do this:
    0.0s Crusader Strike
    1.2s Judgment
    2.4s Avenger's Shield
    3.6s Crusader Strike
    4.8s Consecration
    6.0s Judgment
    7.2s Crusader Strike
    8.4s Cleanse
    9.9s (0.3s delay) Holy Wrath
    11.1s (0.3s delay) Crusader Strike
    12.3s (0.3s delay) Judgment

    Should I drop the last Holy Wrath in favor of casting the following holy power generators on time or am I worrying too much about it?
    To be completely honest, that delay is so small. I do not really have the math here to tell you what is better. Casting HW would be better for damage reasons, not casting it for survivability reasons would be better. Though the difference is so small, it is barely worth thinking about it. I would rather keep on my rotation than stop it mid cycle.

    Whats our current HoPo/Second? 0.5~ ish? So basically delaying by say 0.3s would cause you to loose out on average 0.15 holy power during the course of the fight.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-24 at 04:08 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Xothic View Post
    Posted: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7709232267#1

    Plis read blizzard ;_;

    Also why do the US forums have such a stricter limit on thread title character amounts? Silly.
    You should link to eachothers threads in the first post.
    Edit: Nvm, see you linked at the bottom.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  19. #899
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonland View Post
    But doesn't it delay the next HP generator?
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but let's say melee GCD is 1.2s and I do this:
    0.0s Crusader Strike
    1.2s Judgment
    2.4s Avenger's Shield
    3.6s Crusader Strike
    4.8s Consecration
    6.0s Judgment
    7.2s Crusader Strike
    8.4s Cleanse
    9.9s (0.3s delay) Holy Wrath
    11.1s (0.3s delay) Crusader Strike
    12.3s (0.3s delay) Judgment

    Should I drop the last Holy Wrath in favor of casting the following holy power generators on time or am I worrying too much about it?
    Firstly, there is no reason right now to even have Cleanse on your Action Bar in PvE.

    CS-J-AS CS-Cons-J CS-HW-SS CS-J-AS CS-Cons-J ... works with only one ability being pushed back (J)

    Cast CS on CD, cast J on CD when possible. Slot AS_GC in a filler space. Everything else is lower priority.
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    Tanking with the Blessing of Kings - The TankSpot Guide to the Protection Paladin - Updated for Patch 5.4!

  20. #900
    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    Firstly, there is no reason right now to even have Cleanse on your Action Bar in PvE.

    CS-J-AS CS-Cons-J CS-HW-SS CS-J-AS CS-Cons-J ... works with only one ability being pushed back (J)

    Cast CS on CD, cast J on CD when possible. Slot AS_GC in a filler space. Everything else is lower priority.
    The clutch comes when you cast your T6 Talent, as they always have 1.5s GCD.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

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