These have already been posted more than once, watch them till you figure out why all your above examples make no sense:
It's not for me to prove that FoV wasn't involved, it's for you to prove it was. That source didn't mention it at all.
Limited FoV being the cause of all sickness/monitor/gaming problems is not the default position. Stop acting like it is. It makes you look stupid.
I still don't see how the bottom line has changed though? People in this thread can't even agree on what FoV is and yet you expect Anet to fix it? Good luck with that one.
Has anyone here with FoV problems tried GW2 in eyefinity/surround? Has anyone ever had problems with FoV on a multi-monitor setup in any game? Has anyone here with FoV issues tried their friends monitors/setup?
There needs to be more than "DAMMIT ANET I GET WOOZY WHEN I PLAY GW2 AND YOU NEED TO FIX IT BECAUSE WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!".
To those who still question the need for a FoV changer in the game:
Please go through this thread and read links provided and watch videos provided.
Understand the actual facts of FoV. What it is and what it isn't.
Then look at your arguments and so called solutions and realize the flaw.
Then think about the fact that FoV changing is already part of the code in the game since it can be manipulated (works on certain setups or by going windowed mode and shifting the size of the window).
Then ask yourself "since its already a part of the game, would a manual slider hurt me in any way?" and "would it help those who have issues?".
If you can answer those questions after informing and educating yourself on the issue honestly and with a smidgen of sympathy, then you will have become a smarter and more enlightened human in mere minutes.
A wide FOV should be possible on all new game releases by now. It has become firmly established that a large number of players suffer symptoms from playing with a narrow field of view and it's not difficult for developers to add the option. There is no real argument against it, just the clueless ramblings of the likes of "Rife" who insists it's the players' faults for getting nauseous because they aren't running a 3 monitor setup.
Why is there a debate ?
You don't experience the effects of a narrow FoV ? Congratulations, now shut up and be supportive for people experiencing it...
This thread kinda blows my mind.
The fairness argument (or intended feature).... please, how having some players experience headaches is f'ing fair ? Everybody will have the option to increase FoV how would it become unfair ? It's like saying we shouldn't zoom out because it gives an advantage...
Performances ? Pfff, would change almost nothing.
Difficulty of implementation ? Can be done in a day.
And I'm not even subject to the effects :/
On a side note... MMO isn't the best place, hope they take care of it quickly after the 25th once people point the problem on the official forums and it gets enough support.
Last edited by rezoacken; 2012-08-20 at 07:24 AM.
What I'm trying to say is that your cited source for the extent of people suffering due to FOV is extremely skewed due to being both extremely outdated, not related to FOV in the first place, and having a very common non-FOV source for all symptoms described.
- "Motion-blur" effects
- Large changes in FoV (frequent and/or unexpected camera zooms)
- (EDIT) Oh yes, thanks Jigain, Flickering and low-frequency displays (I always felt worse playing on PAL TVs than NTSC)
...I have a number of tricks up my sleeve to make pretty-much anybody want to throw-up.
Last edited by Alvarez; 2012-08-20 at 08:35 AM.
The "it gives an advantage" argument has been discussed a hundred times already in multiple threads on other forums, and proven to be a void argument. It's not an advantage if everyone has access to the same FoV slider which will allow values bewteen 60 and 90.
WoW doesn't even need an FoV slider because the zoom function seamlessly adjusts both FoV and zoom on the fly. Because WoW's camera does this, people incorrectly assumed FoV and zoom were the same thing in MMO's - that is, until GW2's came along. People just said "please let us zoom out more", but it was more than just zoom.Out of 10 million players I don't think anyone has experienced motion sickness when playing WoW, even if it's for the first time.
Most players actually neglect how brilliant and polished WoW's camera is. It ever hinders gameplay, transitions smoothly between first-person and 3rd person, smoothly between indoors and outdoors, and basically feels like your own eyes. Rift (and other MMO's) copied WoW's camera controls and found that nobody had any issues with it.
If GW2 can make a camera which seamlessly adjusts FoV and zoom like WoW's camera, an FoV slider won't be needed and will be irrelevant.
Also I reckon ~99% of GW2 players (actually no, 99% of PC gamers) have single or dual-monitor setups. It's a fairly safe assumption because most PC gamers will fit under one of these when it comes to triple-screen gaming:
1) Can't afford 3 screens
2) Don't have desks/space for 3 screens
2) Don't have graphics cards that even support 3 screens
3) Don't have setups that can pull playable framerates across 3 screens
4) Dislike the thick bezels that come with most affordable screens
5) Simply find it unnecessary and overkill
A lot of PC gamers have 2 screens, but it's not for multi-monitor gaming (because having a bezel down the middle is retarded). It's for single-monitor gaming + web browsing at the same time.
Also, "flickering" only occurs with low end 50/60hz models. This is why most monitors were capable of at least 75hz refresh rate even back in early 90s when computers started becoming common, and many monitors were capable of 100hz.
Also it's a completely different issue. Specifically flickering is not about simulation sickness but about stressing peripheral vision by seeing individual flicks, causing stress on eyes, rather then internal conflict of various algorithms used by our brain for navigation. This resulted in eye soreness, not motion sickness.
Last edited by Lucky_; 2012-08-20 at 01:25 PM.
I'm more confused about what is different with GW2 than other MMOs. Me, personally, I haven't noticed a difference in camera between any of the MMOs I've played, other than zoom distance. So I've got to ask, do any of you experiencing these "FoV problems" experience them in any other MMO? And enlighten us to the differences of camera between MMOs that give you FoV sickness, and those that don't. I mostly see people citing FPS's for giving problems, but not other MMOs.
No I pretty much understand now what they could implement, I understand the difference in FoV, I was just unsure of how they could fix it other than moving character placement and positioning the camera.
I honestly know now why I had issues playing the game. I wasn't getting sick but I had to stop playing after only an hour or two if I made it that far because my eyes and brain literally felt tired and I wasn't having fun anymore. And I understand now it's from this unconscious work my brain is struggling to do in order to see a wider FoV that just isn't there.
After understanding this and watching the Charr video below your post, I felt while watching him play that I was looking at the world with a box on my head blocking my peripheral vision, making me feel like I have tunnel vision.
The thing I don't understand now is why other people are against ANet even implementing a slider to help those who have this problem. It's kind of rude. How would an option impact you and your experience?
Last edited by galaxiah; 2012-08-20 at 01:38 PM.
Last edited by Lucky_; 2012-08-20 at 01:49 PM.
This isn't even an argument, people with 3 monitors already have this advantage of seeing more than a single monitor person because they created their own wider FoV with the two extra monitors..... either way they still have this "advantage" with or without a slider.
---------- Post added 2012-08-20 at 02:07 PM ----------
I am emotionally invested in this game, I have been following it for years. I've painted my own fan art, and I anticipate to buy as much merchandise as I can or what ever they make, I consider myself a huge fangirl. But nothing is perfect, to think that everything is perfect in GW2 is ignorant, even ANet knows they have improvements to make. It's a game ffs. But its important that everyone who plays is comfortable while they play. Why on earth would you tell someone that they should stop playing or not play because of a perfectly normal and understandable issue they have when it comes to persistent vision and feeling ill because of an unnatural FoV? You quite frankly sound like a huge asshole for saying so, just because you simply don't understand what they are experiencing.
Either way don't feel like reading thru this thread but an FoV slider should be standard in any pc, of any genre, everyone plays at a different distance away with a different size screen let people set the FoV to suit their needs.
"From the first to the end of the Sixth Generation of consoles, for THIRTY FOUR YEARS, this is what gaming was and it was FANTASTIC! You enjoyed the experience and gaming was what it was supposed to be FUN, COMPLETE, no DLC back then the new content was called a sequel and we waited eagerly for it."
-Muzz (L1GAMES) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePNHfnR-SwA
You misunderstand. For some people, the "game is flawless" is a belief. For you, "game is awesome" is a belief.
These are two very different beliefs. One accepts the flaws and wants them fixed. One aggressively denies the flaws even when they're obvious.