1. #1
    Old God Winter Blossom's Avatar
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    Went BM and DPS went lower...

    For 4.3 I speced Surv for Pve. I was doing great DPS in it and never had trouble getting the numbers. When 5.0.4 hit I did what most hunters did and went BM. After specing I went to numerous hunter websites and followed their advice on reforging and read up on what stats were most important.
    Well, I've done some LFR after doing all that and I can't seem to get my DPS where it used to be in Surv during 4.3. I've got the right rotation and I'm pretty sure I'm glyphed and reforged right, so I don't understand what's going on...I've got the right amount of hit and expertise also.

    Here is a link to my toon. Am I doing something wrong? I am currently running with a spirit beast, that is speced in ferocity.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ndria/advanced
    Last edited by Winter Blossom; 2012-09-06 at 11:41 PM.

  2. #2
    Just because BM got buffed doesn't mean it will perform better than Survival in DS. I still use Survival for DS and am pulling around the same numbers as pre patch.

  3. #3
    Make sure you try and line up lynx rush with BW. Never use BW and RF at the same time. Always time your BW to include 2 kill commands.
    Thats the most important dps things that i know of.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Shockymonkey View Post
    Just because BM got buffed doesn't mean it will perform better than Survival in DS. I still use Survival for DS and am pulling around the same numbers as pre patch.

    Same here. Just about the same. I think I managed a tiny bit more on Mor'chok and Zon'ozz, though. But still about the same.

  5. #5
    Right now, BM does more damage than SV in patchwerk conditions. Probably you might need to practice or something.

  6. #6
    You can't just switch to a new spec and do well with it. Practice.

    Btw, most hunters I see day to day aren't even bothering to switch, they just like SV more, and the damage difference isn't huge.

  7. #7
    BM power I hit over 100k dps at burn phase. BM right now have insane dps burst. E.g on Spine HC on sinle opening on tendon I do 1,5mln damage right now. Up from 800k in SV back in 4.3. On Ultra from 43k to over 50k in overal.

    I know that i'm average hunter, but even if i can make such improvement everyone can
    Last edited by dzidek; 2012-09-07 at 06:20 AM.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Missbenedict View Post
    Make sure you try and line up lynx rush with BW. Never use BW and RF at the same time. Always time your BW to include 2 kill commands.
    Thats the most important dps things that i know of.
    You're incorrect with BW and RF at the same time, there is one exception at the start of a fight you do this -

    Pop All CDs in correct order so certain things benefit from buffs.
    Kill Command
    Readiness
    Kill Command
    Dire Beast / Lynx Rush
    Bestial Wrath when the first one is off
    Rapid Fire when the second bestial wrath is off, or save it for an upcoming proc or potion, depends on fight length.

    The reason the first Rapid Fire gets kinda wasted is because its far better to do double BW for things like Lynx Rush which you need to use during Rabid and Potion, and if you delay the readiness, your DPS will fail because of that, not doing this will result in even more DPS loss at level 90 because you delay your level 90 talent spells even more, which do a lot of damage.

    BM blows SV out of the water in Dragon Soul right now, for AoE, you use a Worm and you will destroy SV AoE, and single target is just about smashing buttons hard enough, my DPS on Ultraxion increased by 4k, 53-57k, and this could come up to 60k+ easily if didn't have people relying on broken addons to help them play the game.
    Last edited by Kiea; 2012-09-07 at 06:52 AM.
    Kiea from Solidarity EU, Tarren Mill
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  9. #9
    Kiea are you applying SrS also at the start and having to manually reapply it or skipping it until after the 2 BW phases are over?

  10. #10
    I do quite similair dps as survival as I did before the patch (maybe slightly less) while BM and survival now feel quite close to each other in dps..

    It's annoying doing dragonsoul and seeing out mage and boomkin doing about 15k more than they did before the patch... I only did slightly more damage than our warrior tank on Ultraxion this week because he did something ridiculous like 45k and I did about 48k. Hopefully it wont be like that at max level.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by dzidek View Post
    BM power I hit over 100k dps at burn phase. BM right now have insane dps burst. E.g on Spine HC on sinle opening on tendon I do 1,5mln damage right now. Up from 800k in SV back in 4.3. On Ultra from 43k to over 50k in overal.

    I know that i'm average hunter, but even if i can make such improvement everyone can
    Yeah at the beginning of the fight I peak 100k+... BM burst is insane.

  12. #12
    Looks like your Mastery is a bit low. You're about 50% of where I am at and BM is great with mastery currently. You do however, want a nice combo of crit as well. I switched from a sprit beast to my Devilsaur.

  13. #13
    The "best" spec isn't the best if you suck at playing it, is it? If you were good at survival, stay survival. The theoretical several percent difference between them isn't going to make a lick of difference for the average player, more people need to realize this.

  14. #14
    Question shouldn't blink strike be doing more damage than lynx rush in a single target fight? I see people saying lynx strike but 9 hits at 200%=1800% over all on a 90s cool down where blink strike is 600% on a 20s CD so it hits the 1800% mark at 60s

  15. #15
    I have not seen any detailed numbers on it but the reasoning for lynx rush still being better is that you need to spend many more GCDs on blink strike. You can also line up lynx rush with other cooldowns much easier.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiea View Post
    You're incorrect with BW and RF at the same time, there is one exception at the start of a fight you do this -

    Pop All CDs in correct order so certain things benefit from buffs.
    Kill Command
    Readiness
    Kill Command
    Dire Beast / Lynx Rush
    Bestial Wrath when the first one is off
    Rapid Fire when the second bestial wrath is off, or save it for an upcoming proc or potion, depends on fight length.

    The reason the first Rapid Fire gets kinda wasted is because its far better to do double BW for things like Lynx Rush which you need to use during Rabid and Potion, and if you delay the readiness, your DPS will fail because of that, not doing this will result in even more DPS loss at level 90 because you delay your level 90 talent spells even more, which do a lot of damage.

    BM blows SV out of the water in Dragon Soul right now, for AoE, you use a Worm and you will destroy SV AoE, and single target is just about smashing buttons hard enough, my DPS on Ultraxion increased by 4k, 53-57k, and this could come up to 60k+ easily if didn't have people relying on broken addons to help them play the game.
    So what you are saying is an opener like this? ->

    HM -> SrS -> RF -> BW -> KC -> LR/DB -> Readiness -> KC -> LR/DB -> BW -> RF (when BW is over)
    Last edited by Rusk; 2012-09-10 at 07:14 PM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Threndsa View Post
    Question shouldn't blink strike be doing more damage than lynx rush in a single target fight? I see people saying lynx strike but 9 hits at 200%=1800% over all on a 90s cool down where blink strike is 600% on a 20s CD so it hits the 1800% mark at 60s
    As has been stated in several threads BS should do more damage than LR over the course of the fight. It may or may not however be a DPS gain over LR because you spend so many more GCDs casting it over casting LR. All the extra GCDs you spend casting BS would have been AS, KC, CS, etc if you were using LR. So for BS to be a DPS gain over LR you would have to gain less damage overall from the GCDs you gain by using LR than the gap in damage between the spells themselves. For example let's say that LR does 300k over the course of the fight and BS does 400k. If you would gain more than 100k damage from the extra GCDs you have by using LR it's a DPS gain and LR is better. If you gain less than 100k damage from the extra GCDs then it's a DPS loss and BS is better.

    As I have said before I have not personally run any numbers between the two talents, I'll leave that to Zeherah and others, so I can't say definitively which is better. This is just the logic behind how to compare the two talents. And remember a lot more goes into the DPS values of these two talents, like CD stacking with LR for example, so you can't just look at these in a vacuum to compare them.

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