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  1. #21
    I actually prefer the WoW questing pattern rather than the GW2 hearts.
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Arothand View Post
    That might be it. The funny thing though is that while the games we played as kids had nothing to do with following instructions, the basis for MMORPGs in general, that is tabletop RPGs, were firmly based around that. In D&D unless you're playing some weird campaign you DO have instructions, even if it's as basic as "Find the dragon's lair and kill it" or "Rescue the townsfolk from the slavers". I think that's where ArenaNet dropped the ball, and one of the reasons I think GW2 will fail - an RPG isn't suited to freeform gameplay. If it was GTA Online or something like that, I could see that working, but a traditional fantasy RPG has its roots in a strict plot (the dreaded "railroad"), and GW2 doesn't have that because ArenaNet decided that we needed to be led away from it.
    You know, I remember my older brother telling me about one of their DnD sessions a few years back. They had a goal of going to some famous city to find some guy and get an item from him or something like that. There were 7 of them and the GM, so 8 people total. They went into the city, asked for directions, found the guy, got the item, and went back outside on their quest.

    After that session the GM nerdraged all over the place because he spent 18 (!) hours designing the entire city, with 12 plots, 29 quests, the layout of the streets, the biography of the NPCs, the history of the whole place, and those guys just went in and out of the place in 15 mins xD nobody even thought twice about silly things such as exploring. The GM said ''seriously, this is the last time I'm building a whole damn city for you lazy bastards''.

    I guess you're right, we all play like that - get objective -> complete objective. I'd say freedom to pursue any goals is awesome, but too much of it could kind of leave players without any sense of direction. Still, I'd rather have quests like that Stromgarde example in the article, if they would have some 'meaningful' obstacles in getting to the goal, instead of 'those mobs spawn here in this corner, those mobs spawn over there on that plain' quests.

  3. #23
    chains>>>hearts.

    seriously, i haven't had to grind this much since i last played EVE.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Arothand View Post
    I think that's where ArenaNet dropped the ball, and one of the reasons I think GW2 will fail .
    I don't think it'll fail, a lot of people no doubt seem to enjoy this sort of sandbox gameplay even for an mmorpg. Me however want clear goals, set storylines and information to take in at my own will. I have come to realize this after reaching level 30 2 times in GW2.

    Also I don't enjoy that they say "Personal story", yet it feels nothing like its personal and my toon is a very generic, preset "tough" woman...I don't relate to going "FEEL THE FURY!!" or "Is it just me, or am I amazing?"...I was more thinking along the lines of the leading lady of The Hunger Games, but I can't steer my toon at all...so then I prefer making up my own story and lightweight roleplaying. I can tell you a story for ALL of my WoW toons...that's personal to me.

    Seeing how much fun people are having though, I highly doubt it'll fail at all.
    Last edited by Rorcanna; 2012-09-02 at 02:19 PM.
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  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Rorcanna View Post
    I don't think it'll fail, a lot of people no doubt seem to enjoy this sort of sandbox gameplay even for an mmorpg. Me however want clear goals, set storylines and information to take in at my own will.

    Also I don't enjoy that they say "Personal story", yet it feels nothing like its personal and my toon is a very generic, preset "tough" woman...I don't relate to going "FEEL THE FURY!!" or "Is it just me, or am I great?"...I was more thinking along the lines of the leading lady of The Hunger Games, but I can't steer my toon at all...so then I prefer making up my own story and lightweight roleplaying.

    Seeing how much fun people are having though, I highly doubt it'll fail at all.
    I've also heard most people ''complain'' (mostly minor remarks) that the personal story is pretty lackluster. Great concept, execution not so much... If I'm not mistaken, you have only a few of those choices where your story branches , like 6-8 or something, right? That's throughout the whole leveling. A friend of mine wholeheartedly disliked that there were so few of them with ''irrelevant decisions/outcomes''.
    Last edited by Volta; 2012-09-02 at 02:19 PM.

  6. #26
    I'm over lvl 50 in GW2, and I complete every zone for 100% (not only my race, but all of them) so I'm doing every heart out there. Yes it feels very repetetive, boring and grindy. Well it's not like you need to kill mobs over and over again, you collect some shit, feed animals and stuff, but the higher level the more you need to do.
    It's different but I would trade it for nice long chain quest that guide you through the map. Vistas, points of interest, skill challanges and jumping puzzles are good as they are and it's realy fun to look for them.

  7. #27
    Warchief Northy's Avatar
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    I'm probably going to get flamed for this. I enjoy GW2 but I thoroughly enjoy WoW questing way more.
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  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Northy View Post
    I'm probably going to get flamed for this. I enjoy GW2 but I thoroughly enjoy WoW questing way more.
    Not really, as far as I can see the thread so far is smooth and people accepting that it's subjective. Hopefully it can continue down this path.
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  9. #29
    yeah gw 2 is kinda boring on that part , pvp is fun but dont know i am missing something

    i have a 55 char and 38 so i quested pretty much , the more you level the more you only farm events i have the feeling :s its grinding to but with running around ^^
    But i am still having fun , but the thing i hate most about gw2 is arena net..

    some incompetent guys , when you see evrything that is buggy its one of the worst releases ever..

    you cant run dungeons , cant quest in group ( first 2 days ) no ah , all the bug , they cant event check prices on vendor items and had to ban poeple that bought items of vendors lol..


    Oh then the other ban you could trade something like justice points vs cooking mats.. cook items and seel them on the vendor for 20 or 25 silver.. poeple got banned for that too..

    Arena net is just overdone and is not used to poeple trying stuff out... and banning poeple for there incompetence is kinda turn off for me... who knows you spend 100 days in a game then you wanna try something out and.. get banned cause why? cause arena net sucks and they dont care banning poeple cause there is no subscription

    Its kind of sad the game is realy fun playing next to wow or other stuff but well yeah too many problemes in "MY" opignon
    Last edited by Uselessrouge; 2012-09-02 at 02:42 PM.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Northy View Post
    I'm probably going to get flamed for this. I enjoy GW2 but I thoroughly enjoy WoW questing way more.
    As Rorcanna said, hopefully it all continues without flaming.

    So why do you actually enjoy WoW quests more?
    Great Reads:
    In-Depth WoW Review - Part 1: Quests / Part 2: Leveling / Part 3: Phasing / Part 4: Difficulty / Part 5: Professions / Part 6: World PvP / Part 7: Burnout
    How to play
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  11. #31
    Elemental Lord Snowraven's Avatar
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    True, heart quests in GW2 are grindy, and here comes the cool side, they're not there to be the actual important part, they're mostly there to have you move around so you get to different events. The quests in GW2 are there to have you move a bit in the world so you're not without any goal if no events are near you.

    The events are the actual "quests" of GW2, and the events yes, they may also be grindy a bit. The difference is that they're in different ways. You could level without fighting at all for many events, since most have different choices of what to do and how to do it. The difference is the events don't wait for you, so if you want to go and help a centaur village you can't wait until tomorrow (well, in theory you could, since the even might repeat, but it won't be instant). You need to act now and this drags the player into the world, it makes you feel that if you really don't act now, that village will be gone. This is a major point GW2 brings, since it makes the world feel alive. In WoW, I could sit with quests for months. Before I quit, on my main I had a quest sitting there for 2 years. 2 YEARS! Yes, it was a raid quest though, but still, it does feel a bit odd to say the least, doesn't it?

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Uselessrouge View Post
    yeah gw 2 is kinda boring on that part , pvp is fun but dont know i am missing something

    i have a 55 char and 38 so i quested pretty much , the more you level the more you only farm events i have the feeling :s its grinding to but with running around ^^
    Here's a thought - most people that take leveling very slow tend to say they enjoy playing, while those that got to higher levels pretty fast see it as a grind. GW2 has been out for what, a week? Also, from what I have heard, people praise the WvWvW mode because you can just jump in and out from anywhere. Maybe try that out during questing to break the monotony a bit?
    Great Reads:
    In-Depth WoW Review - Part 1: Quests / Part 2: Leveling / Part 3: Phasing / Part 4: Difficulty / Part 5: Professions / Part 6: World PvP / Part 7: Burnout
    How to play
    Important notice! -> Fullmetal Alchemist:Brotherhood is awesome.

  13. #33
    Elemental Lord Snowraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rorcanna View Post
    Not really, as far as I can see the thread so far is smooth and people accepting that it's subjective. Hopefully it can continue down this path.
    Agreed. I'm sure we can all express ourselves without going overboard even if we have different opinions.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Volta View Post
    Here's a thought - most people that take leveling very slow tend to say they enjoy playing, while those that got to higher levels pretty fast see it as a grind. GW2 has been out for what, a week? Also, from what I have heard, people praise the WvWvW mode because you can just jump in and out from anywhere. Maybe try that out during questing to break the monotony a bit?
    yeah this is true , my first char i only quested
    the second one i took my time for cooking , proffesions , 100% map exploration on EVRY map then some pvp and WvW is a nice change ^^
    But i have the feeling more you level up the faster it goes cause maps are flooded with events ^^ you just run around and AE evrything

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Arnorei View Post
    True, heart quests in GW2 are grindy, and here comes the cool side, they're not there to be the actual important part, they're mostly there to have you move around so you get to different events. The quests in GW2 are there to have you move a bit in the world so you're not without any goal if no events are near you.

    The events are the actual "quests" of GW2, and the events yes, they may also be grindy a bit. The difference is that they're in different ways. You could level without fighting at all for many events, since most have different choices of what to do and how to do it. The difference is the events don't wait for you, so if you want to go and help a centaur village you can't wait until tomorrow (well, in theory you could, since the even might repeat, but it won't be instant). You need to act now and this drags the player into the world, it makes you feel that if you really don't act now, that village will be gone. This is a major point GW2 brings, since it makes the world feel alive. In WoW, I could sit with quests for months. Before I quit, on my main I had a quest sitting there for 2 years. 2 YEARS! Yes, it was a raid quest though, but still, it does feel a bit odd to say the least, doesn't it?
    Jeezus... 2 years.... I think that could be a record. So lemme ask something else then, how 'fast' are the world events in GW2? I mean, if something destroys a village for example, how long is the village gone? I heard that if you cleaned out that ''whatever destroyed the village in the first place'', people will move back in and make some tents and stuff to build a new village again. So this is the part that I'm curious about -> when the village is 'repairing', how long does it take for the attack event to happen again? Every day once?
    Great Reads:
    In-Depth WoW Review - Part 1: Quests / Part 2: Leveling / Part 3: Phasing / Part 4: Difficulty / Part 5: Professions / Part 6: World PvP / Part 7: Burnout
    How to play
    Important notice! -> Fullmetal Alchemist:Brotherhood is awesome.

  16. #36
    Elemental Lord Snowraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Volta View Post
    I've also heard most people ''complain'' (mostly minor remarks) that the personal story is pretty lackluster. Great concept, execution not so much... If I'm not mistaken, you have only a few of those choices where your story branches , like 6-8 or something, right? That's throughout the whole leveling. A friend of mine wholeheartedly disliked that there were so few of them with ''irrelevant decisions/outcomes''.
    Yes, I have to admit, this is one of the flaws, the personal story they tried to make it somewhat like SW:ToR I think but they failed a bit here. Personal stories do need some more work to be honest since, outside those that do them for the lore, for the others I can understand why they might feel lackluster though.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Arnorei View Post
    True, heart quests in GW2 are grindy, and here comes the cool side, they're not there to be the actual important part, they're mostly there to have you move around so you get to different events. The quests in GW2 are there to have you move a bit in the world so you're not without any goal if no events are near you.

    The events are the actual "quests" of GW2, and the events yes, they may also be grindy a bit. The difference is that they're in different ways. You could level without fighting at all for many events, since most have different choices of what to do and how to do it. The difference is the events don't wait for you, so if you want to go and help a centaur village you can't wait until tomorrow (well, in theory you could, since the even might repeat, but it won't be instant). You need to act now and this drags the player into the world, it makes you feel that if you really don't act now, that village will be gone. This is a major point GW2 brings, since it makes the world feel alive. In WoW, I could sit with quests for months. Before I quit, on my main I had a quest sitting there for 2 years. 2 YEARS! Yes, it was a raid quest though, but still, it does feel a bit odd to say the least, doesn't it?
    That's not completely true though, I've seen the same events replay and respawn over and over within just 2 hours of playing in a zone. I have yet to see a village disappear and be gone for a very long time. I save Quaggans and feel good because then the area feels safe, yet within the hour and sooner than that, they're in peril again...yes, I do love those Quaggans. Same with camps being overrun or towns, this might change when there's a bit less activity but so far the respawning is incredibly fast.

    I much prefer WoW phasing (when done properly, such as Andorhal, they need more like it) over this system I must say, but I can't see how it'd work for GW2 nor would it be needed since there's room for different game mechanics and designs.
    Last edited by Rorcanna; 2012-09-02 at 02:49 PM.
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  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Uselessrouge View Post
    yeah this is true , my first char i only quested
    the second one i took my time for cooking , proffesions , 100% map exploration on EVRY map then some pvp and WvW is a nice change ^^
    But i have the feeling more you level up the faster it goes cause maps are flooded with events ^^ you just run around and AE evrything
    Higher level zones have more content than lower level zones? Or is it just easier to play since you're mostly geared up? Another friend of mine said he went back to a noobish zone and got his face smacked by 1 mob (he didn't notice he scaled down to that level), and said anything can kill you if you're not careful.

    ---------- Post added 2012-09-02 at 04:53 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Arnorei View Post
    Yes, I have to admit, this is one of the flaws, the personal story they tried to make it somewhat like SW:ToR I think but they failed a bit here. Personal stories do need some more work to be honest since, outside those that do them for the lore, for the others I can understand why they might feel lackluster though.
    I have no doubts they will add more of those choices / polish the whole thing as time passes. It has a lot of potential. But I'm not familiar with how SW:ToR worked in that regard o_O
    Great Reads:
    In-Depth WoW Review - Part 1: Quests / Part 2: Leveling / Part 3: Phasing / Part 4: Difficulty / Part 5: Professions / Part 6: World PvP / Part 7: Burnout
    How to play
    Important notice! -> Fullmetal Alchemist:Brotherhood is awesome.

  19. #39
    Elemental Lord Snowraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Volta View Post
    Jeezus... 2 years.... I think that could be a record. So lemme ask something else then, how 'fast' are the world events in GW2? I mean, if something destroys a village for example, how long is the village gone? I heard that if you cleaned out that ''whatever destroyed the village in the first place'', people will move back in and make some tents and stuff to build a new village again. So this is the part that I'm curious about -> when the village is 'repairing', how long does it take for the attack event to happen again? Every day once?
    heh, yea.

    How long is the village gone? Until you take it back. Usually when npcs take over a city, there's a camp or something of friendly npcs making plans to take it back. If you don't help them... it remains a destroyed village under control of evil npcs and they start to fortify it even and launch attacks further.
    At least this is what I know. Currently there's a lot of people still around in the lower level zones however, so the events are pushed back in their chain very fast, so you can't see how they would progress. Once people get to max level and there will be a more even spread of players across zones we'll know for sure exactly how it goes. However this is what I know. Usually npcs can't take the towns back alone. And events scale in strengh and number as more people are in a zone.

    This is why in the low level zones when the game launched some events were triggering every 15 min, there were hundreads of people there! But now that people moved on to other zones, they trigger slower and the mobs actually push more.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Rorcanna View Post
    That's not completely true though, I've seen the same events replay and respawn over and over within just 2 hours of playing in a zone. I have yet to see a village disappear and be gone for a very long time. I save Quaggans and feel good because then the area feels safe, yet within the hour and sooner than that, they're in peril again...yes, I do love those Quaggans. Same with camps being overrun or towns, this might change when there's a bit less activity but so far the respawning is incredibly fast.

    I much prefer WoW phasing (when done properly, such as Andorhal, they need more like it) over this system I must say, but I can't see how it'd work for GW2 nor would it be needed since there's room for different game mechanics and designs.
    Even though I haven't played GW2, I think the phasing system is a bit better than dynamic events, since you actually see some meaningful change. If either Blizzard or ArenaNet would combine both systems into one, I think it would be pretty f***ing awesome.
    Great Reads:
    In-Depth WoW Review - Part 1: Quests / Part 2: Leveling / Part 3: Phasing / Part 4: Difficulty / Part 5: Professions / Part 6: World PvP / Part 7: Burnout
    How to play
    Important notice! -> Fullmetal Alchemist:Brotherhood is awesome.

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