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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    if you are not using Dark Soul on cooldown then you are really playing the game wrong. So Glyph of Dark Soul cannot ever be justified.
    Well Demo doesn't use Dark Soul on CD, we wait until we reach 750 Demonic Fury but if you can't DPS in Meta for the duration of Dark Soul at any point during the fight, than it may be worth it to take the Glyph. A fight that is mechanic intensive, movement intensive or has quick, sporadic burn phases may warrant the use of the Glyph.
    Last edited by Xandy; 2012-09-17 at 05:05 AM.
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  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by Xandy View Post
    Well Demo doesn't use Dark Soul on CD, we wait until we reach 750 Demonic Fury but if you can't DPS in Meta for the duration of Dark Soul at any point during the fight, than it may be worth it to take the Glyph. A fight that is mechanic intensive, movement intensive or has quick, sporadic burn phases may warrant the use of the Glyph.
    With the passive effect inactive while you have Dark Soul on cooldown I doubt there'd be much of any benefit to using the glyph. I'm pretty sure I saw some math that said you had to have Dark Soul off cooldown for a long period for the glyph to break even. ( I have a vague memory of it being 20+ seconds) I think the circumstances for this glyph to work are pretty limited, and it will take some getting to know the individual fights before we know if the glyph can be used as a DPS increase. I think we should, as default, always choose to NOT use the glyph, and then see if there are weird circumstances that make it worth it.
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  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    I think the circumstances for this glyph to work are pretty limited, and it will take some getting to know the individual fights before we know if the glyph can be used as a DPS increase. I think we should, as default, always choose to NOT use the glyph, and then see if there are weird circumstances that make it worth it.
    Yes, once MoP comes out and we get to know the fights more, the possible uses for the Glyph will become apparent, but at the moment there aren't any in DS so it does seem pretty useless.
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    It is better to have raided and wiped, then to never have raided at all.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    With the passive effect inactive while you have Dark Soul on cooldown I doubt there'd be much of any benefit to using the glyph. I'm pretty sure I saw some math that said you had to have Dark Soul off cooldown for a long period for the glyph to break even. ( I have a vague memory of it being 20+ seconds) I think the circumstances for this glyph to work are pretty limited, and it will take some getting to know the individual fights before we know if the glyph can be used as a DPS increase. I think we should, as default, always choose to NOT use the glyph, and then see if there are weird circumstances that make it worth it.
    I believe that the passive 3% works out to be a little bit less than using the CD on cooldown. (20/(120/20)) = 3.33% stat. Thus if you aren't pairing the Dark Soul CD with other CDs and you aren't casting dark soul on CD then the glyph would be giving you more benefit. Not to mention that you retain the ability to cast it, for example, when you hit execute range where the fact that you no longer have the passive doesn't matter as much as the fight will be ending shortly, bumping up the overall value.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    I believe that the passive 3% works out to be a little bit less than using the CD on cooldown. (20/(120/20)) = 3.33% stat. Thus if you aren't pairing the Dark Soul CD with other CDs and you aren't casting dark soul on CD then the glyph would be giving you more benefit. Not to mention that you retain the ability to cast it, for example, when you hit execute range where the fact that you no longer have the passive doesn't matter as much as the fight will be ending shortly, bumping up the overall value.
    What makes the glyph bad, and ultimately quite substantially so, is simply stacking DS with other cooldowns works out better, the multiplicative adding up of damage increasing cooldowns and the fact our Mastery increases damage from our Service pet, Imp Swarm and Doomguard so those cooldowns are bolstered further.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    What makes the glyph bad, and ultimately quite substantially so, is simply stacking DS with other cooldowns works out better, the multiplicative adding up of damage increasing cooldowns and the fact our Mastery increases damage from our Service pet, Imp Swarm and Doomguard so those cooldowns are bolstered further.
    Yeah I agree, but if there are fights where you don't have the ability, for whatever reason, to pair it with other CDs and you can't be casting it on CD then it could definitely be better.

  7. #167
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    when in caster form, at what number of targets do you stop multi-dotting and using Shadow Bolt and start using Hellfire or Harvest Life to build Fury and do damage?

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    when in caster form, at what number of targets do you stop multi-dotting and using Shadow Bolt and start using Hellfire or Harvest Life to build Fury and do damage?
    Simcraft does it at 4.

  9. #169
    Stood in the Fire notwen's Avatar
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    chaos wave is out of meta rotation ? why ?

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  10. #170
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notwen View Post
    chaos wave is out of meta rotation ? why ?
    the benefits of the fury gained and damage done by overlapping the Shadowflame DoT from hand Of Gul'dan outway using chaos wave rotationally
    but Chaos Wave does have specific uses for burst AoE where a lot of things NEED TO DIE NOW. in which case it's not a rotational ability per se.

  11. #171
    Stood in the Fire notwen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    the benefits of the fury gained and damage done by overlapping the Shadowflame DoT from hand Of Gul'dan outway using chaos wave rotationally
    but Chaos Wave does have specific uses for burst AoE where a lot of things NEED TO DIE NOW. in which case it's not a rotational ability per se.
    sorry, i dont understant it too well, but chaos wave is just for aoe now ? it isnt usable on single target ? thats right ?

    btw, thanks for replying

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  12. #172
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notwen View Post
    sorry, i dont understant it too well, but chaos wave is just for aoe now ? it isnt usable on single target ? thats right ?

    btw, thanks for replying
    it can be used on single target but you don't get much bang for your buck. However you would use Chaos Wave on single targets during major burst phases, like the Tendons on Spine of Deathwing or Hagara when she takes extra damage. But you would be better off use Hand of Guld'dan on patchwerk type fights like Ultraxion or or fights where you can using HoG on aoe adds to get a huge amount fury to wail on a single targets (eg. HoG on regenerative Bloods => more fury for ToCs on blistering Tentacles)
    Last edited by Grubjuice; 2012-09-19 at 09:40 PM.

  13. #173
    I'm a little confused about how our DoT's work now, do they update dynamically like Doomguard? Or should we still recast Doom and Corruption with Intellect procs? Also should I be saving Imp Swarm for Dark Soul/Meta Burn or pop it at the start with GrimServ to get my Fury to build super quick?
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  14. #174
    As for DoTs, the stats you have when they are applied to the target are the stats they have for the rest of their duration. If you refresh a dot early, either with a recast, or with a refresh mechanic (which I believe touch of chaos or w/e does to corruption in Meta form), then the next tick is the damage of the previous dot, while subsequent ticks are for the new stats.

  15. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by Xandy View Post
    I'm a little confused about how our DoT's work now, do they update dynamically like Doomguard? Or should we still recast Doom and Corruption with Intellect procs? Also should I be saving Imp Swarm for Dark Soul/Meta Burn or pop it at the start with GrimServ to get my Fury to build super quick?
    Doom yes, Corruption isnt that important since every ToC cast recalculates it
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  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellfury View Post
    Doom yes, Corruption isnt that important since every ToC cast recalculates it
    I thought they had removed the corruption recalculation because people we're seeing it recalculated at caster damage when using a ToC (and while in mid flight) dropping out of meta and it refreshing on impact and losing substantial dps.
    Soulburn: Unstable Affliction. A boy can dream.

  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by Brauhm View Post
    I thought they had removed the corruption recalculation because people we're seeing it recalculated at caster damage when using a ToC (and while in mid flight) dropping out of meta and it refreshing on impact and losing substantial dps.
    No, they just made it so that Corruption does not benefit from Metamorphosis.

  18. #178
    Stood in the Fire notwen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    it can be used on single target but you don't get much bang for your buck. However you would use Chaos Wave on single targets during major burst phases, like the Tendons on Spine of Deathwing or Hagara when she takes extra damage. But you would be better off use Hand of Guld'dan on patchwerk type fights like Ultraxion or or fights where you can using HoG on aoe adds to get a huge amount fury to wail on a single targets (eg. HoG on regenerative Bloods => more fury for ToCs on blistering Tentacles)
    oh nice, i got it now, thanks bro

    Thanks Shy for this great sig !

  19. #179
    So bosses that take increase dmg you want to use chaos wave on during meta? For example on Elegon since he takes increase dmg from the sparks and you get a 50% buff you would use it then?

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by nightrianna View Post
    So bosses that take increase dmg you want to use chaos wave on during meta? For example on Elegon since he takes increase dmg from the sparks and you get a 50% buff you would use it then?
    Only if it's in a short phase when you need to burn. I don't know the fight details well enough to know for sure, but from when I watched streams I don't think Elegon fight was built that way. He just takes extra damage, but I think it probably lasts long enough for you to empty your fury using ToC, which is a better damage per fury spell then CW.
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