Conquest Discussion Thread

[Khelendros]

You don't often see me post anything negative about Rift, but this one really rubbed me the wrong way. Maybe its because I've been waiting since launch for a pvp feature like Conquest.

Anyways so Conquest launches today and its fairly smooth. Very little lag considering how insanely packed that first match was (I'd estimate at least 500 people). Conquest marks were added though I didn't get any. And then we lose the first match. TWO HOUR LOCKOUT! Totally sprung last minute I gotta figure they intended to do this all along but held it back so as not to generate bad press. To top it all off the mods are locking down threads about it and the one thread they left open was moved to Suggestion forum (not pvp where it belongs) a thread no one visits. Not the typical behavior I have come to expect from Trion. Devs have addressed several other 1.9 issues but no word yet on this despite universal outcry about it.

The other issue (and this is more a long term issue) is that with the insane amounts of raid damage in Conquest TTK is generall about 1-2 seconds. Its like a FPS. Not really great pvp. They need to at the very least raise health pools in Conquest or I suspect it will be a failure. The actual map itself is great the design and implementation seems good but some monumentally dumb decisions were made last minute that I hope won't leave a lasting bad impression.

[Runintowalls]

You don't often see me post anything negative about Rift, but this one really rubbed me the wrong way. Maybe its because I've been waiting since launch for a pvp feature like Conquest.

Anyways so Conquest launches today and its fairly smooth. Very little lag considering how insanely packed that first match was (I'd estimate at least 500 people). Conquest marks were added though I didn't get any. And then we lose the first match. TWO HOUR LOCKOUT! Totally sprung last minute I gotta figure they intended to do this all along but held it back so as not to generate bad press. To top it all off the mods are locking down threads about it and the one thread they left open was moved to Suggestion forum (not pvp where it belongs) a thread no one visits. Not the typical behavior I have come to expect from Trion. Devs have addressed several other 1.9 issues but no word yet on this despite universal outcry about it.

The other issue (and this is more a long term issue) is that with the insane amounts of raid damage in Conquest TTK is generall about 1-2 seconds. Its like a FPS. Not really great pvp. They need to at the very least raise health pools in Conquest or I suspect it will be a failure. The actual map itself is great the design and implementation seems good but some monumentally dumb decisions were made last minute that I hope won't leave a lasting bad impression.

its understandable to be frustrated, but lets have a little faith. Conquest is very technical with many variables, that it will take time to perfect it and work out the kinks so it runs smoothly. The idea and originality is great, but just because trion hits the ball out of the park on the first swing with most new systems, doesn't mean we should expect as much with an extremely complicated and risky system like conquest.

I think the forum mod responded in the right way sending your post to the suggestion thread, because thats where the post will get the attention it deserves. you might think in it would be overlooked there, but that's the first place the devs will check for ways to make improvements and polish the game. You have valid concerns and suggestions, I'm sure they're looking for ways how they can make it better. the pvp thread has a lot of subjective complaining and very general that specific time sensitive concerns for a new system might get lost there. new systems also receive a lot of "constructive" criticism and hype which can be bad for the atmosphere of the game when many players with differing ideas and desires lobby for what they want, often bickering amongst themselves, had your post remained in the pvp thread, there's little doubt in my mind it would have players responding in controversy and have to be locked. because fewer players look in suggestions (which is intended for devs) unless you were trying to start a riot, I think that's where your useful post belongs. your audience is the developers not the players.

its better to give constructive feedback that offers suggestive solutions rather than gripes and what "doesnt work well" or "broken"... its one thing to say we don't like something, its much better to explain what we don't like, why, and how it can be fixed

[Puremallace]

Give them a day Khel lol. First time this has ever been attempted for a Themepark to go from 2 faction to 3 faction pvp. There are some kinks. best you can do is report it in the Conquest:Known issue thread and see what they do

I know pvp'rs will bitch and unsub which is why I have been advocating Trion just ignore pvp, but Trion si good at addressing issues

[Edge-]

The two hour lockout...came out of nowhere. If they leave that in that will mostly kill my excitement for the feature : /

Was really looking forward to a more or less endless battle between the three factions, and if that's not the case that's a huge buzzkill for me. Did they ever mention the lockout when hyping this? I don't remember it, but I tend to miss details like this frequently : /

[Dorfadin]

They will have no chance in hell of competing against GW2 if they keep a 2 hour lockout on the "outdoor" style pvp which is in GW2(which has 0 lockouts), stupid idea on Trions behalf.

[windfish]

the lockout is probably just to prevent the servers with being overloaded with all the people excited atm. It will probably be taken away in a few days to a week.

[Deleted]

How long is a conquest match?
If it's like 30min and then 2h wait it's sad =/
I read that "dont worry, be happy" and it will be just a 30min cd shortly, but why have a cd at all? I dont understand. And I've been following rift official forum about conquest and no, nothing has been mentioned about this before. True that it's a bit amazing Rift pulls stuff like this, surprising but not in a good way =/
GG for casuals like me being able to play just one on an ordinary weekday =/

---------- Post added 2012-06-27 at 07:09 PM ----------

the lockout is probably just to prevent the servers with being overloaded with all the people excited atm. It will probably be taken away in a few days to a week.

Seems like they will keep it, but it will somehow get shorter to like 30min in a couple of days =/
"Hey guys, The Conquest cooldown is intended - while we know a lot of people are checking out Conquest for the first time today, most Wednesday mornings will not be this active. A wait needs to be sufficient to ensure enough people are ready to start a new round of Conquest as possible - this is a large map requiring many players to make it active and fun! That said - you'll see the wait time shrinks to about 30 minutes during the busiest hours allowing for constant Conquest with hundreds of players. Thanks all and please continue to give us your feedback so we can constantly improve this and all features - cheers!"
http://forums.riftgame.com/official-...-conquest.html

[Puremallace]

They will have no chance in hell of competing against GW2 if they keep a 2 hour lockout on the "outdoor" style pvp which is in GW2(which has 0 lockouts), stupid idea on Trions behalf.

It is a auto afk feature. You will notice in GW2 just how stupid not having a lock out is after the shine wears off, but reality does not apply to that game as of yet until it actually launches so I am wasting my time even typing this.

2 hours is more then likely a bug or a very shitty method of controlling population flow into a new feature.

Source: http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...onquest-2.html

Hey guys,

The Conquest cooldown is intended - while we know a lot of people are checking out Conquest for the first time today, most Wednesday mornings will not be this active.

A wait needs to be sufficient to ensure enough people are ready to start a new round of Conquest as possible - this is a large map requiring many players to make it active and fun!

That said - you'll see the wait time shrinks to about 30 minutes during the busiest hours allowing for constant Conquest with hundreds of players.

Thanks all and please continue to give us your feedback so we can constantly improve this and all features - cheers!

James "Elrar" Nichols
Community Manager // Trion Worlds

My view still holds that pvp'rs are whiney babies and will give Trion maybe 1 hour to get it fixed exactly how they expect it to be before unsubbing then spending the next year bashing the game as experts on Conquest and Rift pvp.

[Azuri]

2 hours seems a bit extreme but I could live with 30 minutes CD between matches nothing stopping you from doing a few WZ's or something inbetween. Crying the sky is falling within a few hours of a new uncharted feature launch for Trion seems a little premature. I've got no reason to belive they will go all herp derp with this and just tell us to deal with it as is. Take a deep breath it will be ok.

[Acquiesce of Telara]

Any development team with such a collectively level head who implements such a stupid feature leaves me believing it's not such a stupid feature in the first place.

If Conquest is going to allow 100-500 people (random numbers are mine) to fight in the same zone across 3 factions, I can appreciate the need to quantify and qualify details. PTR wouldn't allow for as many players simply because of how few participate in the PTR. Going live, restrictions and lockouts are likely a necessary evil, at least for the time being.

Anyone remember how badly Wintergrasp messed with the Northrend continent when Wrath was first released? Trion are likely keeping things as controlled as possible to remove any unnecessary stresses as players grow accustomed to the feature.

On the plus side, knowing you're locked out for 2 hours, you're less likely to putz around vendors the entire time, derping your way to a faction loss.

[Deleted]

Well, I dont think people should call pvp people whiners. For the pvp people who have played a lot and regulary they must have been quite patient and understanding. That people are getting upset right now must be because they really longed for and wished for an update in the Rift field, and ofc they get upset if it's not working properly. Pvp people must be the ones who really wanted this patch, haven't been much noise from people running the new raid that got released as well tonight? Or the rp people hanging around the barber?
Let the pvp people cry tonight, and just hope that Rift keep them in priority after quite some time of neglection

[Rajadog20]

Im absolutely loving Conquest! Its a blast! Just got 33K prestiege and 20+K favor in one 25 min match. Sooo many people, it reminded me of aion fort sieges! =D
Loving it! I would be better without the CD but im sure that will get lessened soon.

[Acquiesce of Telara]

Im absolutely loving Conquest! Its a blast! Just got 33K prestiege and 20+K favor in one 25 min match. Sooo many people, it reminded me of aion fort sieges! =D
Loving it! I would be better without the CD but im sure that will get lessened soon.

LOL you must be Muffinmans on the Rift Forums. I'm reading your posts and compliments right now.

[Edge-]

Im absolutely loving Conquest! Its a blast! Just got 33K prestiege and 20+K favor in one 25 min match. Sooo many people, it reminded me of aion fort sieges! =D
Loving it! I would be better without the CD but im sure that will get lessened soon.

...if gains are that fast, this pleases me. Been looking to get more of the PvP gear but haven't really wanted to continue the BG grind.

[Azuri]

Well, I dont think people should call pvp people whiners. Let the pvp people cry tonight, and just hope that Rift keep them in priority after quite some time of neglection

I don't frequent the official forums for Rift or any game I play for that matter so I can't speak for what is being said about PVPers. I would think the only thing PVPers are whining about at this moment is wanting to play more conquest at this exact moment and not having to wait 2 hours between matches. I'm not an avid PVPer but I still see Rift maturing slowly in all aspects of the games including PVP.

In some MMO's you get a new BG, and another arena or something once per xpac which is basically just a new map. /golfclap

[Tarien]

Just FYI, apparently the Cooldown is tied to the time of day (check the Dev tracker for the posts). During the evenings it will be shorter. It's to prevent empty Conquests, and so that people don't abandon WFs in favor of Conquest.

[Khelendros]

Give them a day Khel lol. First time this has ever been attempted for a Themepark to go from 2 faction to 3 faction pvp. There are some kinks. best you can do is report it in the Conquest:Known issue thread and see what they do

I know pvp'rs will bitch and unsub which is why I have been advocating Trion just ignore pvp, but Trion si good at addressing issues

Its not about me. While I am frustrated for sure, its the newbies that just resubbed on level 50 chat who are saying they wasted their money coming back that has me worried. I just fail to see why they would spring such a major change last minute. They are working on adjusting it, and I did give them good feedback about how to fix it. There are other issues as well. Daglar did say the kill count will be upped in the next hotfix. Cause 2.5k kills was being met in about 20 minutes with 500 people in one match.

I think the cooldown is something they should have tested and let the PTS people come up with a better solution, cause there are better alternatives than a 2 hour lockout. I especially felt bad for one guy on 50 chat who had just resubbed for conquest and happened to log on right after a match had ended and he had to find out it was a 129 minute wait till the next match.

[Deleted]

I don't frequent the official forums for Rift or any game I play for that matter so I can't speak for what is being said about PVPers. I would think the only thing PVPers are whining about at this moment is wanting to play more conquest at this exact moment and not having to wait 2 hours between matches. I'm not an avid PVPer but I still see Rift maturing slowly in all aspects of the games including PVP.

In some MMO's you get a new BG, and another arena or something once per xpac which is basically just a new map. /golfclap

Well, one of my biggest issues with wow before I quit that place was complete neglection of pvp an entire x-pac, no forgive and forget there =) Started Rift in november and around then and a couple of months ahead, before last patch was released there was no word about pvp and the direction of it. Also, last patch didn't have any pvp updates so I really like what they are trying and going for with this patch and that's why I will resub and try it out =) Overall it seems like it's now something big is happening in the pvp field in Rift, following what people say that has played since release is that the gear grind has been improved a little since release but that's it and then the game has been out a bit more than a year. But since this is such a big feature for Rift pvp community, I think many people want it to succeed and be good. And from what muffinman wrote it seems to be fun, as long as you get to play it =) If it naturally will be fixed so cooldowns is shortened I'm betting there will be dry eyes tomorrow. Fingers crossed =)

---------- Post added 2012-06-27 at 08:23 PM ----------

Its not about me. While I am frustrated for sure, its the newbies that just resubbed on level 50 chat who are saying they wasted their money coming back that has me worried.

That's why I'm happy that I live in the EU and got delayed patch. Started downloading and had my wallet ready directly when I got home from work. Until I read 1.8 on the download and went here to find out about the delay. Good thing EU people will try out tonight and tomorrow and after work then I will hold wallet carefully and see how the changes are :P

[Puremallace]

Some responses from Daglar

Source: http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...ml#post3849417

The amount of time between Conquest matches is based upon the time of day for the servers that it is hosted on. Right now we are in a slower spawn time period. It will go faster later this afternoon/evening.

~Daglar

Originally Posted by Antigonos View Post
i hope you know all local holidays all over the world? ^^

i know where this comes from, that its an attempt to stop midnight raids exploiting conquest for fast prestige/favor. But there needs to be a better way, and 2h+ at ANY TIME is to much IMHO.

We will keep an eye on these things and tweak and hotfix.

People here in the office are already wanting to play the next matches.
The attrition amount in live is also a bit low - we'll be increasing that with a future hotfix as well.

Originally Posted by Arcshayde View Post
Thank you for explaining the mechanic Daglar. Any chance we can get random teams instead of sitting in que?

Queue really only happened because we added an artificial /total/ limit at the last minute to insure that crazy things didnt happen. We are going to keep raising the artificial limit until things go bad

There are a TON of people in Conquest.

~Daglar

[Khelendros]

Daglar confirms well over a hundred per side. How much exactly he didn't say.

2500 being a little low is a understatement. The last match I was in lasted 10 minutes 27 seconds. And it was over by Attrittion. So 2500 kills doesn't last NEAR enough. It should be about 10k.

Also it seems unlikely NA will get a patch today.

My biggest fear is that they will wait to long to realize people do not want a battle this huge in an area that small on a 2 hour cooldown and will quit. There is a reason why open world pvp maps are generally multiple maps.

Despite what Daglar said, its still 2 hours between matches.

This whole thing is just very wierd. Trion has always been about giving the player the choice and letting them choose how they want to play. Now they are doing the exact opposite with Conquest. Its very odd, and very out of the blue. I'm really concerned how this could hurt them in the press, especially with all the positive hype 1.9 had.