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  1. #1081
    Well to give some details it's http://www.wowdb.com/items/96368 vs. http://www.wowdb.com/items/94961 for http://www.wowdb.com/items/103842

    Edit: But yeah the fact that ilvl shouldn't play a major role is good to know :P
    Last edited by Juvencus; 2013-11-05 at 11:28 AM.

  2. #1082

  3. #1083
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    What should aim for next? Armor/mastery or haste? I do have 77.x% of crit selfbuffed, 80% with crit elixir. Switch crit elix to mastery one? Or for progression go still w/ stamina flask? (we are starting HC's).

    Second question would be about my trinkets. I have HC Rentaki and normal Bloodlust. Is it still worth keeping the Bloodlust as one of my active trinkets if I get something else or not? I don't have time to farm HC ToT for the Bloodlust trinket . Have ha absolutely no luck w/ any trinkets...
    What would a good trinket to get beside Vial (other then HC Bloodlust)?
    Mari officer/RL/OT of Punished <- RECRUITING for WoD
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    The curse of the Bear, the only tank whose active mitigation not only has RNG included, but only consists of RNG.


  4. #1084
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post
    What should aim for next? Armor/mastery or haste? I do have 77.x% of crit selfbuffed, 80% with crit elixir. Switch crit elix to mastery one? Or for progression go still w/ stamina flask? (we are starting HC's).

    Second question would be about my trinkets. I have HC Rentaki and normal Bloodlust. Is it still worth keeping the Bloodlust as one of my active trinkets if I get something else or not? I don't have time to farm HC ToT for the Bloodlust trinket . Have ha absolutely no luck w/ any trinkets...
    What would a good trinket to get beside Vial (other then HC Bloodlust)?
    1.
    Haste, you never have enought rage . Stamina flask (i am lazy for elixir's)


    2.
    Actualy using Vial + hubris for 25man HC progress(currently garrosh)and still have 76% crit. Hubris have same CD as NV so i use it together with berserk for realy good burst dmg. Or little healing help in Realm's of Y'Shaarj.
    Last edited by Jurman; 2013-11-06 at 08:06 AM.

  5. #1085
    Depends on what you're doing, as for my heroic progression I changed it around depending upon the encounter. To meet this end, I have my gear set up so that I can use H Renetaki and my DPS cloak at the same time w/o affecting my Hit/Exp levels, and when using my tanking cloak I can use whatever combination of trinkets I desire without going below Hit/Exp caps.

    With respect to the trinkets, I found I use for all the stamina ones where I could justify using them over a DPS/RPS trinket. Vial has pretty much become my default trinket for any gear setup I do, since my RPS is ridiculously high as it is. From a survival standpoint, my next trinket in line is Rook's, since I can either trivialize mechanics that are AoE-oriented or allow myself to get hit by a mechanic I'd normally avoid for the sake of the raid strat. I've never used Hubris as a survival tool directly, I've done it in situations where guaranteed crits in a small window of time are desirable (such as killing Shredders on H Seigecrafter at low stacks).

    From my standpoint, I haven't been in a position where I've wanted more rage due to my RPS levels, which was my major motivation for phasing out RPS trinkets to give me more flexibility. From a stats perspective, the gear I've acquired pushes my secondary stats towards more haste while my crit using NV is about 80% static... I honestly don't care if my crit goes higher since it's a DPS gain. I think I prefer the haste route since it's a DPS and survival gain on some level, while mastery is only a survival gain. I'm coming from a 25man perspective, it might feel a little different on 10man.
    *Since I'm tired of reposting the link:* EH vs TTL and Hybrid Tax

  6. #1086
    I've recently added Guardian Stat Weight Reforging to Catus.

    Download: http://fluiddruid.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4574
    Screenshot: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...0-BearHax3.png

    Instructions:
    1. import your druid
    2. setup your talents (it will grab your Feral talents if you have a Feral spec)
    3. setup your buffs and consumables (flask/food)
    4. show "Cat Stats", and toggle "Bear Form"
    5. show "Reforger", and click "Maximize Stats"
    6. setup your constraints (see screenshot)
    7. use [x] change gems, [x] break bonuses, [x] hands, [x] back
    8. click "Reforge"
    9. check "Cat Stats" (which are bear stats in bear form) for current crit%

    1. show "Gear Compare", click "Armory" to diff your gear relative to your armory
    2. click "Reforgerade" to export the reforging
    3. click "Shopping List" to export the gear changes

    Like my other Catus reforgers, this process is exhaustive and will find the best combination of stats relative to your stat weights that satsify your constraints. The solution menu will contain other lesser solutions, ranked by their total stat-weighted sum.

    For every druid I've tested, Catus is able to find a better reforge.

    Arielle:
    1. +4 Crit, -55 Expertise, +55 Haste, -4 Hit
    Buraan:
    1. (78.97% crit) -186 Crit, -16 Expertise, +598 Haste, -336 Mastery
    2. (79.02% crit) +60 Agi, -186 Crit, -16 Expertise, +598 Haste, -396 Mastery

    Note: sometimes, you'll want to put the Crit Cap slighty above 79%, like 79.05%.

    If you try this, please let me know at the FluidDruid if you have any problems.

    Edit:
    You can enter Hit/Exp as percentage: "7.5%", "15%", or w/e.
    You can click the Hit/Exp value on the stat line above the reforger to toggle it between rating and effective-%.
    Lastly, the rest of Catus operates under the assumption that you're Feral.
    Last edited by raffy; 2013-11-06 at 09:31 AM.

  7. #1087

  8. #1088
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    I do have in my bags the following things (beside the 2 trinkets equipt (Rentaki HC and normal Bloodlust):õ
    (I have not upgraded any as well, have considered doing so waste of VP if I don't use them)
    553 Rook
    553 Jugger
    540 Assuarance

    Is it worth to replace my Rentaki or BL with something I have? Which trinket should I replace if I would get the Vial - Lust or Rentaki? Or if I decide to to equip something I have, which one then?

    And thank you very much of making Catus work for bears ^^
    Mari officer/RL/OT of Punished <- RECRUITING for WoD
    Proud RL of Mythic 8/14 HC Open Raid PUG

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    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    The curse of the Bear, the only tank whose active mitigation not only has RNG included, but only consists of RNG.


  9. #1089
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post
    I do have in my bags the following things (beside the 2 trinkets equipt (Rentaki HC and normal Bloodlust):õ
    (I have not upgraded any as well, have considered doing so waste of VP if I don't use them)
    553 Rook
    553 Jugger
    540 Assuarance

    Is it worth to replace my Rentaki or BL with something I have? Which trinket should I replace if I would get the Vial - Lust or Rentaki? Or if I decide to to equip something I have, which one then?

    And thank you very much of making Catus work for bears ^^
    If you're fine on Expertise I'd replace Renataki's first for Rook depending on whether you benefit from the on use during the fight. If you need the Expertise still swap out ToBL for Rook's if you need the on use to survive. Otherwise none of the trinkets you mentioned are worth using as a Guardian as you do not benefit from the CDR from Assurance and Juggernaut's self-healing is weaker than LotP procs.

  10. #1090
    Grunt Windytusks's Avatar
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    Edited because I failed at reading. :P

    - - - Updated - - -

    Armory link: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...light/advanced


    This is what I get now, after following the instructions on the screenshot re: weights

    Code:
    Gear: 0 differences
    
    Reforges (108g 55s 55c): 5 differences
                  Wrist: None                                     => Expertise > Haste
                  Hands: Hit > Expertise                          => Hit > Haste
                  Waist: Expertise > Critical Strike              => Haste > Critical Strike
                   Legs: None                                     => Expertise > Haste
               Finger 2: None                                     => Hit > Haste
    
    Enchants: 1 difference
                  Hands: Enchant Gloves - Greater Haste           => Enchant Gloves - Superior Expertise
    
    Sockets: 4 differences
             Back/Bonus: None                                     => +60 Agility
            Chest/Bonus: None                                     => +180 Agility
         Finger 1/Bonus: None                                     => +60 Crit
         Finger 2/Bonus: None                                     => +60 Crit
    
    Gems: 6 differences
             Back/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
            Chest/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
            Chest/Gem#2: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
            Chest/Gem#3: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
         Finger 1/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
         Finger 2/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Piercing Wild Jade
    
    Stats: 5 differences
                Agility: -240 Agi                                 => +240 Agi
        Critical Strike: +724 Crit                                => -724 Crit
              Expertise: -42 Expertise                            => +42 Expertise
                  Haste: -996 Haste                               => +996 Haste
                    Hit: +194 Hit                                 => -194 Hit
    Last edited by Windytusks; 2013-11-06 at 05:49 PM.


  11. #1091
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    In that case I am just gonna keep both of my low ilvl trinkets -_- ... But if I get the Vial, which one should I replace?
    If I would replace rentaki, I will loose crit as I have to out-reforge something else to expertise. BL on the other hand would be less of an impact to my stats... So bloody hard choices.... As I really don't see myself using the Rook's clicky.
    Mari officer/RL/OT of Punished <- RECRUITING for WoD
    Proud RL of Mythic 8/14 HC Open Raid PUG

    Moderator of R & D | Open Raid
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    The curse of the Bear, the only tank whose active mitigation not only has RNG included, but only consists of RNG.


  12. #1092
    But if I get the Vial, which one should I replace?
    Renataki since you'll be crit soft capping soon anyway.

    Or, Bloodlust until you are soft-capped then Renataki.

  13. #1093
    As I really don't see myself using the Rook's clicky.
    I thought the exact same thing but Rooks is very strong in SoO hc. Sure you dont need it but it makes alot fights alot easier. Sure vial is alot better overall but Rooks has a huge impact on some fights and is very helpfull on almost all other fights. For example malkorok is not very hard on heroic but if you have 2 tanks with that trinket the boss is one of the easiert currently imo.

  14. #1094
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arielle View Post
    Renataki since you'll be crit soft capping soon anyway.

    Or, Bloodlust until you are soft-capped then Renataki.
    Well, I am crit soft capped w/ rentaki atmo (almost), but if I'd loose the 1.7k exp, I will have to reforge more to exp (using pure crit gems in all slots atmo) and loose crit.
    And I don't see getting crit soft capped, as only upgrades for me will be probably from Heroic, which will take time.

    Maybe as I will have zero chances to get HC BL, I might as well run w/ Rook and Vial (if I get 'em)....

    Does Rook work on most boss and add AoE abilities?
    Mari officer/RL/OT of Punished <- RECRUITING for WoD
    Proud RL of Mythic 8/14 HC Open Raid PUG

    Moderator of R & D | Open Raid
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    The curse of the Bear, the only tank whose active mitigation not only has RNG included, but only consists of RNG.


  15. #1095
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    Quote Originally Posted by raffy View Post
    For every druid I've tested, Catus is able to find a better reforge.
    I always thought I reforged and gemmed perfectly (what i mean is not to lose any stat and still hitting ~ the exact caps without losing stats) till i saw this sentence, I thought well let's see, i'm up to the challenge. Note that I never used any addon to reforge and gem, always my head.

    I must say I got a better result than what I personally did, +29 hit (was 7.43% became 7.52%), +11 expertise (became 15.01%), +452 haste, -1 mastery, +300 agility, -150 stamina, But -467 crit even though i specified enforce 79.05% cap, I dunno why it reduced crit by that much I don't believe I was over the cap, I became now 77.85% crit, I must admit I wasn't too happy abt this. Result the real gain was in haste area, whereas i lost like 1% crit, and hit the exact exact caps of hit and expertise.

    Nice program, thumbs up, thanks!

  16. #1096
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post
    Does Rook work on most boss and add AoE abilities?
    For the most part, I believe Rook works on most AoE-oriented abilities. I believe it works on all boss conal AoE abilities now, so it's akin to using a slightly less power SI every 1.5 minutes for 15 second duration for burst mechanics such as that. This is also a plus since I've noticed the legendary tanking cloak seems to never want to proc on most AoE damage or damage that doesn't flag for Vengeance gains (typically AoE in nature).

    During our progression, I used Rook's on Sha of Pride, Iron Juggernaut, General Nazgrim, Malkorok, Thok, Paragons, and Garrosh. While having extra stamina is always a factor in my mind, my choice always includes the on-use portion of the trinket and a way to utilize it. While most of the damage sources would lead one to intuitively use the trinket for the AoE reduction, how one's raid deals with mechanics and/or how you tank an encounter will have a profound effect on choosing this trinket. Some encounters I solely chose Rook's so I could tank it a certain way and not leave the healers stressed out or my survival in doubt... having the healers being able to ignore you most of the time and worry about the raid is something I strive for.
    *Since I'm tired of reposting the link:* EH vs TTL and Hybrid Tax

  17. #1097
    Can you tell me what stat weights you use so I can reproduce this?
    It should be able to get right up to the Crit cap (if possible and your weights allow it).

    If I load your Bear into Catus, unbuffed you have 77.98% crit. If I enable raid buffs, it shows 79.03% crit.
    Oh wait I think I know the problem, I'm using Feral armor specialization, which gives 5% Agility, instead of 5% Stamina for Guardian.

    I'll fix this tonight. In the meantime, you can just disable Stats buff (Mark of the Wild) to counteract the Feral armor specialization benefit.

    Thanks for testing and letting me know.

  18. #1098
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by exochaft View Post
    For the most part, I believe Rook works on most AoE-oriented abilities. I believe it works on all boss conal AoE abilities now, so it's akin to using a slightly less power SI every 1.5 minutes for 15 second duration for burst mechanics such as that. This is also a plus since I've noticed the legendary tanking cloak seems to never want to proc on most AoE damage or damage that doesn't flag for Vengeance gains (typically AoE in nature).
    In that case gonna toss the BL and start using Rook's. Nothing to loose really ^^
    Mari officer/RL/OT of Punished <- RECRUITING for WoD
    Proud RL of Mythic 8/14 HC Open Raid PUG

    Moderator of R & D | Open Raid
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    The curse of the Bear, the only tank whose active mitigation not only has RNG included, but only consists of RNG.


  19. #1099
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    Quote Originally Posted by raffy View Post
    Can you tell me what stat weights you use so I can reproduce this?
    It should be able to get right up to the Crit cap (if possible and your weights allow it).

    If I load your Bear into Catus, unbuffed you have 77.98% crit. If I enable raid buffs, it shows 79.03% crit.
    Oh wait I think I know the problem, I'm using Feral armor specialization, which gives 5% Agility, instead of 5% Stamina for Guardian.

    I'll fix this tonight. In the meantime, you can just disable Stats buff (Mark of the Wild) to counteract the Feral armor specialization benefit.

    Thanks for testing and letting me know.
    Well, you know u provided the stats weights screenshot (and I dunno what the actual numbers are, on my own anyway) so i just used the numbers u provided in that screenshot, with 79.05% crit. I did all the changes, and then buffed myself with mark of the wild and went bear form to have 77.8% crit. I will test what u said and then provide a feedback

    update:

    I did it and now it's way much better:

    -300 Agi, +520 Crit, +8 Expertise, -70 Haste, -2 Hit, -396 Mastery

    My crit is 79.03% now, with 7.51% hit and 15.03% expertise. -70 haste is still a gain cz the previous reforge/regem gave me more haste than my original 1, and mastery is useless anyway so Im good there with less mastery and more crit and the caps. So yes this should fix go go go, update it tonight, great work man!
    Last edited by Mandibleclaw; 2013-11-07 at 07:42 AM.

  20. #1100
    Thanks for testing this Mandibleclaw. I updated Catus to v31. Your Catus will autoupdate the next time you launch it.

    There is a new Guardian form button, which uses the proper armor specialization (+5% stamina). I also made it compute your bear form armor using Nature's Guardian mastery modifier. Activating this button exposes the [x] Enforce Crit Cap checkbox.

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