Game Design Is Terrible

[Seezer]

Unending resolve says hi

Has anyone checked out the graphic for UR? It's killer.

[painweaver]

By that logic SC2 balance is flawed because it only balances around 1v1 when there are 2v2/3v3/4v4 brackets as well.

"By that logic", you mean by logic that isn't fallacious? Well I don't play sc2, but since you went there.... then yes, what you are describing is fundamentally flawed because it doesnt balance class synergy. Is this a surprise? No. Both games came from the same roof.

The games need to be balanced for synergy and 1v1 encounters.

[SirFlipper]

So, we are getting 2 defensive Cooldowns (Unending Resolve, Dark Bargain or Sacrificial Pact), 2 Selfheals (Healthstone with Glyph ~35%, Soul Harvest ~35% and +25% Healing) and a 70% slow (Curse of Exhaustion with Glyph)... when you are saying that we need a defensive CD and that "MoP is not going to change that", what exactly is it that you feel we need? What would be enough in your oppinion?

I need to admit I am not a PvP expert, but with MoP we do get a lot of defensive cooldowns. If that is going to buff us in RBGs, I don't know. Honestly, I don't know if we need to be buffed. And as someone else mentioned already, fun is rather subjective... When I do PvP, I am having a lot of it.

*EDIT* About the "fundamentaly flawed balancing": I think they are doing the only correct thing, focusing on one area to balance for (in WoW there are actually 2 areas, PvP 3v3 and PvE). I do believe (and yes, I believe, I have no hard evidence or facts to proof it) that balancing for every single possible PvP-Situation in WoW is impossible. The same goes for SC2, for which there is another argument to make: People only see 1v1 as the "real deal" and so don't really care about other matchups. There are a million of SC2 1on1 tournaments but only a handful 2on2 (and they are usually only part of some team league) and no 3on3/4on4.

[Bigsilly]

"Least fun class in PvP"

Using an opinion to base an arguement off of instead of facts is bad. I have fun in PvP on my lock.

"absolutely horrible to play in BG's" Clearly a L2P issue

[Randytravis]

the class badly needs a defensive CD and to be at least on par with melee in terms of range/melee distance -what that means is melee have far more tools to stay in melee range.

Errrrr, unending resolve???....... And yes this will benifit us from melee as we can't get silenced or interrupted!

[Xandy]

I've seen a few people mention Warlocks are the "funniest" class to play... just wondering what you meant by that? Did you mean most fun? Or, literally haha funny?

[glowzone]

I've seen a few people mention Warlocks are the "funniest" class to play... just wondering what you meant by that? Did you mean most fun? Or, literally haha funny?

Don't be THAT guy. Nobody likes THAT guy.

[Veyne]

I've seen a few people mention Warlocks are the "funniest" class to play... just wondering what you meant by that? Did you mean most fun? Or, literally haha funny?

They mean fun. Check their "location" next time, usually it's from someone from a country where English isn't the first language. Use a little bit of deductive reasoning, it isn't hard.

[Niberion]

What did you say, warlock sucks in world pvp and bg?
No offense but it just means you suck. Sure we warlocks have a harder time but honestly, it's just a matter of skills and if you don't have them, please reroll a frost dk aka the biggest no-skill pvp spec ever.

Also, mop will only make us stronger so I don't really see what the problem is other than bad skills....

[Cempa]

What did you say, warlock sucks in world pvp and bg?
No offense but it just means you suck. Sure we warlocks have a harder time but honestly, it's just a matter of skills and if you don't have them, please reroll a frost dk aka the biggest no-skill pvp spec ever.

Also, mop will only make us stronger so I don't really see what the problem is other than bad skills....

You are the only one who used the word 'suck.' I put forward an argument of two parts one is subjective and the other is objective(sh).

1) Least fun class in PvP outside of arena -subjective.
2) Melee has more ways of staying in melee range Vs Warlock ways of staying at range. (BG game play meaning objective based PvP where x axis argument does not hold water).

[Rorschachs]

2) Melee has more ways of staying in melee range Vs Warlock ways of staying at range. (BG game play meaning objective based PvP where x axis argument does not hold water).

That's why warlocks don't take as much damage as other casters. Remember soul link? demon armor?

Ofc warlocks have less defensive skills than most of the other classes and that is a fact; but you simply can't call a class dominating arena this much weak or disadvantaged. Boring? maybe (although I don't agree with that)

[Phoenexis]

You are the only one who used the word 'suck.' I put forward an argument of two parts one is subjective and the other is objective(sh).

1) Least fun class in PvP outside of arena -subjective.
2) Melee has more ways of staying in melee range Vs Warlock ways of staying at range. (BG game play meaning objective based PvP where x axis argument does not hold water).

I just uploaded a video about Destruction in competitive arena. I dare you to tell me that it's boring, and I have proof that it's not >

---------- Post added 2012-08-08 at 10:03 PM ----------

And just as Rorschachs said, we have more passive defensive abilities. In addition to that ,we have a myriad of CC abilities with limitless possibilities, which always makes Destruction feel refreshing and new.

[Eroginous]

That's the problem. PvP is "balanced" around one-restricted PVP scenario within the limits of 3v3 and 5v5 arena, which does not take into account the other "unlimited possibility" PVP scenarios (BGs and world PVP) that the game offers. In other words, the game is only balanced around a limited 1/3 of the PVP it provides. This philosophy of PVP balance is fundamentally flawed, and is essentially like a pharmaceutical company testing a drug for only 1 serious side-effect, and refusing to test for any others.

Maybe in BC and Wotlk. Since Cata, pvp has been balanced around larger group play. The balancing point isn't synergy between classes, instead it's about making sure two teams of 10 players have a wide range of special abilities to utilize for situational advantages.

[rnbwtrout]

ITT: im bad at pvp'ing with a lock so everyone else must be too.

[darkminaz]

funny how people fogett our 2 ! port ways
jup that crappy 5sec cast thing and the normal
burning rush

and the new talent, well we are still not fixed or as good as to bc times but dafuq, way better then currently and i'm having a shitload of fun in bg's. (most of the time i even run around with pve gear) we are not brocken, you just have to learn how to play your class

[Arawn]

I've have read that locks are the least played class in wow, I can very well believe it since I very rarely see other locks in BG:s.
Anyway if so that would mean most players find locks the least enjoyable. Maybe because its harder? Locks certainly are viable in competitive pvp.
But I think the low representation in random bgs at least, is due to the lack of defensive cds and that most people prefer pvping with burst classes. Other classes have tools that forces a switch in the melee train, and most find it more satisfying to take out people with massive obliterates.

[FruitBat69]

I've have read that locks are the least played class in wow, I can very well believe it since I very rarely see other locks in BG:s.
Anyway if so that would mean most players find locks the least enjoyable. Maybe because its harder? Locks certainly are viable in competitive pvp.
But I think the low representation in random bgs at least, is due to the lack of defensive cds and that most people prefer pvping with burst classes. Other classes have tools that forces a switch in the melee train, and most find it more satisfying to take out people with massive obliterates.

Thats what i believe too, even our burst spec destro sucks for burst. Was playing a BG yesterday and my chaos bolts were hitting for a pathetic 9.5k. Thats with pretty much pvp bis. My mage on the other hand can get 20k to 40k instant pyros. To be a warlock you have to have a lot of patience and majority of wow players dont.

[paulywally]

I love my Warlock.

I love my Succubus.