Is a "Super Soldier" like serum possible?

[Beefsquatch]

Since I see MMO-Champ is filled with smart individuals...I would like to see if such a thing would be possible. I know Stalin tried to create super soldiers via cross-breading humans with apes. I'm also aware that the US Army is in the process of creating an exoskeleton suit, something like the suits you see in Halo. But what about an actual serum that alters or enhances human performance. Not only physically, but mentally. Steroids do this to a point but have pretty negative side effects.

And what about genetic engineering. Can that also be a thing, and if so, is it more plausible than a serum? I've read that it can be much more effective and with no side effects since you are just enhancing them. Not adding any outside chemicals.

Discuss!

Oh, and some interesting articles of real life MIGHTY MICE!

http://scienceforums.com/topic/12933...made-mightier/

http://scienceforums.com/topic/12908...ns-scientists/

http://scienceforums.com/topic/3717-...regrow-organs/

[semaphore]

Well, not like those games/movies where injecting yourself with some random chemicals results in a violation of the law of conservation of energy, allowing you to magically gain copious amounts of mass without any input to speak of. But extra powerful steroids, probably?

[Deleted]

Well Masterchief and his fellow Spartans are genetically engineered soldiers and can handle to wear such heavy armor. (their armor is really heavy!)

Although I base myself upon a game, I think there is a possibility to 'enhance' soldiers.

[Jersovic]

Doubtful.

Good soldier is 90% brain, and 10% physical.

About 90% of the soldiers who want to try out for Special Forces scored too low on the ASVAB to even be eligible to go to SFAS.

[Deleted]

Until we compleately map the human genome, are allowed to perform genetic research using stem cells, and more importantly figure out and be allowed to clone humans (need a template to research on) then no. There will never be a "super soldier" serum that you see in the movies.

The best you can hope for is taking a couple of courses of testicle-shrinking, rage inducing Steroids. even then a good soldier is more than just a muscle bound monkey which doesn't think.

[Deleted]

Doubtful.

Good soldier is 90% brain, and 10% physical.

too bad most of them don't have that 90% brain.

I know many good soldiers though, but even they have to live between retards...

[Herecius]

If there is a way, then it would probably be through genetic engineering and not some kind of super serum that makes you into a superhero after taking it.

[Jersovic]

I would argue the opposite. Soldiers aren't trained to think for themselves usually, but are to react to orders/discipline. You don't need a good brain to do that. I know quite a few guys in the army, and whilst every single one is a top bloke, I would hardly classify them as "90% brain".

I said a good soldier. If you took the top soldiers from every platoon in an Infantry company they would all be above average intelligence. Hell, you can't even go to Sniper, Pathfinder or Ranger school if you don't have a 110 GT Score on your ASVAB.

[Ynna]

I would argue the opposite. Soldiers aren't trained to think for themselves usually, but are to react to orders/discipline. You don't need a good brain to do that. I know quite a few guys in the army, and whilst every single one is a top bloke, I would hardly classify them as "90% brain".

It's my understanding that it differs between general soldiers and those in the special forces. The people in the special forces are expected (and trained) to be able to know what to do on their own. They still have a chain of command, but it's a bit less formal, with more input from those of the lower ranks. This is, of course, not possible with larger groups, but special forces are generally smaller groups.

[Deleted]

Since I see MMO-Champ is filled with smart individuals...I would like to see if such a thing would be possible. I know Stalin tried to create super soldiers via cross-breading humans with apes. I'm also aware that the US Army is in the process of creating an exoskeleton suit, something like the suits you see in Halo. But what about an actual serum that alters or enhances human performance. Not only physically, but mentally. Steroids do this to a point but have pretty negative side effects.

And what about genetic engineering. Can that also be a thing, and if so, is it more plausible than a serum? I've read that it can be much more effective and with no side effects since you are just enhancing them. Not adding any outside chemicals.

Stalin cross-breeding humans and apes? Sounds strange but from what I've learned about Lysenko (a weird atheist evolution-denier crank biologist, who was able to use Stalin's paranoid traits to his benefits, and catastrophical results) he could have tried such a thing. Mentally enhancing performance? Has been tried and used. Amphetamines, used excessively by every air force in World War 2. Side-effects were not so important when your life expectance is measured in weeks or months.

[Jersovic]

It's semantics. A *good* soldier is one who follows orders and fulfills them to the letter? Nee?
Thus, as I said, you don't need a good level of intelligence to do that. Your choosing specialist soldiers schools as evidence of a good soldier, but it depends entirely on your perception and valuation of what is a "good soldier".

I have three combat tours in the Middle East, was a staff sergeant in the Military who has trained hundreds, if not thousands of soldiers. I think I know what constitutes a "good" soldier more than you do. Sorry.

Not to mention the fact that I hand picked my own team, and my replacements.

[Beefsquatch]

I said a good soldier. If you took the top soldiers from every platoon in an Infantry company they would all be above average intelligence. Hell, you can't even go to Sniper, Pathfinder or Ranger school if you don't have a 110 GT Score on your ASVAB.

It's actually 105. 107/110 is for getting a contract into the Special Ops community. Like rangers, special forces etc. And the asvab really isn't hard..at all. Very basic stuff.

[Decagon]

I said a good soldier. If you took the top soldiers from every platoon in an Infantry company they would all be above average intelligence. Hell, you can't even go to Sniper, Pathfinder or Ranger school if you don't have a 110 GT Score on your ASVAB.

If you took those same top soldiers, you would find that they're also better physically as well. The ASVAB is mostly knowledge, and knowledge is not intelligence.

[Deleted]

We certainly know there are substances that can have great physical boosts, I don't think it's too much of a stretch to imagine it's possible that there would be something that could do so without impacting mental ability.

[Jersovic]

It's actually 105. 107/110 is for getting a contract into the Special Ops community. Like rangers, special forces etc. And the asvab really isn't hard..at all. Very basic stuff.

When I went through Selection it was 110, and according to Google it still is.

You can say that the ASVAB is easy, and as a person who scored in the 99 Percentile I will agree. However, that doesn't change the fact that when I signed up for Selection that 99% of the other applicants (including my best friend) were rejected due to a lack of 110 GT Score.

[Beefsquatch]

Until we compleately map the human genome, are allowed to perform genetic research using stem cells, and more importantly figure out and be allowed to clone humans (need a template to research on) then no. There will never be a "super soldier" serum that you see in the movies.

The best you can hope for is taking a couple of courses of testicle-shrinking, rage inducing Steroids. even then a good soldier is more than just a muscle bound monkey which doesn't think.

Good point, how far along are we in that area? If you know, that is.

[Fenixdown]

You should ask Jose Canseco if it's possible. :P

[Beavis]

Yep, definitely possible. Soldiers will probably be some of the earliest transhumans. Kind of a scary thought.

[Beavis]

When I went through Selection it was 110, and according to Google it still is.

You can say that the ASVAB is easy, and as a person who scored in the 99 Percentile I will agree. However, that doesn't change the fact that when I signed up for Selection that 99% of the other applicants (including my best friend) were rejected due to a lack of 110 GT Score.

Wow, 99%. That's pretty impressive. I had the guy working the desk at MEPS bring some other people over to gawk when I got a 97%.

[Deleted]

Good point, how far along are we in that area? If you know, that is.

the actual mapping of the genome was completed in 2003. However there is many years of research and analysis left to know what everything does.