Insta casts in PvP, too much?

[Deleted]

Well, I think most of you cant at least deny that healers are imposible to kill, especially druids, priests or paladins with good gear. I mean as a single dps I cant even nuke them below 40- 50 % coz they have too many ways to deal with my abilities. I'm mage, actually fire and for me its quite hard to nuke druid which puts on himself many hots and even when they are silenced its quite short time to overnuke them. Discipline priests are hard to kill for me as well, because they have so many ways to survive my all cds and burst dmg. In my opinion Blizzard should considers some changes for particular healing classes.

BTW. According to warriors, they have difficult life with mages since vanilla Wow. Despite the fact that they have obtained some extra skills in cataclysm, they still have a lack of abilites to deal with mages, but I think that good, expirienced warriors in pvp are able to handle every mage.

[Deleted]

Well, I think most of you cant at least deny that healers are imposible to kill, especially druids, priests or paladins with good gear. I mean as a single dps I cant even nuke them below 40- 50 % coz they have too many ways to deal with my abilities. I'm mage, actually fire and for me its quite hard to nuke druid which puts on himself many hots and even when they are silenced its quite short time to overnuke them. Discipline priests are hard to kill for me as well, because they have so many ways to survive my all cds and burst dmg. In my opinion Blizzard should considers some changes for particular healing classes.

BTW. According to warriors, they have difficult life with mages since vanilla Wow. Despite the fact that they have obtained some extra skills in cataclysm, they still have a lack of abilites to deal with mages, but I think that good, expirienced warriors in pvp are able to handle every mage.

I feel the same, but it isn't a too much instant cast problem. Rather heal/sec is way higher than possible dmg/s. Even if they cast long spells their hps would be extreme high. I've seen over 50% total healt with one cast countless times. Sadly it is necessary for healers to be viable. If they can't keep someone alive againt one player, why bring a healer, and why not another dd? A healer needs to be able to hold againt 1 perfectly and should be dead against 2 alone. I don't like this design either but, don't have any better idea how to make a healer vialbe but not op. Balancing this must be a horror.

[meathead]

Well, I think most of you cant at least deny that healers are imposible to kill, especially druids, priests or paladins with good gear. I mean as a single dps I cant even nuke them below 40- 50 % coz they have too many ways to deal with my abilities. I'm mage, actually fire and for me its quite hard to nuke druid which puts on himself many hots and even when they are silenced its quite short time to overnuke them. Discipline priests are hard to kill for me as well, because they have so many ways to survive my all cds and burst dmg. In my opinion Blizzard should considers some changes for particular healing classes.

BTW. According to warriors, they have difficult life with mages since vanilla Wow. Despite the fact that they have obtained some extra skills in cataclysm, they still have a lack of abilites to deal with mages, but I think that good, expirienced warriors in pvp are able to handle every mage.

"but I think that good, expirienced warriors in pvp are able to handle every mage."

i want some of what you are smoking

[Hedleyazg]

If only WoW truly worked this way, try telling that to any gimped masochistic warrior that still plays after spell reflect nerf. FotM class > skill, always been this way since the dawn of arena.
1v1 isn't balanced(nor is 2's or 3's or PvP for that matter)

OP, just a prediction but anyone that's not a monk in the beginning of MoP is going to feel exactly what everyone else felt in WotLK 3.0 with DKs. Blizzard doesn't learn from their mistakes and they will repeat it again I guarantee this for the next 9 months after MoP as well.

Brofl hit the nail on the head here. FotM Skilled player > FotM > Skilled player. Blizzard constantly nerfs classes in a circle where each time they nerf one another becomes OP intended or not. This nerf circle has been going on since BC and I assume it will continue to go on.

[Nyaldee]

What's even more fun is that interrupts are getting nerfed in MoP, so now casters will have a legitimate choice of spaming instants or chaincasting in your face 10 sec out of 15 (if they didn't juke it anyway).

[darthades]

Ranged DPS instants are a problem but the elephant in the room is Healers with their instants, those are jawdropping, so ridiculously broken you will just laugh of anger.

[Jibjabb]

Caster may have more instant casts, but melee have more gap closers, cc break or ways to deal some damage from range than they had when casters still had to stop for every casting. Why should you be able to interrupt so many things?

This is exactly why its evolving where all casters can deal decent-ish instant damage. Because all melee has so many things to keep casters slowed, close and locked down. Maybe if not every melee had a kick, couldnt break snares right away, and didnt have a way to get next to a caster instantly (charge, shadowstep, deathgrip) than they would remove the need for instants. But until those things are taken away theres no chance and no reason to remove them unless you want casters to be dead meat anytime a melee gets on them.

In fact for close to all of this expansion other than Frost Mages melee as a whole have been more dominant in pvp.


---------- Post added 2012-08-07 at 09:48 AM ----------

Well, I think most of you cant at least deny that healers are imposible to kill, especially druids, priests or paladins with good gear. I mean as a single dps I cant even nuke them below 40- 50 % coz they have too many ways to deal with my abilities.

The reason its like that is because if it wasnt there would be no use for healers in Arenas/RBGs as the minute any team focused them down they would die instantly. They have to be able to somewhat easily survive 1 dps... since in most situations in competitive pvp they are forced to deal with more than 1. What I would like to see is higher mana costs for some of their instants and dispels (which I believe is happening).

Cause remember come MoP all caster/healers will have a static mana pool that does not get larger so this time around they wont be able to spam more spells as they get geared. It should be a lot more likely to oom a healer by applying pressure

[Video Games]

I'm just gonna say I don't regret rolling mage for cata after 3 years of being a warrior.

[rzzr]

Hopefully in MOP Blizz will do something about healers and their never ending mana and instant heals because currently it's just crazy. I don't think I have ever seen a pally run out of mana in pvp.

[Deleted]

I don't have a problem with the idea of pressuring a healer as a lone melee DPS until they go OOM and then go for the kill, using interupts to force them to go OOM faster. I just have a problem with the endless mana pools of Pallys, I play Warrior so priest's aren't that hard to deal with, I can never get close to a Shammy due to Earthbind and Ghost Wolf, and whenever I do get in a Shammy's face they earth shield and all of a sudden my damage does nothing. Druids I don't have a problem with, you have to be very patient and coordinate your CDs to deal with a druids defensive CDs.

As far as DPS goes, I've given up, I have an opener of Charge, imp hamstring, wait for the DE, Blink, Teleport etc, heroic leap -> Stun and burst DPS, if they're still alive, or I screw up one of those stages I'm in a very very bad way, and I don't even have a problem with that, once your burst is over you're not very good, that's fine.

It's the fact that we have this small window of advantage, say about 10seconds long, at which point you need to do enough damage to kill them, or enough damage to finish him or her off before they settle in. And until your CDs come back, they have the advantage, so while they have to stay alive for 10seconds, you have to stay alive for the next 2mins. I don't see that as being very fair.

Or maybe I'm just doing something wrong.

[Milkshake86]

Blizzard doesn't care, that's the thing. They don't WANT a balanced game - they want a game where the windowlicker down the street with $15 to burn can pick a certain class or two and be guaranteed to succeed. Their new policies are fucking absurd.

There's nothing wrong with allowing everyone to compete, but there's definitely something wrong with giving everyone a gold medal just for showing up.

---------- Post added 2012-08-06 at 03:10 AM ----------



Healers bother me more than mages. Instant cast heals are on too short a cooldown, heal for too much, and are way too mana-efficient.

Blame infinity ward for the atrocity that is Modern Warfare, rank up if you play more! No skill cap required and if you suck here is a myriad of crap to make you better without being better. If you go back even a month prior to Mw1 you will see Halo 3, by all means an intensely hard game in pve when on Legendary and in pvp getting a 50 outside of team doubles was actually difficult. The day MW1 was released nearly every game there after has been a downhill slope of terribly easy games designed to make more money.

[Yvaelle]

That doesn't work unless the caster is a keyboard turner due to latency. In the same way that you can kick a polymorph and still get sheeped.

It depends on the spell actually, many spells check LoS at the start and end of the spell - some spells do not. For example, Polymorph and Cyclone only check LoS at the start of the spell - so you can LOS the ends of the cast and you will still get poly'd / clone'd around the box: super annoying. Frostbolt (a lot of mage spells actually) do something odd, you cast them - the person LOS's - the bolt goes through the wall - it's like it checks at the start and middle, but not the end. Some spells do not do this though - Mind Blast checks LoS at the start and end of the cast, so if you wait till the last fraction of a second, and step through a spriest - their cast will end due to LOS, Mind Flay (and all channels) only check LoS at the start of the spell, so if you LOS before the second tick - both ticks just go through the wall.

A lot of casters should be more dependent on casting, but the problem then is that good melee who cycle interrupts / stuns with their teammates can completely negate an enemy caster (or healers) ability to do anything - which is also not balanced - so there needs to be a middle ground. That middle ground to me is that casters/healers should be dependent on casts for big and cost efficient heals, but should have less effective and/or less efficient heals (read: expensive) instant heals. This provides a skill gradient where you want to cast, but if your a noob - then you just stick to spamming instants. Or you use instants to heal while repositioning, but not just as the button you prefer to press (holy paladins do this a lot with WoG / Shock, and frost mages with ice lance / nova / cones): that should be removed.

[Flaks]

The problem is with too much of EVERYTHING in this game right now. Too much burst, WAAAAAAY too much CC, too many interrupts, too many silences, too many instant casts.

Cata would have been a good time to address this. In fact, there's blue posts saying that they WOULD address this problem in Cata. Too bad Blizzard got into the business of lying to the pvp community then.

[mysterial]

not really instant cast can be good for both sides and be horrible for both sides its equal and balanced

[Lolvanish]

Healers bother me more than mages. Instant cast heals are on too short a cooldown, heal for too much, and are way too mana-efficient.

Ah yes... holy paladins.... /wrist

[Management]

or even better, a personal favourite of mine, spirit link totem(Why is that castable while silenced?)

Silences makes the caster not able to speak. Most spells requires chanting to cast the spell, maybe spirit link doesn't require chanting.