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  1. #341
    Moderator eddytheone's Avatar
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    Windsong, easily. That mastery is really powerful, the colossus enchant is mediocre at best imho

  2. #342
    The Lightbringer Amulree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eddytheone View Post
    Windsong, easily. That mastery is really powerful, the colossus enchant is mediocre at best imho
    Not necessarily true - I'd recommend going over Theck's most recent work because what Colossus gives more than any other enchant is consistency.

    It's hard to count, but easy to value.

  3. #343
    I am good at fury, or at least I like to think so, and post on Warrior DPS regularly, but I am out of the loop on tanking. Quite a few of my pieces are PvP or 476/489 DPS gear because they are better than tank blues (I think, all that extra str for parry, stam, armor and of course sockets and some of them have important stats like exp/hit/mastery on them). If anyone doesn't mind can you look at my prot spec armory? I am following Scheme 1 while trying to maximize Mastery. I am not going to reforge or change the enchant on my weapon because I use it for SMF. I am not looking to tank hardmodes any time soon, and I can run 5 mans in DPS gear no sweat, but I'd like to see if I am doing it wrong and what you think I could tank in a 10 man Normal raid setting, ignoring any skill issues - just look at the gear etc. I may need to go prot for 25 mans in future depending on what my guild does and what they do to "incentivize" 25 mans, but my MS would still be DPS. I have Bloodbath because I was doing ZA solo and I want to get used to no extra rage generation from Avatar in 5.1.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...slash/advanced
    The only bad items left are shoulders, belt and the 1 ring, and 6 pieces of DPS/483 PvP gear (just 1 piece of PvP). I don't want to mooch items if I don't have to for my offspec - I already experimented with the legs for Fury, found they were utter garbage and not worth the HP gain and just turned them in to prot pants. My current guild is pretty cool about offspecs though, not like my previous one where they wanted to shard the shield (...). I know I could pick up the Conq helmet and I might do that if I can stand any more arena. I am sitting on all factions Revered and 1350 Valor but I want to bank VP for 5.1 DPS gear upgrading and only spend valor if I need to to avoid going over 3000. I could pick up the ring or shoulders then get the belt, but it depends on what DPS piece I "get rid of" next.

    Edit: I swapped armory back to fury, use this wowreforge: http://www.wowreforge.com/US/Sargeras/Wrathslash
    Last edited by Freedom; 2012-11-19 at 09:10 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemah View Post
    “When people talk about the good old days, I say to people, 'It's not the days that are old, it's you that's old.' I hate the good old days. What is important is that today is good.”
    ― Karl Lagerfeld
    FIRE GIVES ME BIGGER BLOOD SHIELDS

  4. #344
    Moderator eddytheone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thylacine View Post
    Not necessarily true - I'd recommend going over Theck's most recent work because what Colossus gives more than any other enchant is consistency.

    It's hard to count, but easy to value.
    Consistency yes, for 5 man heroics, I might possibly consider Colossus. In anything that hits even moderately hard its a really weak enchant and you will get much more off the mastery proc

    I would highly advise not taking it anyway unless as I've said, you live solely in heroics :P

  5. #345
    Herald of the Titans xebtria's Avatar
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    I'm actually running the dodge enchant (River's song?). has anyone valued this one, if it is really that worse than colossus or even windsong with this 33% proc chance to give 1500 mastery (which is basically 500 mastery over time per proc)? I don't think that these average 500 mastery can outweight 1650 dodgerating...
    Or do I miss something?

  6. #346
    Mastery is an outrageously better stat than dodge. That aside, River's can stack x2, so sometimes you get 3k rating. Personally I just switched from River's song to Windsong just to try it out, and the jury's still out. I think I still prefer windsong.

  7. #347
    So... what uptime of both mastery and crit are you getting from Windsong (let's disregard that dirty haste...)? Just curious of how it fares now that is RPPM instead of PPM. Because, with lazy math, being both 4 ppm, river's song 7 seconds, 1650, and windsong 12 sec 1500 with a 1/3 chance of being mastery, that's a... (12*1.5/3*1.65)/7, 3.63/7, 0.52 mastery vs 1 dodge, a bit less with the 2 stacks of windsong. Put that you get 0.5 mastery vs 1 dodge. When you throw the crit in, you may consider windsong over river's song, if you value both dps and damage reduction. In pure reduction I don't think I value avoidance only as half of mastery.
    Last edited by Espada; 2012-11-20 at 07:01 PM.

  8. #348
    The mastery itself even discounting the crit, is better in reducing spike damage than any random avoidance proc.

  9. #349
    I would agree, but having a 20% uptime or so of 5% crit block (if sb is up), makes it as unreliable as a random dodge here and there...

  10. #350
    Herald of the Titans xebtria's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Espada View Post
    I would agree, but having a 20% uptime or so of 5% crit block (if sb is up), makes it as unreliable as a random dodge here and there...
    and that exactly is the current problem with mastery. it is so low for the time being, that the crit block is as unreliable as dodge is for now...

  11. #351
    Does anyone know where I can find a decent BiS list for prot warriors?

    Sorry if this has already been asked.

  12. #352
    I don't believe any BIS lists exist yet. It's going to be a long list based on the varying schools of thought on what to stack.

  13. #353
    Herald of the Titans Dannyl's Avatar
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    Unless gear and playstyle will ever again fall into one particular avenue, I don't see there ever really being a single BiS item list. Heck, even in Wrath, where gearing was pretty single-minded, you could find 2-3 different types of item lists.

    Armory | What we do in life, it echoes in eternity.
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  14. #354
    The Lightbringer Amulree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eddytheone View Post
    Consistency yes, for 5 man heroics, I might possibly consider Colossus. In anything that hits even moderately hard its a really weak enchant and you will get much more off the mastery proc

    I would highly advise not taking it anyway unless as I've said, you live solely in heroics :P
    This is what I recommend you read; I'm not saying you're wrong, at all (especially given the different mechanics and stat weights warriors have compared to pallies), but it's pretty clear that there are a lot of players heavily overestimating how good Windsong actually is.

  15. #355
    I feel like mastery should buff shield barrier as well ;l
    /thinking having low stam (no stam trinkets) and getting an item with a yellow socket

  16. #356
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bals View Post
    I feel like mastery should buff shield barrier as well ;l
    /thinking having low stam (no stam trinkets) and getting an item with a yellow socket
    This might seem a good idea at first, but the end result would inevitably make SBarrier too overpowered when compared to SBlock, making us totally neglect that spell, which isn't good.

    In order to re-balance those two abilities, dev's would then have to nerf the AP scaling of SBarrier, making things get even more complicated than they already are.

    I agree that Mastery should have some sort of up/boost, in order to make it more interesting and appealing even with low amounts of it (40/50%).
    However, making SBarrier scale with it, isn't necessary the wise approach, IMO.

  17. #357
    Quote Originally Posted by Slidd View Post
    Does anyone know where I can find a decent BiS list for prot warriors?

    Sorry if this has already been asked.
    To answer this first, I've been looking for a list myself and I'm pretty sure there's really not a linear BIS list like there was in most of cata. Just b/c of the sheer amount of off tier pieces, nevermind reforging and stat priority preference.

    This is the best list i can find though
    http://www.wowbestinslot.com/warrior/protection/index

    Back on topic though, not to say I'm unhappy with where warriors are and more specifically barrier and block but what if they instead made it a flat 1 block per 10 rage for shield block instead of capping it at 60 rage and I guess how also barrier works too, if they took the rage cap off of barrier and allowed both to continue to scale via rage usage.

    Would that break the math so to speak?

    Again, if I'm missing something and this is silly, please excuse me but I could think of times where saving a 100(120) rage barrier would be nice, i mean correct me if i'm wrong but dont dks do that now, sort of, kind of, with their Bone shields b/c of the almost impossible to reach mastery cap?

    Also, what do you guys think about dancing steel as prot?

    But really I'm happy with where warriors are this tier and i'm excited where we'll be in t15 or later on this tier.
    Last edited by Armwack; 2012-11-23 at 04:29 PM.

  18. #358
    Herald of the Titans Dannyl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Armwack View Post
    Back on topic though, not to say I'm unhappy with where warriors are and more specifically barrier and block but what if they instead made it a flat 1 block per 10 rage for shield block instead of capping it at 60 rage and I guess how also barrier works too, if they took the rage cap off of barrier and allowed both to continue to scale via rage usage.

    Would that break the math so to speak?

    Again, if I'm missing something and this is silly, please excuse me but I could think of times where saving a 100(120) rage barrier would be nice, i mean correct me if i'm wrong but dont dks do that now, sort of, kind of, with their Bone shields b/c of the almost impossible to reach mastery cap?
    Think it would be a horrible idea because then it would be even more difficult to save rage for anything else except shield block and -barrier. It is already really tough unless you get really lucky with parries and s&b procs. I think it would also, kind of make shield block a lot worse because now we can guarantee that we block the hits during the SB. Fast hitting bosses would consume shield block at rapid rates, making it impossible to maintain a good uptime.

    With shield barrier it works to have a set amount of mitigation, before it is consumed because magic damage usually comes in spikes, and it also has a much lower rage, which means it is easier to get back up if you need to maintain it through several incoming attacks. Shield block however cannot work that way.

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  19. #359
    Mechagnome L Kebess's Avatar
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    Updates brought to the Stat priority section (for more clarity).


    TL;TR - Recommended ''Baseline'' Priority (for Tier 14)


    T14 HIT > EXPERTISE > STAMINA > Mastery > Parry > Dodge
    Long story short, simply balance your stats out - get some Hit and some Expertise** (7.5% each, should be a very decent goal, then 15% Expertise if you can, without having to sacrifice higher ilvl gear for lacking Expertise), then convert the rest of your secondary stats into Mastery (preferably by reforging dodge, or even parry, if the first isn't available).

    Finally, find yourself a couple of Stamina trinkets, for whenever stacking a bit more health is useful (e.g.: on magical encounters, or if your ilvl is a bit lower than recommended for a particular content), and you shouldn't do too bad.


    **Notice that Hit&Expertise caps aren't strictly ''needed'', but are very helpful to maintain a predictable and controllable Rage generation. You will have to decide for yourself which one you prefer most between a bit more avoidance (~5% more), and a noticeable control over your Rage income (the latter is recommended).

    Furthermore, Mastery right now on T14, isn't as reliable as it will eventually get later on, as we get better gear. This is because we simply can't have enough of it, presently, to make ''enough'' of our blocks critical (+70/80%), and hence assure a somewhat guaranteed survivability, as it used to be the case back in Cataclysm.
    Because of this, right now with the Tier 14 gear, it isn't really that much more valuable than our other RNG based stats (e.g. Parry/Dodge).
    Last edited by L Kebess; 2012-11-26 at 05:11 PM.

  20. #360
    Very helpful, made a few changes to my current spec. Thanks

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