Thread: Gear stats

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  1. #1

    Gear stats

    I was under the impression that there will be no geargrind/stat increasing through gear as in most generic MMOs, but I have doubts after reading this:

    http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/...d-you-updated/

    It seems that PvE will still have gear grind and different tiers / gear progression, or did I get the post wrong?

    pic related, same level weapon of different quality

    "Loss of blood... My only weakness!"
    ~ Warlord Khan, Magicka

    Anyway, if you don't already see where I'm going with this, allow me to spell it out: the only meaningful MMORPG "endgame" -- i.e., something novel to do after the progression process is over -- is that of the sandbox.

  2. #2
    It's not exactly new information. We've always known there will be different qualities of gear at level 80? I'm not familiar with the acquisition of the orange or yellow quality gear, but you should obtain the highest statistical quality from crafting, the BLTP, PvP (pvp only ofc), Karma, and dungeons and the effectiveness of that gear, barring level increases from expansions, will never change.

    I think the qualities are redundant and hypocritical, but it's not a very big issue.

    Also, that thread on Guru you linked is wrong. Red is legendary, not purple. Purple is Mystic chest loot.
    Last edited by Larynx; 2012-08-09 at 08:51 AM.
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  3. #3
    From what I can see there will be different qualities of max level items (WoW equivalent = greens, blues, purples, orange), but not different ilvls in those categories.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmist View Post
    From what I can see there will be different qualities of max level items (WoW equivalent = greens, blues, purples, orange), but not different ilvls in those categories.
    iLevel is the total available power an item can allocate to specific stats. By definition, an item of the same level but higher statistically is a different iLevel.

    So, lets say iLevel of 100. Primaries = 1, Secondaries = 2, procs = 50.

    26 Strength
    12 Crit
    10% chance to summon a tentacle to attack foes on hit.

    or,

    30 strength
    40 stamina
    15 dodge rating

    edit: Oh wait, fuck me. Misunderstood.
    Last edited by Larynx; 2012-08-09 at 08:58 AM.
    6.0 Disc Priest Guide http://i.imgur.com/QbCmDc2l.jpg

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmist View Post
    From what I can see there will be different qualities of max level items (WoW equivalent = greens, blues, purples, orange), but not different ilvls in those categories.
    Yes exactly.
    "Loss of blood... My only weakness!"
    ~ Warlord Khan, Magicka

    Anyway, if you don't already see where I'm going with this, allow me to spell it out: the only meaningful MMORPG "endgame" -- i.e., something novel to do after the progression process is over -- is that of the sandbox.

  6. #6
    Herald of the Titans Jigain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grable View Post
    I was under the impression that there will be no geargrind/stat increasing through gear as in most generic MMOs, but I have doubts after reading this:

    http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/...d-you-updated/

    It seems that PvE will still have gear grind and different tiers / gear progression, or did I get the post wrong?

    pic related, same level weapon of different quality

    Looking at the picture...
    Right one has lower base damage, higher Power, higher Precision, lower Toughness, lower Condition Damage, and a different sigil applied to it. I don't see how that's not a sidegrade.

    More in depth comparison:
    -113 lowest base damage
    -125 highest base damage
    +113 Power
    +30 Precision
    -128 Toughness
    -66 Condition Damage

  7. #7
    Bloodsail Admiral Cuchulainn's Avatar
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    Think of it like this, at level 80 you'll have different quality level 80 items. Take this for example: EMD gear > crafting gear > karma gear > heart karma gear > random world drops

    Or something like that.

  8. #8
    There is ofc better gear.....that's been known for ages. But there is no vertical gear progression. There will be no tiers.
    You can optimize, but there's no treadmill.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Jigain View Post
    Looking at the picture...
    Right one has lower base damage, higher Power, higher Precision, lower Toughness, lower Condition Damage, and a different sigil applied to it. I don't see how that's not a sidegrade.

    More in depth comparison:
    -113 lowest base damage
    -125 highest base damage
    +113 Power
    +30 Precision
    -128 Toughness
    -66 Condition Damage
    Erm, no. The point is that if the yellow was orange the stats would be 128, 179, 128, not 113, 158, 113. The sigil is irrelevant. Yellow has a lower iLevel than orange.
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  10. #10
    The Lightbringer Malthurius's Avatar
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    We've known that the gear plateaus at an easy to reach point; that plateau exists at level 80 exotic quality gear.
    "Questions are for those seeking answers. Those who have answers are those who have asked questions." -Mike R. (Malthurius)

  11. #11
    Herald of the Titans Jigain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    Erm, no. The point is that if the yellow was orange the stats would be 128, 179, 128, not 113, 158, 113. The sigil is irrelevant. Yellow has a lower iLevel than orange.
    Aye, I know the sigil is irrelevant, hence why it wasn't included in my comparison.

    Maybe it's just me who doesn't care about whether some hidden number (read: iLvl) is higher or lower, or whether it doesn't have as many collective "points", as long as the stat allocation fits my playstyle better. *shrugs*

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Jigain View Post
    Aye, I know the sigil is irrelevant, hence why it wasn't included in my comparison.

    Maybe it's just me who doesn't care about whether some hidden number (read: iLvl) is higher or lower, or whether it doesn't have as many collective "points", as long as the stat allocation fits my playstyle better. *shrugs*
    The point of this thread is that a specific stat allocation will be objectively better if the item was orange instead of yellow, as orange has more available power to give. It's a difference of having 13 power versus 10 power basically. This example is bad since it's like comparing 13 toughness to 10 power, but the point is still there.
    Last edited by Larynx; 2012-08-09 at 09:08 AM.
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  13. #13
    Oh I was greatly misinformed then. I was under the impression that all level 80 gear had the same stat numbers and the quality simply meant different looks. I am a bit surprised, but pleasantly. I can see that it won't take forever to get all the max stats.
    "Loss of blood... My only weakness!"
    ~ Warlord Khan, Magicka

    Anyway, if you don't already see where I'm going with this, allow me to spell it out: the only meaningful MMORPG "endgame" -- i.e., something novel to do after the progression process is over -- is that of the sandbox.

  14. #14
    Field Marshal Oglok's Avatar
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    One is Rare, the other Exotic, of course their stats will be different. You will find Masterwork and Fine LvL 80 items too.

    2 Exotic lvl 80 items will have the same budget for stats allocation.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Grable View Post
    Oh I was greatly misinformed then. I was under the impression that all level 80 gear had the same stat numbers and the quality simply meant different looks. I am a bit surprised, but pleasantly. I can see that it won't take forever to get all the max stats.
    The only quality that is statistically the same are legendaries. They're equivalent the gear tier below them, they just look better/different, and are hard as hell to acquire.
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  16. #16
    The Lightbringer Malthurius's Avatar
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    So, I wonder how long it will take to actually reach the plateau of power if in order to achieve that you must have every slot filled with exotic quality gear, the rarest quality right below Legendary... one would assume by the rarity that exotics wouldn't be handed out like candy, how easy to reach is this plateau really? We don't really know...
    "Questions are for those seeking answers. Those who have answers are those who have asked questions." -Mike R. (Malthurius)

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthurius View Post
    So, I wonder how long it will take to actually reach the plateau of power if in order to achieve that you must have every slot filled with exotic quality gear, the rarest quality right below Legendary... one would assume by the rarity that exotics wouldn't be handed out like candy, how easy to reach is this plateau really? We don't really know...
    Apparently 57 dungeon runs (amount of tokens per dungeon vs cost of tokens per piece)
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  18. #18
    The Lightbringer Malthurius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    Apparently 57 dungeon runs.
    Aha... what? lol

    Where did you get that number?

    EDIT: Oh, the article in the OP I didn't read, nice...
    "Questions are for those seeking answers. Those who have answers are those who have asked questions." -Mike R. (Malthurius)

  19. #19
    How difficult is it to get level 80 exotic gear?
    We can theorise an estimate playtimes needed to get a full set of gear.

    Dungeon Tokens
    Each dungeon has its own unique tokens. Going the dungeon route path, it will cost you:
    2-Hander = 390 tokens
    1-Hander (main hand) = 300 tokens
    1-Hander (off hand) = 210 tokens
    Head = 270 tokens
    Shoulder = 240 tokens
    Chest = 390 tokens
    Glove = 270 tokens
    Leg = 360 tokens
    Feet = 270 tokens
    Total (6-Piece (Full) Set) = 1800 tokens
    Total (2-H + Full Set) = 2190 tokens
    Total (Main + Off Hand + Full Set) = 2310 tokens
    Ascalonian level 60 exotic armour is slightly cheaper than this with a full 6-piece gear set costing 1200 tokens.

    Dungeon tokens are obtained by completing explorable mode runs of each dungeon. Each dungeon on average nets 41 tokens for each completed explorable mode run: 20 tokens for the main boss and 7 for each of the three mini bosses. It is possible to obtain more than 41 per run as mobs occasionally drop tokens.

    If we want a full set of level 80 exotic gear we would need to run:
    1800/41 = 43.9
    = 44 Dungeon runs

    For a 2 handed weapon we would need to run:
    390/41 = 9.5
    = 10 runs

    For a main and off hand we would need to run:
    510/41
    = 12.4
    = 13 runs

    A person who wants a full set of exotics and a main and off hand from the same dungeon vendor would need to do 57 dungeon runs.

    The dungeon tokens needed per weapon are from beta and thus may change but it gives you an idea of how hard exotics will to get from dungeons.

    Of the known exotic dungeon sets, the first two (Ascalonian and Noble's) are not L80, they provide the following 3 attributes:
    Ascalonian (L60): Power (main) / Toughness / Vitality
    Noble (L70): Precision (main) / Power / Condition Damage
    Nightmare: Condition Damage (main) / Precision / Toughness
    Sorrow's Furnace: Condition Damage (main) / Power/ Vitality
    Flame Legion: Power (main) / Precision / Crit Damage


    WvW
    This is for level 60 exotic gear only - couldn't find the level 80 vendor sorry. For those wondering, badges of honours are rewards dropped by opposing players, mobs and from keep sieges. They may often be concealed in loot bags.
    Head = 260 Badges of Honour
    Shoulder = 229 Badges of Honour
    Chest = 312 Badges of Honour
    Glove = 188 Badges of Honour
    Leg = 292 Badges of Honour
    Feet = 208 Badges of Honour
    Total (6-Piece (Full) Set) = 1489 Badges of Honour
    How hard is it to get badges of honour?
    From a typical 1hr hectic WvW play the average player will get 10-20 badges depending on luck and remembering to loot corpses too!

    Being optimistic, at 20 badges/hour that means:
    1489/20 = 74.45
    = 75 hours

    That's 75 hours for a level 60 exotic gear set (not 80 remember).


    Crafting
    When I initially made this thread I stated at this time we had no evidence to say what exact role crafting plays in making exotics. Nirgal though kindly pointed me in the direction of a few hidden pages in GW2DB.

    I'll link one inscription and one insignia.

    Valkyrie Ancient Inscription - http://www.gw2db.com...ed:created-from

    Valkyrie Gossamer Insignia - http://www.gw2db.com...amer-insignia-s

    As you can see the limiting factor seems to be globs of ectoplasm (nostalgia for many GW1 players). The rest of the general recipe for crafting exotic weapons and armour follow the same standard recipe seen earlier in game:

    1x Insignia/ Inscription
    1x Inner Lining/ Weapon Hilt
    1x Outer Lining/ Weapon Blade

    Tier 6 materials will be needed but assuming globs of ectoplasm are available at an appropriate rate they appear much more available to the player base.
    Here's a copy/paste post.
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  20. #20
    did any of you guys here discussion actually bothered reading the topic made on guru, before commenting here.

    Read it first, you might learn something


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