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  1. #1
    Epic! solvexx's Avatar
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    [MoP] Ret Damage Consistantly Being Nerfed.

    Are we really out of control?
    What's the deal with every single patch notes mentioning nerfs?

  2. #2
    Moderator Azshira's Avatar
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    I don't understand it personally, ret were middle of the pack at best. I'm not too sure, maybe someone with numbers etc can shed some light. Seems alot of classes got minor nerfs this patch too (besides hunt and lock who got giant ones)

    However the next month is going to be updates to numbers every week.
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  3. #3
    Epic! solvexx's Avatar
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    Both hunters and locks were apparently crazy out of control though, well.. So I heard.
    The limited amount of time I spent on beta we seemed to be underwhelming at best compared to others tbh.

  4. #4
    The Patient
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    this is beta, damage is being changed constantly... you cant really call it a nerf.

    while it is true: Censure, Judgement, Seal of truth and righteousness was toned down in damage.
    divine purpose was buffed, holy avenger was buffed, they finally fixed sanctity of battle, both divine storm and templar's verdict is buffed

    its beta, we are gonna see alot of these things, im gonna be honest when i say i never expect to see rets near the top of the pack, and im ok with being middle so long as the difference between middle and top is by about 2-4%...

    my 2 cents


  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Noujou View Post
    this is beta, damage is being changed constantly... you cant really call it a nerf.

    while it is true: Censure, Judgement, Seal of truth and righteousness was toned down in damage.
    divine purpose was buffed, holy avenger was buffed, they finally fixed sanctity of battle, both divine storm and templar's verdict is buffed

    its beta, we are gonna see alot of these things, im gonna be honest when i say i never expect to see rets near the top of the pack, and im ok with being middle so long as the difference between middle and top is by about 2-4%...

    my 2 cents
    Sword of Light Increases the damage you deal with two-handed melee weapons by 10%. (from 20%)

    That is the biggest nerf and a buff to TV does not outweigh it at all.

    They also turned Holy Avenger into a nobrainer which imo is pretty sad considering they want us to think about those choices.
    Last edited by Pacer; 2012-08-08 at 01:33 AM.

  6. #6
    While I'm not a paladin, I have been frequenting the beta, and I can say that the reason probably is that even though a class is "middle of the pack" as the DPS is *right now*, that doesn't mean that its where Blizzard intends the DPS to be. For instance, if the damage spread was 60-70K (with hunters and locks lying at 80K with boomkins close behind as exceptions), they may actually want it to be 50-60K instead. A middle of the pack class would be doing 65K dps, so that's 5K above what they want the MAX to be.
    The numbers are purely made up, mind you, but the point is, being middle of the pack in beta doesn't mean that you're not going to get nerfed if EVERYTHING is doing too much damage for their liking. The normal bosses were (mostly) stupidly easy, with a 10 man boss such as Lei Shi having "only" 70M HP.

  7. #7
    Until it goes live it's all just up in the air anyway...

  8. #8
    Field Marshal Zaeon's Avatar
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    How to make the class angry..nerf it's overall damage output by 10%, nerf other abilities by 10% and make zealotry 2.0 be an absolute must cause it's just goddamn broken. Basically we're back to pop pot, angel, zealotry renamed avenger, wings and go off with more burst than ever! ...Inc nerf, I can feel it in the wind, blizz won't let us have both wings and zeal doing increased damage output. ..I mean come on, can't you HEAR the QQ on the wind? We can now pop two abilities and gain 50% combined increased damage. ...Yea, something tells me we won't be having this for long.

  9. #9
    The problem I have is that after what happened with Cataclysm - no matter how many players bothered giving feedback in the beta, myself included - is that Blizzard doesn't exactly fill me with faith that they know what they are doing with Ret. We were unplayable and pretty much unable to compete for months into the expansion. Every time I see a nerf I think of that happening again.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Zaeon View Post
    How to make the class angry..nerf it's overall damage output by 10%, nerf other abilities by 10% and make zealotry 2.0 be an absolute must cause it's just goddamn broken. Basically we're back to pop pot, angel, zealotry renamed avenger, wings and go off with more burst than ever! ...Inc nerf, I can feel it in the wind, blizz won't let us have both wings and zeal doing increased damage output. ..I mean come on, can't you HEAR the QQ on the wind? We can now pop two abilities and gain 50% combined increased damage. ...Yea, something tells me we won't be having this for long.
    They do it on purpose. They know that it will cause problems and it will just give them another excuse to nerf abilities 'base' dps rather than fixing the 20 second burst window created by all these annoying burst cooldowns they 'seem to love'.

    Just look at divine purpose, they buffed it 25%. I know that everyone is going to be taking avenger now, but if you remember it was divine purpose that got WoG nerf (combined with selfless healer) because it was allowed to chain WoG. The same is going to happen again....they will release it like this, dps will be awful, burst will be OP. They will nerf dps more to make it 'balanced' when bursting, then somehow people will end up on DP talent so they can nerf our only self defence again.

    I hope they realise how silly the 10% straight nerf is....and the stupid avenger 30% damage buff to HP generators

  11. #11
    The Patient UnderworldSoup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palatinus View Post
    but if you remember it was divine purpose that got WoG nerf (combined with selfless healer) because it was allowed to chain WoG.
    Eternal Glory played a large hand in that as well though. Divine Purpose, although strong, is now more of a choice for a player who enjoys passive buffs rather than active. Granted I'm not saying that a passive based on random number generation is going to always compete with a dedicated active ability, but hey, at least they're trying to balance it out on that tier.

    As for the damage: don't worry too much about it. We're in a much better state than we were in Cataclysm just because our mastery isn't awful out the gate.

  12. #12
    This is actually hilarious lol. I was extremely content with ret a few builds ago, just being middle of the pack dps with great utility. Then, Ghoscrawler said "LAWL JK", pulled out the ol' nerf bat and took a massive shit on our chest. I'm kind of used to being constantly nerfed at this point.
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  13. #13
    We're not out of control, we're just the fucking laughing stock of dps.

    Please try to stay constructive when posting. - Malthanis
    Last edited by Malthanis; 2012-08-08 at 04:00 PM.

  14. #14
    High Overlord jb247's Avatar
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    If this is part one of a two part adjustment to ret, where they tune the damage down and then add in some baseline defenses, I am fine with it. However, I know better. We've lost burst, control, self-healing, and baseline defense in MOP, and we've gained uptime on target via clemency and BoG and SOJ. I'm not really ok with that trade off, considering ret wasn't exactly an overwhelming spec in Cata to begin with.

  15. #15
    Pandaren Monk Velshin's Avatar
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    What I'm really suprised about is the Divine purpose buff..I mean buffing something that most of Ret paladins if not all of them hate it...

    I mean most of ret players already got sick of RNG procs in our dmg and rotation such as divine purpose.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by homerunhomer View Post
    The problem I have is that after what happened with Cataclysm - no matter how many players bothered giving feedback in the beta, myself included - is that Blizzard doesn't exactly fill me with faith that they know what they are doing with Ret. We were unplayable and pretty much unable to compete for months into the expansion. Every time I see a nerf I think of that happening again.
    Ah lol the posts I made in the cata Beta about the mastery sucking only to have them change it to what I posted about a month after the expansion went live... They really don't listen to players lol.

  17. #17
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    What I'm really suprised about is the Divine purpose buff..I mean buffing something that most of Ret paladins if not all of them hate it...

    I mean most of ret players already got sick of RNG procs in our dmg and rotation such as divine purpose.
    am i one of the only rets that actually dont have problems with divine purpose?? sure its rng but id kinda prefer rng (because its constant even if i get dicked over by it) over another 2min cd... my opinion


  18. #18
    Pandaren Monk Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noujou View Post
    am i one of the only rets that actually dont have problems with divine purpose?? sure its rng but id kinda prefer rng (because its constant even if i get dicked over by it) over another 2min cd... my opinion
    Yes I understand your point but in the end it's still RNG and uncontrollable and one of the major problem in Cataclysm with Ret is that no matter how good your gears or rotation timing it's still Divine purpose is the major factor of your dps and dmg overall either getting a lot of procs which make us very good or getting unlucky and be gimped by it.. that's why I hate it so much and now by making it more attractive it's just so wrong in my personal opinion..but yeah it's still beta..we will see how it goes in live.

  19. #19
    Yeah we took a few dps hits, but it looks like a blanket nerf patch, half the specs in the game got their damage toned down too.

  20. #20
    Warchief Sett's Avatar
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    I urge more peeps do the numbers and keep the constructive posts up on the official forums. It's the only thing that seems to get their attention is a massive amount of HEY LOOK NUMBERS WHY IS IT LIKE THIS sort of things. ( Not in all caps, mind you. )

    Don't let them pull a Cata on us again.
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