1. #1061
    Legendary! MerinPally's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absintheminded View Post
    So.... go-go gadget 5.2 mastery?
    No - gogo gadget haste (same as now) because this just puts a maximum value on mastery for us, it doesn't increase the value of mastery at all because it doesn't increase the amount of damage we reduce for each point of mastery.

    The only change that alters our stats much is the Grand Crusader change and that makes dodge and parry slightly better stats than they are currently but they're still worse than Haste and Mastery so our stat priority stays the same as it is now pretty much, only difference being that dodge and parry aren't as far behind as they used to be.

  2. #1062
    Bloodsail Admiral Splosion's Avatar
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    The change is to stop anyone else getting into the 80 paladin fiasco (99% reduction, the bug still happens). Not that anyone is likely to ever reach it unless 85s get some ilevel 500+ gear.

  3. #1063
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Paladin
    - We are going to try Grand Crusader proc'd by CS, HotR and dodge and parry (at lower chances for each).
    - We are going to buff Seal of Justice and Seal of Righteousness damage. Neither of these Seals is seeing enough use. Justice was always intended to be a strong PvP Seal, and it just isn't right now. We haven't solidified numbers yet - I'm just sharing our intent.
    Uhm, again... Doesn't this make Haste even more valuable with dodge and parry just... Less awful? Even a step down from the first change if their goal is to make us want to see those stats on our gear.

  4. #1064
    Good change, glad he realized how much of a nerf this change was to our resource generation and dps.

  5. #1065
    Will be really happy if this change sticks, didn't really like sound of losing the cs/hotr proc chance from it

    ......................Protection Paladin PoV.....................

  6. #1066
    I want to know the proc chances before I comment on how much more awesome it might be. But it looks better than before (actually getting procs while not tanking is nice).
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  7. #1067
    Brewmaster Xothic's Avatar
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    Crap, im like two weeks out of the loop with Prot paladins. What has happened? Has GC announced some kind of fix?
    Quote Originally Posted by Asphyxes View Post
    Taco dinner, movie at my mancave then I'll surprise her with a TCG tabard and tell her I love her.
    Xothic - Prot Paladin - Expired at the end of 5.1, returned start of 5.4.

  8. #1068
    Legendary! MerinPally's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xothic View Post
    Crap, im like two weeks out of the loop with Prot paladins. What has happened? Has GC announced some kind of fix?
    Only change is what is written above your post. So, in short, no. If by "fix" you meant making haste not top.

    We're the same as we were before except dodge and parry aren't as far behind as they used to be. That's literally it.

  9. #1069
    Quote Originally Posted by Xothic View Post
    Crap, im like two weeks out of the loop with Prot paladins. What has happened? Has GC announced some kind of fix?
    Sure, they made grand crusader proc of dodge and parry instead of nerfing haste. The intent was for prot paladins to "enjoy" drops with these stats on them. However it still didn't change the fact that haste is our best stat. The problem with this change though was that whenever we weren't getting melee'd by anything, we wouldn't see any grand crusader procs. They now changed it to proc off CS and HoTR like normal but also including dodge and parry while lowering the total proc chance. It basically makes no difference although i like the change.

    On another note, playing with protection 4 piece on PTR raid testing i'm just amazing at the amount of prolonged mitigation we can pull off with HA/SW and divine protection immediately after or vice versa. Swimming in holy power for such a long period. It also makes divine protection an amazing cooldown in itself. I thought i would cap HP a lot since the nature of losing 20% health is kind of random a lot of times (depending on external buffs/cooldowns on you, dodge/parries etc), but it worked out really well for me on the boss testing.

  10. #1070
    Bloodsail Admiral rawhammer's Avatar
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    hmmm odd - so they take GC (from a gearing stat prio ptv) away from us then give it us back....odd. Tbh i was quite overjoyed that they didnt "nerf" haste that i didnt mind the GC "nerf" to proc from avoidance but this new change (? didnt see it on front page but take it that it is a blue post) does relieve that concern abit. Though would like to know what they mean by:


    Grand Crusader proc'd by CS, HotR and dodge and parry (at lower chances for each).

    Seal changes are also welcome as as right now there is APPROACHING ZERO choice.
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  11. #1071
    Brewmaster Xothic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teks View Post
    Sure, they made grand crusader proc of dodge and parry instead of nerfing haste. The intent was for prot paladins to "enjoy" drops with these stats on them. However it still didn't change the fact that haste is our best stat. The problem with this change though was that whenever we weren't getting melee'd by anything, we wouldn't see any grand crusader procs. They now changed it to proc off CS and HoTR like normal but also including dodge and parry while lowering the total proc chance. It basically makes no difference although i like the change.

    On another note, playing with protection 4 piece on PTR raid testing i'm just amazing at the amount of prolonged mitigation we can pull off with HA/SW and divine protection immediately after or vice versa. Swimming in holy power for such a long period. It also makes divine protection an amazing cooldown in itself. I thought i would cap HP a lot since the nature of losing 20% health is kind of random a lot of times (depending on external buffs/cooldowns on you, dodge/parries etc), but it worked out really well for me on the boss testing.
    Huh. If that is all they intend to do to change Protadins, buffing D/P while keeping Haste as the top stat, then I must say I am both fairly pleased and impressed they didn't outright fuck it up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asphyxes View Post
    Taco dinner, movie at my mancave then I'll surprise her with a TCG tabard and tell her I love her.
    Xothic - Prot Paladin - Expired at the end of 5.1, returned start of 5.4.

  12. #1072
    Fluffy Kitten Rivin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rawhammer View Post
    Though would like to know what they mean by:


    Grand Crusader proc'd by CS, HotR and dodge and parry (at lower chances for each).
    Right now it's 20% chance on CS/HotR, and the previous change was 30% chance on avoid. Most likely the new version will be something like 10% chance on CS/HotR and 15% chance on avoid (i.e. it works on both, but the chance for each to happen is lower).

  13. #1073
    Tier 14 to 15 item differences, including current PTR stats per normal tier item.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...2c&usp=sharing



  14. #1074
    Quote Originally Posted by promdate View Post
    Tier 14 to 15 item differences, including current PTR stats per normal tier item.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...2c&usp=sharing
    Think I will be letting all other conquerors get their 4p before I even start picking up it tbh. Even though the 4p is good, the stats are just horrible and I feel like my raid would benefit more if the others got their 4p before me.

    Guess this will be another tier in off-set pieces.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  15. #1075
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    Think I will be letting all other conquerors get their 4p before I even start picking up it tbh. Even though the 4p is good, the stats are just horrible and I feel like my raid would benefit more if the others got their 4p before me.

    Guess this will be another tier in off-set pieces.
    The Helm and Shoulders aren't that bad. Mastery and Hit/Exp with 2 sockets each.

  16. #1076
    Quote Originally Posted by Shippai View Post
    The Helm and Shoulders aren't that bad. Mastery and Hit/Exp with 2 sockets each.
    Still not good enough for me to be a douche and take them over my other raid members.

    Though, we will have to wait and see how the damage pattern is on the bosses in the new raid until we can decide how good the 4p is.
    If the damage pattern is similar to current raid, only higher ofc, then it will not be that strong.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  17. #1077
    Epic! GenaiTN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shippai View Post
    The Helm and Shoulders aren't that bad. Mastery and Hit/Exp with 2 sockets each.
    Meh. I'd much rather a competent dps take it for 2 set/4 set.

  18. #1078
    Quote Originally Posted by Shippai View Post
    The Helm and Shoulders aren't that bad. Mastery and Hit/Exp with 2 sockets each.
    The 2p bonus isn't worth it for us to pick up. The 4p bonus is, but the stats are all pretty mediocre outside of the Helm/Shoulders. The other problem I have is those two items have very lackluster socket bonuses. We go from a Stamina bonus to a Parry bonus, while we only gain 1 socket overall from it.



  19. #1079
    If next tier is like this tier in damage, I think the 4p is kinda meh.

    It is good for TDR over a figth, yes. Though, I still feel like its actual usefulness is kinda weak.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  20. #1080
    Surprisingly if you chose the drop down option of "Protection" on the T15 gear vendor, it shows the Ret shoulders too.



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