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  1. #41
    High Overlord Rustynip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaljurei View Post
    Correct, but Warriors will be switching to Fury once they have normal T14 gear, at that point Fury will be pulling ahead.
    This is true but every DPS warrior should also have an Arms spec because there are many fights where Sweeping Strikes is going to be a huge game changer. A few I can pull off the top of my head are: Stone Guard, Amber Shaper Un'sok, Wind Lord, and possibly Garajal the Spiritbinder if your raid is having trouble with adds in the spirit realm. There's potentially more but that's just what I can pull off the top of my head.

  2. #42
    Thanks for the guide!

  3. #43
    Great guide, many thanks

  4. #44
    Cheers chap for this guide. Was looking for it for a while

  5. #45
    Wait wait wait... I am still trying to get used to the idea that crit > str, it's a bit new to me... and hit is almost last priority after 7.5% cap? :O won't our rage regeneration suck completely?! atm I am having like 19% and managing very well, won't I lack tons of rage with such a low % of hit? Would like some explanations how things work in MoP to cover that huge loss of rage generation as our best attacks are auto attacks of course atm...

    Thanks for the guide of course

  6. #46
    High Overlord Rustynip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kazlofski View Post
    Wait wait wait... I am still trying to get used to the idea that crit > str, it's a bit new to me... and hit is almost last priority after 7.5% cap? :O won't our rage regeneration suck completely?! atm I am having like 19% and managing very well, won't I lack tons of rage with such a low % of hit? Would like some explanations how things work in MoP to cover that huge loss of rage generation as our best attacks are auto attacks of course atm...

    Thanks for the guide of course
    Well crit being better than strength is only going to apply towards gems. It definitely doesnt mean that you should be taking agi gear because it has more crit This is because secondary stats are doubled on gems, therefore increasing their benefit. The reason that we are not stacking hit anymore is because of the way the rage generation system has migrated. We are no longer dependent on only Melee swings to generate rage. CS had its rage requirement removed and BT now generates 10 rage. RB and blood surge procs only cost 10 rage. This only leaves HS and non blood surge Wild Strike as our primary rage spenders.
    Last edited by Rustynip; 2012-08-25 at 06:15 PM.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustynip View Post
    Well crit being better than strength is only going to apply towards gems. It definitely doesnt mean should be taking agi gear because it has more crit This is because secondary stats are doubled on gems, therefore increasing their benefit. The reason that we are not stacking hit anymore is because of the way the rage generation system has migrated. We are no longer dependent on only Melee swings to generate rage. CS had its rage requirement removed and BT now generates 10 rage. RB and blood surge procs only cost 10 rage. This only leaves HS and non blood surge Wild Strike as our primary rage spenders.
    Aha that's cool indeed... Thanks for that info, gemming makes sense if it's doubled indeed. So with gemming I suppose we wait until 90, they aren't doubled now so no point changing, right away this wednesday we change stats to that priority? I mean it instantly turns 7.5% hit and expertise cap or is that only on level 90 and on level 85 you still need 8% for caps?
    Last edited by Kazlofski; 2012-08-25 at 06:14 PM.

  8. #48
    High Overlord Rustynip's Avatar
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    This coming Tuesday when the pre patch is released, all caps go to 7.5%. We get all our new talents and abilities but I'm not 100% positive what our gemming scheme will be. I haven't gotten to test it much.
    Last edited by Rustynip; 2012-08-25 at 06:20 PM.

  9. #49
    Crit being superior to STR has nothing to do with the new gems. The hybrid gems being superior to pure gems is true for almost everyone, because every spec has a secondary rating that's .5 or higher compared to their primary stat. Fury is the only spec, afaik, that a secondary rating tops a primary stat point for point.

    You won't use agi gear because you lose the 5% from plate specialization, because the agi on it is wasted and STR on gear is independant of secondary ratings.

    Hit being so good was mostly due to 2pc T13. In FL BiS gear hit = mastery and without the tier bonus mastery would have surpassed hit. Hit got such a boost that it became as good as crit in T13.
    Last edited by Satori; 2012-08-25 at 06:59 PM.
    Cairne wanted to thank him again, to offer encouragement, praise for a task so successfully completed. For being able to bear such burdens. But Saurfang was an orc, not a blood elf, and lavish compliments and effusion would not be welcomed or wanted.

  10. #50
    Mechagnome Requiel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satori View Post
    Crit being superior to STR has nothing to do with the new gems. The hybrid gems being superior to pure gems is true for almost everyone, because every spec has a secondary rating that's .5 or higher compared to their primary stat. Fury is the only spec, afaik, that a secondary rating tops a primary stat point for point.

    You won't use agi gear because you lose the 5% from plate specialization, because the agi on it is wasted and STR on gear is independant of secondary ratings.

    Hit being so good was mostly due to 2pc T13. In FL BiS gear hit = mastery and without the tier bonus mastery would have surpassed hit. Hit got such a boost that it became as good as crit in T13.
    Crit isn't superior to strenght when for SMF 1:1, strength is slightly higher going off simc (only thing we have that judges stat weights) but crit is higher for TG







    we can use agi gear such as capes, rings, trinkets, necklaces and weapons as they don't take away from plate specialization
    Last edited by Requiel; 2012-08-25 at 10:03 PM.

  11. #51
    High Overlord Rustynip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satori View Post
    Crit being superior to STR has nothing to do with the new gems. The hybrid gems being superior to pure gems is true for almost everyone, because every spec has a secondary rating that's .5 or higher compared to their primary stat. Fury is the only spec, afaik, that a secondary rating tops a primary stat point for point.
    Crit is beating out Strength in terms of gemming because of BT's baseline double chance to crit. This equates to higher enrage uptimes, more use of RB, and higher damage output.

    Quote Originally Posted by Satori View Post
    You won't use agi gear because you lose the 5% from plate specialization, because the agi on it is wasted and STR on gear is independent of secondary ratings.
    I didn't say we would be using agi gear, I said "It definitely doesn't mean should be taking agi gear because it has more crit". Cloaks, necks, rings, weapons and trinkets can all have agi on them and not make us lose our plate specialization bonus. Agi should be avoided like it has since the beginning of cata.

    Quote Originally Posted by Satori View Post
    Hit being so good was mostly due to 2pc T13. In FL BiS gear hit = mastery and without the tier bonus mastery would have surpassed hit. Hit got such a boost that it became as good as crit in T13.
    Yes, and mastery was also very good pre 4.1 when they nerfed our base mastery. Stacking crit and mastery in previous tiers meant more RNG on top a a spec that was already very RNG because you were guaranteed less of a chance of rage generation from white attacks. All that damage increase doesn't mean anything if you don't have the rage to spend. Anyways, moving on: since BT is supplying us with rage now, it severely lessens our dependency on white hits, hence why hit is much lower on priority.

  12. #52
    You don't use agi jewelry because the str + crit is higher than what you'll get in crit from an agi piece. If it had an amount of crit higher than the str+crit combination (since they're roughly 1:1), yes, you'd pick the agi piece, but that won't be happening.

    And obviously, the crit weight is based in t14H gear, so it's also influenced by the strength on that gear.

    My point was to say that you should always favor crit > strength (I didn't think of SMF, thanks for that info) and from the responses you gave I got the idea that you were advertising using hybrid gems. Upon checking the guide I realized I was wrong and you correctly indicate pure crit gems and hit/expertise ones when under the cap. While I still don't agree with the assertion that "crit > strength only matters in gemming", with how currently the itemization is set up this is true, so arguing over it is moot.
    Cairne wanted to thank him again, to offer encouragement, praise for a task so successfully completed. For being able to bear such burdens. But Saurfang was an orc, not a blood elf, and lavish compliments and effusion would not be welcomed or wanted.

  13. #53
    We have some confusion going on in this thread. We have people comparing SEP values to MoP gem values (as it pertains to Strength vs. Crit specifically). If the crit SEP value is greater than the strength SEP value then Crit will be favored over Strength, period.

    The fact that secondary stats have been doubled on gems in MoP is extraneous to SEP values. SEP values provide the information necessary to make the decision on how to gem, enchant, reforge, etc...

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Keensteel View Post
    We have some confusion going on in this thread. We have people comparing SEP values to MoP gem values (as it pertains to Strength vs. Crit specifically). If the crit SEP value is greater than the strength SEP value then Crit will be favored over Strength, period.

    The fact that secondary stats have been doubled on gems in MoP is extraneous to SEP values. SEP values provide the information necessary to make the decision on how to gem, enchant, reforge, etc...
    My point exactly.
    Cairne wanted to thank him again, to offer encouragement, praise for a task so successfully completed. For being able to bear such burdens. But Saurfang was an orc, not a blood elf, and lavish compliments and effusion would not be welcomed or wanted.

  15. #55
    I should have quoted you, Satori, on my previous post. I am in agreement with you and felt like Rustynips needed some clarification.

    I feel like the SEP values (TG Fury) you posted at level 90 should also apply at level 85 (release of the 5.0.4 patch)? Am I missing something about the scaling between levels 85 and 90? Wouldn't TG warriors value crit over strength where applicable upon the 5.0.4 patch release?

  16. #56
    Blademaster Domex Tyranny's Avatar
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    Bad warrior is bad.

    ---------- Post added 2012-08-25 at 11:09 PM ----------

    I mean really bad.

  17. #57
    High Overlord Rustynip's Avatar
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    you gotta get that post count up!
    Last edited by Rustynip; 2012-08-26 at 04:15 AM.

  18. #58
    Blademaster Domex Tyranny's Avatar
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    15. I'm beastin.

  19. #59
    Is SMF going to have the same stat priorities as TG at 90? Currently live SMF tries to avoid Mastery like the plague

  20. #60
    High Overlord Rustynip's Avatar
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    Yep. They're both equal. I'm actually SMF on beta right now so this is technically written from a SMF point of view lol :P

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