[shadow] maybe we wont be so far behind?

[fuds]

"These do all sound like bugs; I believe most of these are fixed in a later build (probably not the next one you get, but the one after that). As you've probably seen by now, Shadow is one of the specs whose rotation we are still tweaking." - Ghostcrawler.

from what ive tested and read others info, we are the under-performing ranged/ 50k-30k behind ele/boomy/mage.

so from GC's post, thoughts?

[Kaesebrezen]

That post is like over 1 month old... They are only tweaking numbers, and too the worse.

What the latest patch basically did is to make SW:I a DPS loss (yay MF buff), with the DP nerf DI now also even worse than it already is (yay for DP nerf), the 15% Mf buff is enough to offset the 20% FDCL buff from the patch before.

They have no plan what they're doing, and this patch shows it. Buffing Mindflay and nerfing DP without changing the talents that are impacted by such a change (DI, SW:I, FDCL), especially if all of those talents are underperforming is, uhm, dumb?

[jonish]

The way shadow looks I'll be playing a Brewmaster. The way shadow plays now is terrible which makes me very sad. If it was just learning a new style or rotation that would be fine but the way things are currently is incredibly clunky with severe downtime in parts of the rotation. The last round of nerfs without supplimental fixes to the talents affected by these individual abilities just makes me wonder if they have any idea of the direction they want to go with shadow. Very sad at the current state, and if things don't change severely it will be the first raid tier I go into playing another class.

[smokeajay]

The way shadow looks I'll be playing a Brewmaster. The way shadow plays now is terrible which makes me very sad. If it was just learning a new style or rotation that would be fine but the way things are currently is incredibly clunky with severe downtime in parts of the rotation. The last round of nerfs without supplimental fixes to the talents affected by these individual abilities just makes me wonder if they have any idea of the direction they want to go with shadow. Very sad at the current state, and if things don't change severely it will be the first raid tier I go into playing another class.

This is just false. There is no severe downtime in parts of the rotation/priority. We aren't a CD based spec and shouldn't share the problems CD based specs have/had such as Retribution in Cataclysm. You should always be casting something, even if it is just Mind Flay.

Now, right now Shadow is between a rock and a hard place. Buffing our nukes (DP/MB/SW:Smiley) causes too much high burst in PvP. Buffing our DoTs makes us too good at multi-dotting and proccing DI.

I, honestly, foresee SW: Pain having a one target limitation. This would allow them to buff our DoTs significantly while limiting our damage on muti-dotting and DI procs (allowing them to buff DI back to 15%).

[jonish]

This is just false. There is no severe downtime in parts of the rotation/priority. We aren't a CD based spec and shouldn't share the problems CD based specs have/had such as Retribution in Cataclysm. You should always be casting something, even if it is just Mind Flay.

Now, right now Shadow is between a rock and a hard place. Buffing our nukes (DP/MB/SW:Smiley) causes too much high burst in PvP. Buffing our DoTs makes us too good at multi-dotting and proccing DI.
I, honestly, foresee SW: Pain having a one target limitation. This would allow them to buff our DoTs significantly while limiting our damage on muti-dotting and DI procs (allowing them to buff DI back to 15%).

Let me clarify. I didnt mean points of no casting, I mean points where the rotation has points where you cannot do anything to maximize your time. There are points where you cannot do anything to help generate more shadow orbs. This is what I meant by "downtime".

This makes the rotation as it is intended to be designed , flawed. They do not want shadow to be a multi dot class anymore by giving us things that clear our dots for a dps burst and also forcing us to put mind spike into an already cluttered rotation doesnt help my original point of the rotation feeling very clunky.

Also I see no reason why multi-dotting is an issue unless somehow Blizzard has designed every encounter in MoP to have long term multi-dot friendly bosses. Shadow is amazing in multi-target type boss encounters. In all honestly that his genious design. Using game mechanics to make certain encounters good for certain classes makes the game more fun , and versatile.

Shadow was amazing for twin dragons , fire mages were amazing for Yorsahj, arcane was amazing for spine, Rogues are fantastic on gunship. Creates variety , makes the game fun. We don't need to be "shadow mages" with a bunch of nukes.

Hell , based off mechanics they are turning moonkins into what shadow is now in terms of self refreshing dots.

[fuds]

removing our multi-dotting is another step in making all classes exactly the same,
<sarcasm>just give us a battle rez, bladestorm and lust and be done with it.</sarcasm>

but no really, they should have just left us alone to be honest, we were in a good place

[Haith]

Let Mind Blast Scale with Haste Boom Fixed the problem, but no thats to much to ask for it wouldnt improve our already strong multi dotting pvp wont be more bursty then in already could by too much and hey less downtime on a nerfed Devouring plague.

[smokeajay]

You guys (and girls) are like crazy conservatives. They are not removing multi-dotting. Multi-dotting will always be a DPS increase. They are not removing our DoTs. However, feel free to report your crazy theories to Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh. Added points if you blame Obama.