Why do HC raiding guilds say 'no' to females?

[ChiefWigman]

My guild's co-gm is a female, along with her we had 4 more females on our 10m HM raid team, we kicked it off great, made good progress, no drama shit stormin'. 3 of them were excellent healers and 2 dps putting out good numbers.

the req's in OP's list is too sterotypical, heck, myself, i'd fail to meet their "requirements" since i cannot use vent or a mic. Authenicator required? hell its optional but that on the list makes me think the guild has several hack-saavy players and would hack on a moments notice if the guildie ain't doing well.

[Nah]

A lot of these posts seem to be "a bunch of guys will like one girl, so it's the girls fault."

All my what. ❤

It's not so much that it's our fault, just that it's easier to remove the stimulus. Far easier to recruit for an all-male guild than an all-female.

As a female raider, I often don't see myself as one. I have frequently complained about other female raiders for many of the same reasons in this thread. In TBC I was bullied out of a guild by a female officer who saw me (and every other female who didn't completely suck up to her) as a threat to her relationship with the GM. It was a very confusing experience, but a large chunk of the raid team also left and together we created our own guild, which still exists as the top-ranked progression team on my old server. Since then, I've seen plenty of drama and stupidity from others of my sex...cat fights causing multiple people to gquit, GMs and officers favoring their e-girlfriend, and so on. It's that damned vocal minority that ruins it for the rest of us.

I was the GM's girlfriend once, at the end of WotLK. We lived very near each other (we now live together), so things worked out well IRL, but we knew there would be drama over it online if we weren't careful. He spoke with the officers about it first, so they would make sure he was being fair with things like loot distribution. If I fucked something up (stood in fire, etc.), he wouldn't hesitate to call me out or bench me for someone else. The guild eventually folded, when too many raiders had to quit for various RL reasons, and I'm sure there were still a few people who had no idea we were dating. What a majority of them still don't know is, there was another female in the guild vying for the GM's affections, which I knew full well about. She approached me about it, and we had a frank talk. There was zero drama over it, and we are still friends to this day.

*raisin' the bar*

[Nos]

This thread is sad.

People need to grow up and not be judgmental man-children.

"WOMEN CUASE TEH DRAMAZZZZZZ LAWL" Yes, Because it is not like men /ever/ dare dream of doing anything to cause drama am I right? Oh wait....

Women are fine players at the game, and I know a few who are a whole hell of alot better than 90% of the population of WoW. You don't have to be a 320 pound fat,white,nerdy basement dweller to be good at a game, Guess what? You can have tits and game great just as well

Of course you can. My wife is a much better raider than me, and our guild is at least 33% women.

But when drama gets started, in this guild, or any of the past 5 I've been in, guess who it was by or over? I'm not saying it's a blanket. I'm saying it's how it is in my personal experience. You also don't have to be a fat white nerdy basement dweller to be a guy. And people with tits can apparently stereotype with the best of them.

[Azshalorah]

Did you also know that quite a few females do not broadcast their gender in WoW (like I have in the past) just to avoid bigoted, ignorant and sexist opinions from immature 'males'.

I, too, have been doing this since '05. It's not uncommon for females to do this.

[Chrom]

You know, 90% of female players in wow are just horrible raiders...There's your answer.

Infracted

The guy gets infracted for telling the truth. Wow. Awesome.
Well I'm not afraid to speak out my mind. I've been playing mmos for 5 years and I've met a real lot of female players so I'm not just talking out of my ass. My experience with them was that... well... let's put it this way: if I was a leader of some big serious guild, I'd have same rule. Females are bad players whether they like it or not, they're unreliable, they demand special treatment and attention, they think they can get away with anything just because they're girls (and often do, unfortunately). Hell, I even have one female friend myself who plays mmos and she's even relatively attractive. You wanna hear the truth? When "that time" comes, she's a fraking bitch. I wouldn't let her close to not just raid, to any mmo at all. Outside of that she's all nice and furry even though by far not a good player. But you never know. It is much better to just take some guy in her spot.
Now I'm not saying they're all like that, but what are the chances of getting a nice and quiet girl even at "that time" while also a good gamer? Very slim to none.

Btw requirements you posted are beyond insane. Mic? I don't use mic, I have speech defect and I'm a dps, I don't even really need a mic. Authenticator? Really? Cell phone? What we all should be in same country or something? Come on, please tell me you just made that up, there can't possibly be a guild with officers as full of shit as this one!

[bewbew]

Personal experience, the problem isn't the girls.

It's the guys being around the girls.

A lot of guys (I'm not gonna say basement dwelling nerds, because I'm one of those, except no basement) will act like total morons in the presence of girls, regardless of age, distance or availability.

It's just how it is in the internet.

[Faladrath]

I think the thought behind it is that females tend to been more emo, not saying you all are just more so then guys, from my personal xp since vanilla beta. Atm playing with some non-attentionwhores and/or dramaqueens and they are great both as player and person, but also seen the flipside, which im guessing is where those "requirments" come from.

[Unclekreepy]

in just about every guild hc or not that i've been in with a girl or girls, the girls some how manipulated the guild leader / raid leader to either give them items or give them power.

[Nos]

I, too, have been doing this since '05. It's not uncommon for females to do this.

Unless the majority of players are secretly women, I don't think there's that many players hiding it. At least, not on any of the servers I've been on. Not only do most of the women try to use the fact that they're women to get free shit, but hell, plenty of guys pretend to be women for that reason too.

(In an old guild, there were 3 different men pretending to be female raiders to get preferential treatment. They all actually started trying to hit on each other secretly. You can imagine how hilariously that all ended.)

[sulfuric]

The problem with your argument is that it is so full of holes.

Both Paragon and Blood Legion (amongst others) have female members of their raiding teams. Find 100 skilled men compared to 10-15 females is a pointless statement. The ratio of males to females who play WoW is ofc unbalanced. You keep mentioning statistics which is so almost laughable. Where do you pull these statistics from btw? Did you also know that quite a few females do not broadcast their gender in WoW (like I have in the past) just to avoid bigoted, ignorant and sexist opinions from immature 'males'.

Quite happy in my guild btw that is one of the top guilds on our realm.

World best and realm best are miles apart. I am talking about top guilds and the chicks in BL are jokes that should have been replaced ages ago, except they are in leadership so they must be tolerated. You confused bigoted with realistic, I have played and raided with females and have had negative experiences almost every time not to mention they almost always involve themselves in some sort of in game relationship with another raider usually one in leadership.

[Serenia]

I'm a female and I raid hc! You just have to find the right people, some guilds just think that girls are the cause of most drama (which is true on some situations) but the same can be said for many male raiders. I'm sure there is a huge amount of male raiders that have caused drama over loot or similar things like achievement runs/etc too.

[Dezeria]

Every raiding guild I've been in had a female GM, and/or raid leader.

[Condoner]

World best and realm best are miles apart.

This, so this.

So many people in this thread have said people they raided with were good because they were one of the best players in a top 5 on their server guild.

Unless your server is illidan, this is not the case.

[Liliara]

i'm surprised the thread got re-opened O_o
What was the reason for it ;o ?

[Tziva]

i'm surprised the thread got re-opened O_o
What was the reason for it ;o ?

Permission to reopen was handed down from up high.

I'm not the mod here so don't take this as anything official but I think as long as people keep this from turning into rampant gender-bashing, discussion is going to be allowed to continue.

[cexspa]

Drama, drama, drama,and more drama.
playing since 2006 almost every single guild i joined that had girls in it got ruined in the end or got divided.
iirc "Death and Taxes" US guild fell apart cause of girl drama.

[Nah]

Drama, drama, drama,and more drama.
playing since 2006 almost every single guild i joined that had girls in it got ruined in the end or got divided.
iirc "for the horde" US guild fell apart cause of girl drama.

>_> Didn't FTH die because they got fed up with WoW after they were banned for exploiting LFR?

(e) Well, and to play SW:ToR. And they're back raiding now, as far as I know.

[neccowafer]

When a male is the GM's bro and gets protected and gets to keep raiding with them even though he sucks, people don't seem to notice as much. When it's a female, it's like OMG DRAMA SHE MUST BE SHOWIN HIM ER TITS.

Fact is that people who are closer to the GM/officers often get special treatment, or flat out just get to keep raiding even though they suck really bad. If you're an "outsider" in a guild that is mostly made up of a small group of irl friends, 90% of the time (in my experience) there will be "that guy" or "that girl" who is friends with everyone but is really terrible, and I've seen it be a guy more often than a girl just because there are more guys around. There might even be multiple "that guy"s.

If it's a guy though, people in the situation are more likely to just say it's a "bad guild" and if it's a girl, people in the situation seem more likely to say that it's a good guild but "that chick" is ruining it.

Not to mention a lot of people I played with, I never knew their gender. Because I don't ask. I don't care. It isn't a defining feature of anyone I want to hang out with. (i.e. if someone is really wrapped up in doing society-dictated "guy things" or "girl things" they'll probably bore the crap out of me with the inanity of everything they do and talk about) If you played with me, I'd never have told you whether I was male or female.

[Duridi]

The guy gets infracted for telling the truth. Wow. Awesome.

The truth as you want to believe it.

[0mni]

World best and realm best are miles apart.

Very true. A person's dedication to something is based solely on themselves, not on gender. So more guys happen to be in those guilds, that doesn't make any girls any less skilled.

You confused bigoted with realistic, I have played and raided with females and have had negative experiences almost every time not to mention they almost always involve themselves in some sort of in game relationship with another raider usually one in leadership.

So based on your bro-science, every girl must suck, want to fuck the guild leader, be a healer, and generally craves attention. It must be true based on your limited experience, right?

There's nothing realistic about it. This debate is just as mentally retarding as "Why are all guys the same?!" kind of bullshit. Just because the girls you've played with suck doesn't mean all girls you play with from now until you die will be carbon copies of those girls. It's just as stupid as generalizing based on race, age, etc.