Page 3 of 59 FirstFirst
1
2
3
4
5
13
53
... LastLast
  1. #41
    Hello,
    I think I misunderstood the last stand of 5.0.4 from what you say.

    tooltip > increases the current AND maximum health by 30%

    meaning if you have 1,000 health remaining and your maximum health is 100,000
    you will be at 1,300 health remaining and 130,000 maximum health.

  2. #42
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Belgium, EU
    Posts
    616
    Here is a quick summary of my last night HC DS, for those who were asking :

    DPS :

    DPS was OK. Thanks to Vengeance, I had throughout the night about 50% more DPS than I had just a week before. Zero threat issues, thus.
    This is mainly thanks to an accurate DPS rotation : S&B > SS > Rev > Dev, + HS when ultimatum. I mostly used TC to refresh its debuff, and almost never used Shockwave, but instead Devastate as a filler to try to proc SnB. So basically, the typically rotation described in the guide. I was also Hit and Exp soft capped (I had 7% of both actually, so I was even missing a small percent).

    On trashes, I used TC and Shockwave on cooldown, and Cleaved when Ultimatum proc'd mostly. At Some times, I even had enough Rage to spam it (Cleave) a bit. I was regularly first on the damage meter on those trashes with some 40-45K DPS on average. So really, no DPS/threat issues at all with these changes.

    Another thing I should point out is pets in general (hunters', warlocks', etc) were taunting mobs from me regularly, and I simply kept taunting back every time until they died from taking too much damage. It was sure annoying, but there's nothing you can do about it. It's simple some bad designing that needs to be fixed. So absolutely don't count that as aggro lost.


    Survivability :

    My survivability was pretty decent too. It was hard to have a clear view sometimes, since 35% nerf is... really a lot. Anyways, I could keep Shield Block up almost on cooldown, and never had any damage spikes whatsoever when it was up. During its occasional downtimes however, my life could sometimes drop a little lower (below 30% even), and so I always had a quick cooldown ready for when I felt like I just dropped a bit too low to be still safe.
    Demo Shout was kept solely for those occasions when I knew I'll be missing my Shield Block for too long - it then gave me enough time to build back up a full Rage bar and be OK again. I used Rallying Cry, or ER, if DS wasn't up, but never really needed that much my major CDs (Shield Wall and Last Stand) - the Shield Block uptime was usually high enough to keep me safe.

    I wouldn't have hesitate a sec to use those major CD too however, if it was needed, as that's what they are there for, don't forget. Better used them and die because you have none left, than die because you didn't use any.

    Then surprisingly, Yor'shaj was even one of the easiest bosses. With 35% nerf, and Shield Barrier and CDs like Demo Shout and Rallying Cry, in addition of a 1 minute Enraged Regen, it really was an easy fight.

    It was also very nice to be able to tank Hagara without any single external CD. All it was needed was to build up some rage before her Assault and then use 2 consecutive Barriers during it, with anyone of my CDs, and it was all good.

    All in all, the most important thing thus is to spend Rage ONLY on Shield Blocks and Barriers accordingly, and never ever, on things like Heroic Strike or Cleaves, if you are already struggling to stay alive.
    Get your soft cap for Expertise, and cap for Hit, it's not hard to do anymore, then review the optimal RPS rotation, and actually apply it - not more or less but truly apply it - as doing that will really help you get more Rage and have more uses of Shield Block - which really makes the difference.

    Without enough Shield Blocks, you'll eventually take too much damage and die, as we don't have the CTC thing to allow us to automatically block every single attack anymore, it has to be actively done by us.

    If you do all of this and use your cooldowns whenever you feel you're no longer safe, then you really should survive. Good luck !


    My stats :

    233K health buffed (201K unbuff) (I had 1 Stamina trinket, Mastery based gems, and Dodge/Parry reforged to Mastery/Hit/Exp)

    7.17% Hit / 7.01% Exp

    67% Mastery

    The rest is found here.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Quote Originally Posted by idefiler6 View Post
    You can ignore dodge or reforge it to something useful, in a nutshell. The DR discrepancy is so large that it's not even worth it at this point. Parry is the only avoidance you should bother with, miss you can do nothing about besides class change and dodge is a waste of stats.
    This is not entirely true, as there's a limit that lies somewhere between 2/3 times more Parry percentage than Dodge.
    Passed that limit, having more Parry actually makes you lose avoidance.

    ---------- Post added 2012-08-31 at 03:05 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamez View Post
    Hello,
    I think I misunderstood the last stand of 5.0.4 from what you say.

    tooltip > increases the current AND maximum health by 30%

    meaning if you have 1,000 health remaining and your maximum health is 100,000
    you will be at 1,300 health remaining and 130,000 maximum health.
    Hi,

    No, no, ; ) I mean it increases your current health by 30% of your ''maximum'' health pool, like it says on the tooltip - not by 30% of your current health.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by L Kebess View Post
    Hi,

    No, no, ; ) I mean it increases your current health by 30% of your ''maximum'' health pool, like it says on the tooltip - not by 30% of your current health.
    the tooltip change really made it confusing :F

    Also, is it finally mandatory to be expertise / hit capped or it can be ignorable (since taunt and interrupt ALWAYS land) ?

    obviously gemming / enchanting for hit rating and expertise is a NO ... or that changed also :@
    Last edited by Gamez; 2012-08-31 at 03:15 AM.

  4. #44
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Belgium, EU
    Posts
    616
    Quote Originally Posted by Gamez View Post
    the tooltip change really made it confusing :F

    Also, is it finally mandatory to be expertise / hit capped or it can be ignorable (since taunt and interrupt ALWAYS land) ?

    obviously gemming / enchanting for hit rating and expertise is a NO ... or that changed also :@
    Yea, mate, ; ) They messed up everything pretty nicely. Hit and Exp are now defensive stats - can you believe that ?

    I had even almost forgot about those epic times where taunts could miss, ; ) and kicks could be blocked and all. Reminds me of some not so enjoyable memories, actually...

    ---------- Post added 2012-08-31 at 03:27 AM ----------

    So you can (and even have to) gem, at least in part, Hit/Exp in many cases.

  5. #45
    The Lightbringer The Caretaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Edinburgh, Scotland
    Posts
    3,033
    Quote Originally Posted by Gamez View Post
    the tooltip change really made it confusing :F

    Also, is it finally mandatory to be expertise / hit capped or it can be ignorable (since taunt and interrupt ALWAYS land) ?

    obviously gemming / enchanting for hit rating and expertise is a NO ... or that changed also :@
    While not strictly correct, it's simpler to just go for 7.5% on both and then start prioritising mastery and getting rid of all dodge. Simple, is good.

    Few points for you, Keb:

    1) Keep emphasizing the Heroic Strike issue. For me it's just muscle memory, and I have it bound to a mousewheel. >.< As a result, I still occasionally end up using it when I shouldn't. When I absolutely concentrate, rage issues disappear and I suspect many are doing the same thing.

    2) The pet taunting was a bug, related to Growl/Threaten - it should be squashed now, but they do know about it.

    3) Our damage is pointlessly high, so I hope that's ironed out for level 90. We did Occuthar last night for a laugh (which I solo-tanked thanks to barrier, Demoralizing Shout and major cooldowns) and I was top DPS. I wasn't raiding with slackers in the main, either.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fencers View Post
    Well, it is possible for people, many people actually, to not think very highly of World of Warcraft. Those self same people may even consider other games in the genre superior due to their own subjective qualifiers. Qualifiers which are just as valid as the subjective qualifiers of those whom believe World of Warcraft is a "23 out of 10".

  6. #46
    Pandaren Monk dragothica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    1,983
    Now here's a in-depth guide for a future Protection Warrior! Bookmarked.
    Last edited by dragothica; 2012-08-31 at 08:07 AM.

  7. #47
    Are you sure on yout stat priority for lvl 85 and regarding value of strenght?

    I've tried myself reforging and regeming for strenght/parry/dodge, ended up losing aroung 4% block, aroung 15% crit block if i recall correctly and managed to gain a lot of parry. Ended up sitting at 15ish dodge, 32ish parry and 22ish block.

    Atm i don't have all that clear that we should go for mastery, and as i said i was under the impression that last patch buffed strenght up to a point where strenght itself gives more parry than parry if you know what i mean.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by voidillusion View Post
    Are you sure on yout stat priority for lvl 85 and regarding value of strenght?

    I've tried myself reforging and regeming for strenght/parry/dodge, ended up losing aroung 4% block, aroung 15% crit block if i recall correctly and managed to gain a lot of parry. Ended up sitting at 15ish dodge, 32ish parry and 22ish block.

    Atm i don't have all that clear that we should go for mastery, and as i said i was under the impression that last patch buffed strenght up to a point where strenght itself gives more parry than parry if you know what i mean.
    You want mastery to get enraged, so you can keep your damage consistent via shield block and barrier. More parry potentially means less blocking. Less blocking is less enrage uptime, resulting in less rage, resulting in a squished warrior.

  9. #49
    I just wanted to say "Thank you" for this guide. It has helped me transition into 5.0.4 tanking much easier. Great great guide.

  10. #50
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Belgium, EU
    Posts
    616
    Quote Originally Posted by Thylacine View Post
    Few points for you, Keb:

    1) Keep emphasizing the Heroic Strike issue. For me it's just muscle memory, and I have it bound to a mousewheel. >.< As a result, I still occasionally end up using it when I shouldn't. When I absolutely concentrate, rage issues disappear and I suspect many are doing the same thing.

    2) The pet taunting was a bug, related to Growl/Threaten - it should be squashed now, but they do know about it.

    3) Our damage is pointlessly high, so I hope that's ironed out for level 90. We did Occuthar last night for a laugh (which I solo-tanked thanks to barrier, Demoralizing Shout and major cooldowns) and I was top DPS. I wasn't raiding with slackers in the main, either.
    1- Agreed. We have been smashing this HS key for so long that, it really needs some self control to not hit it as often, ; ) But not pressing it as much, does make a difference, and a pretty significant one too.
    A simple recommendation for those who are still struggling with this bit, is to simply change your HS/Cleave's keybind - you'll naturally feel less tempted to press it.

    2- Yes, I figured there's simply no way they'll leave it like that. I even had a Warlock's pet taunt the Amalgamation add on Spine, right before it popped, ; ) almost cost us a wipe...

    3- Our damage is ridiculously high indeed. On Madness, I reached some 200K AP thanks to Vengeance... At level 90 on beta, it doesn't feel this high though, so I suspect it's fairly balanced for Pandaria, and not so much for the 3 remaining weeks till then.


    Quote Originally Posted by voidillusion View Post
    Are you sure on yout stat priority for lvl 85 and regarding value of strenght?

    I've tried myself reforging and regeming for strenght/parry/dodge, ended up losing aroung 4% block, aroung 15% crit block if i recall correctly and managed to gain a lot of parry. Ended up sitting at 15ish dodge, 32ish parry and 22ish block.

    Atm i don't have all that clear that we should go for mastery, and as i said i was under the impression that last patch buffed strenght up to a point where strenght itself gives more parry than parry if you know what i mean.
    Yes, pretty sure, and other guys who've been looking closer to this, are too. Strength is surely NOT the way to go.

  11. #51
    thanks for the guide

    curious though which meta should be used at 85 still. keep the 1% block value gem or switch back to the 2% armor?
    or does it depend on how/what you're gearing for like on the front page still?

  12. #52
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Belgium, EU
    Posts
    616
    Quote Originally Posted by yjmark View Post
    I just wanted to say "Thank you" for this guide. It has helped me transition into 5.0.4 tanking much easier. Great great guide.
    I'm really glad it helped you, ; ) Don't hesitate to ask, if you have any question later on, especially right now at lvl-85.

    ---------- Post added 2012-08-31 at 04:42 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by bals View Post
    thanks for the guide

    curious though which meta should be used at 85 still. keep the 1% block value gem or switch back to the 2% armor?
    or does it depend on how/what you're gearing for like on the front page still?
    I'm personally using the Austere Shadowspirit Diamond (+2% armor), since I'm not guaranteed to block everything anymore.

    ---------- Post added 2012-08-31 at 04:46 PM ----------

    So that I can still have some damage reduction, even and especially on a direct hit.

  13. #53
    Here is a good way to manage a pack of mobs :


    •1. Shout and Berserker Rage, then Heroic Leap and/or Charge in.
    •2. Thunder Clap to directly establish some aggro. Position them in front of you, then Shockwave.
    •3. While they are stunned, Shield Slam and Revenge, then if you haven’t Charge yet, take a couple of steps back and Charge in.
    •4. Shield Block/Barrier as soon as they stop slacking around, then Thunder Clap again.
    How exactly do you time the Heroic Leap + Charge? Just Charge mid air?
    Last edited by yjmark; 2012-08-31 at 05:49 PM.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by yjmark View Post
    Just Charge mid air.
    Yes. Leap has more range so you have a window before you are too close to Charge.

  15. #55
    At least for me, the patch has broken that trick. If you charge after the HL, there is no landing damage. You have to charge and then leap, so you get the rage the instant you cast charge, and still keep the landing damage. Just do a macro with /cast Charge /cast Heroic Leap, place the mouse where you will want to land, and double tap the macro. Works for me.

    Great guide by the way. [Edited comment, I saw you had it added ]
    Last edited by Espada; 2012-08-31 at 07:24 PM.

  16. #56
    Is it possible to use Heroic Strike and cleave the same way this shout macro works?
    #showtooltip
    /cast [modifier:alt] Battle Shout; Commanding Shout

    EDIT: Nevermind when I tried the macro I wrote in game I accidently put in : instead of ;
    Last edited by Viin; 2012-08-31 at 08:01 PM.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Viin View Post
    Is it possible to use Heroic Strike and cleave the same way this shout macro works?
    #showtooltip
    /cast [modifier:alt] Battle Shout; Commanding Shout

    EDIT: Nevermind when I tried the macro I wrote in game I accidently put in : instead of ;
    http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/shoutswitcher I've been using this for a while. Uses Commanding unless you have fort, in which case it uses Battle. No modifier needed!

  18. #58
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Belgium, EU
    Posts
    616
    Quote Originally Posted by Espada View Post
    At least for me, the patch has broken that trick. If you charge after the HL, there is no landing damage. You have to charge and then leap, so you get the rage the instant you cast charge, and still keep the landing damage. Just do a macro with /cast Charge /cast Heroic Leap, place the mouse where you will want to land, and double tap the macro. Works for me.

    Great guide by the way.
    Yes, that's the way to do it, as charging after you leap cancels the leap, and you get no damage from it.

    Furthermore, If in the macro you write the /cast Charge, before the /cast Heroic Leap, you won't need to click the keybind two times before placing the leap. Here's the macro :

    Code:
    #showtooltp Charge
    /cast Charge
    /cast Heroic Leap
    You simply need to press it 1 time. It will instantly activate the Heroic Leap target marker AND Charge at the same time. So all you'll have to do then is place the leap before you get into melee range.

  19. #59
    very nice job kebess......been watching your vids also....impressive and very helpful

    lets get this guide back up top .....or sticky it

  20. #60
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Belgium, EU
    Posts
    616
    Thanks a lot for your support, Danyka ; ) Really glad you enjoyed this.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •