1. #1881
    Stood in the Fire Aeiri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamikaeo View Post
    How do you get 30% up time on Lei Shen trinket? I only average a measly 5% up time on most of the fights.
    I believe in one of these threads there was a discussion saying that Rain of Fire on the Wandering Eyes resulted in a stupid uptime increase for the trinket.

  2. #1882
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    As I understand it it's not from the walls, but rather some sort of bug with RoF interacting with the eyes that devour players.
    I would say it's both, considering the frequency of both elements in the fight I would not be surprised. Though I haven't read anything about it being related to a bug with the eyes. Could be. To be fair, I don't have the trinket yet so I haven't really paid much attention to it yet.
    Not#1974

  3. #1883
    Quote Originally Posted by Woz View Post
    I would say it's both, considering the frequency of both elements in the fight I would not be surprised. Though I haven't read anything about it being related to a bug with the eyes. Could be. To be fair, I don't have the trinket yet so I haven't really paid much attention to it yet.
    As far as I understand it RPPM is specifically designed such that the amount of chances for a proc to happen doesn't directly impact how often it'll proc.

    IE an aff lock having a tick event every .1 second doesn't have a higher uptime than a destro lock hitting every 1 second.


    I'm 99% sure it's a bug with wandering eyes. (My semi-educated guess is that it has to do with how the eyes turn around and devour when they take damage. Perhaps the game is counting the devour as a separate event from the player, but that that extra event can still proc RPPM stuff while not counting as the actual players damage, so the RPPM mechanic is being fooled.)

  4. #1884
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    As far as I understand it RPPM is specifically designed such that the amount of chances for a proc to happen doesn't directly impact how often it'll proc.

    IE an aff lock having a tick event every .1 second doesn't have a higher uptime than a destro lock hitting every 1 second.
    It's intended to, and *almost* does, but while I can't follow it, I read a mathematical analysis showing that more events causing a chance to proc does increase proc rate - JUST BARELY. With enough targets/ticks it's noticeable, but it's not a 600% multiplier.

    That said, the increase is small enough that it just can't be responsible for this unless all of the RoF ticks were considered 1 event (which would be a bug AND should show up in other fights more than it does) or, as you say, the RPPM mechanic is being fooled into providing a chance to proc without triggering a new "since last chance to proc" timer (which would also be a bug).

  5. #1885
    Shrug, very possible. I'm only really play Destro for Durumu since I'm not amazing at Demo and Aff brings nothing to the table for that fight nor do I have the trinket so don't really know the ins and outs of it entirely yet (especially for Destro). I feel like it's something Blizz would have at least mentioned at this point considering Heroics have been out for a fair bit of time now.
    Not#1974

  6. #1886
    I'm 99% sure it's a bug with wandering eyes. (My semi-educated guess is that it has to do with how the eyes turn around and devour when they take damage. Perhaps the game is counting the devour as a separate event from the player, but that that extra event can still proc RPPM stuff while not counting as the actual players damage, so the RPPM mechanic is being fooled.)
    This is probably a good guess. If you look at devour, it's damage type is actually dependent on the type of damage it recieves.

    i.e. it's possible for devour to be fire damage, shadowflame, chaos, physical, frost, holy, etc. It's possible that fire damage devours based off rain of fire are tied to the player
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  7. #1887
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    As I understand it it's not from the walls, but rather some sort of bug with RoF interacting with the eyes that devour players.
    Not a bug, just extra damageable targets. What might be buggy is that the game might count the damage done to players as a result of damaging the wandering eyes as RPPM events.
    Last edited by Xyronic; 2013-04-07 at 01:29 PM.

  8. #1888
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    IMO there must be a bug, there are other fights where I hit as many or more targets (trashs for examples), and it doesn't proc like it does on Durumu. My uptime wasn't as good as yours (around 17%) but the procs do go insane as soon as there are eyes around :
    [22:27:36.870] Zûmzum gains Perfect Aim from Zûmzum
    [22:27:36.870] Zûmzum's Perfect Aim is refreshed by Zûmzum
    [22:27:36.870] Zûmzum's Perfect Aim is refreshed by Zûmzum
    [22:27:38.081] Zûmzum's Perfect Aim is refreshed by Zûmzum
    [22:27:38.884] Zûmzum's Perfect Aim is refreshed by Zûmzum
    [22:27:38.884] Zûmzum's Perfect Aim is refreshed by Zûmzum
    [22:27:40.435] Zûmzum's Perfect Aim is refreshed by Zûmzum
    This isn't happening on the walls, although I am hitting more targets.
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  9. #1889
    Wow that's crazy, 3 procs within a second?

  10. #1890
    High Overlord Strifus's Avatar
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    Affliction gear question

    I just obtained the T15 2 set, but to use it I'll be replacing the HC gloves from Jin'rokh with 522 set gloves. Wondering if this will yield a dps increase or not?

  11. #1891
    The multiple procs at the same instant in time (22:27:36.870) confirms my theory that it's rolling chance to proc for each hit simultaneously with an equal chance. Otherwise, only the first proc in the RPPM sequence would have a non-0 chance to proc; hitting many targets instantly DOES increase your RPPM because of this.

    Note: not more hits total, but more hits counted at a 0 time delta.

  12. #1892
    Pandaren Monk Evela's Avatar
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    Might have been mentioned already (only skimmed the last few pages), but it seems we don't have to fear a SB:SS nerf. At least not as much:

    Greg Street ‏@Ghostcrawler 5. apr
    @tiskool But I should clarify that we generally like SB:SS in PvE. It's PvP where it hold[s] Affliction back.

    Source (dedicated to Xskarma): https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/sta...61656670261248
    Last edited by Evela; 2013-04-08 at 09:54 PM.

  13. #1893
    Stood in the Fire Rife's Avatar
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    Can anyone offer their insight on Lei Shen's for Afflic?

    I'm guessing the main reason Everlasting Afflic is viable for demo with Lei Shens is because Doom is a such a long dot and that Doom crits net you an imp and 50 Demonic Fury? Does this mean Everlasting Afflic sucks for Afflic?

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  14. #1894
    Quote Originally Posted by Rife View Post
    Can anyone offer their insight on Lei Shen's for Afflic?

    I'm guessing the main reason Everlasting Afflic is viable for demo with Lei Shens is because Doom is a such a long dot and that Doom crits net you an imp and 50 Demonic Fury? Does this mean Everlasting Afflic sucks for Afflic?
    It's practically a 20% nerf to all damage done for affliction, compared to a 20% nerf to like 30% of demo's damage done.

    It's pretty bad for affliction.

  15. #1895
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    It's practically a 20% nerf to all damage done for affliction, compared to a 20% nerf to like 30% of demo's damage done.

    It's pretty bad for affliction.
    but does the same hold true when using lei shen, 50% longer duraction of 100% crit dots seems like it could be close, dont know how it could be calculated though since the randomness of procs of the rppm trinkets

    ive used the glyph on council normal to mess around as afflic with lei shens, can usually only hit 2 of the bosses in the 4 secs, sometimes im really quick and can get 3. just wondering how it would work out single target, havnt tried it yet since im having such good results without the glyph

  16. #1896
    The problem is that the auto-crit dots under EA would yield not-that-much higher DPS on single target to DPSing without auto crits without the glyph.

    Assume 100% crit (not even uptime!) - that's what, an 87% increase to ~50% of your damage (dots, not MG/DS ticks - going from "15%" crit at 103% damage boost to 100% crit at 103% damage boost). 43.5% increased damage. Then take off ~19% of your new DPS (143.5% of original) for a net 16.235% damage increase.

    How often do you get your dots up with Perfect Aim? If we assume 1/2, you're already losing damage. 1/2 would be extremely generous. This is before counting applying stronger dots from other int procs, or haste procs...

    EA is bad for affliction.

    Edit: I'm dead tired and probably shouldn't be throwing napkin math around, but you get the idea and I'm 99.9% sure no better math supports EA.

    Edit2: Rife - yes, it was simming as almost DPS neutral for Demo before the doom/corr nerfs on a single target, and ahead for multiple, because Demo really really likes fury and imps, which means post-nerf, it is indeed ahead, assuming targets survive long enough to make use of the extended time. Assuming UVLS. Without, EA's a DPS loss.
    Last edited by Kael; 2013-04-09 at 09:16 AM.

  17. #1897
    Why is Sparkuggz using lei shens Trinket if it is so bad?

  18. #1898
    Quote Originally Posted by Schaendwich View Post
    Why is Sparkuggz using lei shens Trinket if it is so bad?
    the trinket is great, we were talking about the EA glyph

  19. #1899
    TBH, Lei Shens trinket seems like it would be godly if you have a on-use trinket, unfortunately there are none this tier. So that makes me wonder, for aff, which trinket is best paired with this one?

  20. #1900
    Quote Originally Posted by Destroyed View Post
    TBH, Lei Shens trinket seems like it would be godly if you have a on-use trinket, unfortunately there are none this tier. So that makes me wonder, for aff, which trinket is best paired with this one?
    cha-yes is the best for it. but hydra is a close 2nd

    also seems to be fight dependent, on bosses where u do mostly single target dmg uvls+cha-yes , on multidot fights uvls+hydra since the 2 dont work together and hydra has a decent duration on the proc for refreshing supercharged dots on multiple targets.
    Last edited by weakdots; 2013-04-09 at 07:01 PM.

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