Most Americans say the rich don't pay enough taxes

[Asera]

Says the guy from a country with great run social programs.

Lol, you're delusional if you think Canada's social programs are "great".

Because I'm sure every Canadian is super happy to be paying taxes into things such as Canada Post, whom posted a $10million loss, yet will continue to exist despite slowly becoming more and more worthless while we get to front their blood sucking union workers $22/hr salaries to drive around in a little van and drop paper in a box.

Romney/Ryan wants to increase defense spending while completely draining every other system in Washington.

Wow, I feel bad for you guys. You need more people to realize there's more to the political landscape than left and right wing. :P

[Dendrek]

People for whatever reason nowadays feel entitled to other peoples earnings and success.

Take the successful people's money to pay for their horrible government run social programs. It's very sad.

What about the fact that taxes don't just pay for government run social programs? It's easy to blame social programs and greedy poor people, but you're delusional if you think those are the main sources of our nation's debt.

I could be just as obtuse and say "Take the poor people's money to pay for their horrible infrastructure projects and defense spending. It's very sad."

Try not being a sheep.

[dd614]

I'm not a jealous, lazy communist so I voted no.

[Daelak]

Lol, you're delusional if you think Canada's social programs are "great".

Because I'm sure every Canadian is super happy to be paying taxes into things such as Canada Post, whom posted a $10million loss, yet will continue to exist despite slowly becoming more and more worthless while we get to front their blood sucking union workers $22/hr salaries to drive around in a little van and drop paper in a box.



Wow, I feel bad for you guys. You need more people to realize there's more to the political landscape than left and right wing. :P

But as long as you get to bitch about it with no solutions you will still use the programs. Oh the irony.

---------- Post added 2012-08-28 at 05:54 PM ----------

I'm not a jealous, lazy communist so I voted no.

Nice and simple, it's the conservative way.

[mistuhbull]

Wow, I feel bad for you guys. You need more people to realize there's more to the political landscape than left and right wing. :P

Fun fact: the US system is basically built by our constitution in such a way that only "left" and right can exist

[Drekker17]

Do I think the deductions are too big making them pay less then a lot of people, yes...so in that sense I think they should pay more taxes. However, I think it tax rate shouldn't be over 50%...so it could be either for me. Romney shouldn't be paying 14% in taxes unless that is above everyone making less than him, which it isn't so it should be higher.

[Asera]

But as long as you get to bitch about it with no solutions you will still use the programs. Oh the irony.

I don't use Canada Post.

[Drainedsoul]

pay taxes by choice

Attaching taxes to things that aren't taxes and saying that it's "by choice" is perhaps the most intellectually dishonest thing I've ever seen anyone do.

Would you say that a murderer is justified in his killings if he hands a sign up above his alley-of-choice that says "come down this alley and I'll brutally murder you"?

Why is everyone willing to give the government a free pass for behaviour that would land anyone else in jail? Why is 51% of people forcing their viewpoint on me any different than just 1 person doing it?

[Daelak]

Do I think the deductions are too big making them pay less then a lot of people, yes...so in that sense I think they should pay more taxes. However, I think it tax rate shouldn't be over 50%...so it could be either for me. Romney shouldn't be paying 14% in taxes unless that is above everyone making less than him, which it isn't so it should be higher.

Ehh Romney made 23 million in wages the last time he worked, we should have a marginal tax rate of 75% for wages over 15 million.

[Raintola]

Lol, you're delusional if you think Canada's social programs are "great".

Because I'm sure every Canadian is super happy to be paying taxes into things such as Canada Post, whom posted a $10million loss, yet will continue to exist despite slowly becoming more and more worthless while we get to front their blood sucking union workers $22/hr salaries to drive around in a little van and drop paper in a box.



Wow, I feel bad for you guys. You need more people to realize there's more to the political landscape than left and right wing. :P

Got an example of something that's neither left wing nor right wing?

[Daelak]

Got an example of something that's neither left wing nor right wing?

Space exploration coupled with space based solar power.

[Raintola]

Do I think the deductions are too big making them pay less then a lot of people, yes...so in that sense I think they should pay more taxes. However, I think it tax rate shouldn't be over 50%...so it could be either for me. Romney shouldn't be paying 14% in taxes unless that is above everyone making less than him, which it isn't so it should be higher.

He had to give a certain percentage of his income to charities to have that 14% rate, plus he pays 35% gross on any dividends he makes from stock in addition to the income tax. He also pays 10% of his gross to his church. He's giving away a lot more of his money percentage-wise than most Americans. Even then, half of the country doesn't pay taxes anyway, so they have shit to bitch about.

[Asera]

Got an example of something that's neither left wing nor right wing?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism

[Raintola]

Space exploration coupled with space based solar power.

As part of the political landscape? Wat.

[Daelak]

He had to give a certain percentage of his income to charities to have that 14% rate, plus he pays 35% gross on any dividends he makes from stock in addition to the income tax. He also pays 10% of his gross to his church. He's giving away a lot more of his money percentage-wise than most Americans. Even then, half of the country doesn't pay taxes anyway, so they have shit to bitch about.

He has a net worth over 250 million dollars. Even if you just increase his tax on his wage income, he still would be more wealthier than 99.9% of the US.

[Raintola]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism

It's a mixture of both.

[Daelak]

As part of the political landscape? Wat.

It's not political and it is an issue both sides can agree on, unless you are an ignorant conservative.

[Raintola]

It's not political and it is an issue both sides can agree on, unless you are an ignorant conservative.

Exactly, it's not political. The discussion was about concepts that are still political, yet neither left nor right.

[Drainedsoul]

But as long as you get to bitch about it with no solutions you will still use the programs. Oh the irony.

I don't see how using social programs invalidates one's point-of-view in any way.

Sure, you could say that out of pride people ought not to take hand outs, and I might agree with you, but to say that not taking hand outs is necessary for the integrity of their view point is ridiculous.

If someone came into your store, robbed you blind, and later returned a small portion of the money they stole in already purchased goods which you didn't get to select, would you argue that the person who'd been robbed was morally bankrupting themselves or compromising their ideals by consuming these goods while still hunting for the thief?

This is what government does. It robs you blind (I think the only thing Canadians pay more of than taxes is rent) and then uses your money to buy you things you'd probably have purchased differently had you purchased of your own volition, and then its supporters/apologists use the fact that you're consuming goods bought with your stolen money as proof positive that you need the state and that speaking out against it is hypocrisy.

Additionally, the state supporters/state apologists justify ever-expanding government with the assumption of the legitimacy of the first theft.

At one point, there was no government, and then the government came along and stole from people to provision some goods or services. The statists latched onto this and cried that because no one else was providing this good which the government was forcing people to pay for whether they wanted it or not, that only government could provide it, and that therefore the state was owed for this provision, and could ask more to do more.

Imagine you're robbed blind as per above. And the thief buys you some food. You eat the food and because you were robbed you only have enough money to buy drinks (not more food).

The statist comes up to you and says -- despite the fact you could've fed your family many times over with the robbed money -- "see, without government you would starve, the government ought to be able to take more from you to provision you with drink", a cycle which continues forever with the statist using the supposed "success" of the former government programs, and their supposed necessity to justify further theft and further supposedly irreplaceable programs.

[cherb]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism

Can say this all day, but the sad fact is that a Libertarian, or independent, or anything that isn't a Democrat or Republican will never be voted into presidential office in the US.