1. #2101
    Quote Originally Posted by exochaft View Post
    It pretty much does boil down to how the guild deals with the roster. While the utility that Ferals do bring is useful (and I personally think Ferals are awesome at personal survivability to boot), the same utility can be brought by moonkins/resto/guardians... which is likely a determining factor for bringing a Feral if you have a choice beyond pure DPS output...
    an awesome player would never be sit out, even if he plays less playable spec, so rather your ferals are bad, or your officers have a stupid stereotypes that ferals are crap spec, which is not

  2. #2102
    Which trinket would my fellow ferals use? 574 AOC or 530 Rune. Catus shows about 4k dps difference in favor of AOC, so pretty minimal.

  3. #2103
    Quote Originally Posted by umppa View Post
    Which trinket would my fellow ferals use? 574 AOC or 530 Rune. Catus shows about 4k dps difference in favor of AOC, so pretty minimal.
    Depends - if there is a large execute range where you can extend a Rune buffed rip from 25% boss health onwards, chances are it will blow a simmed 4k dps difference out of the water. On something like Malkorok, Thok or Garrosh, Rune if played well should win.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zstr View Post
    an awesome player would never be sit out, even if he plays less playable spec, so rather your ferals are bad, or your officers have a stupid stereotypes that ferals are crap spec, which is not
    I think Exo's point is that if you are looking for something other than high single target dps, or personal survivability, then feral - by contrast to a rogue or warrior - does not offer as much damage reduction utility, or anything other than what any other spec'd druid would already bring (roar, tranq etc.).

  4. #2104
    Quote Originally Posted by Themessiah View Post
    I think Exo's point is that if you are looking for something other than high single target dps, or personal survivability, then feral - by contrast to a rogue or warrior - does not offer as much damage reduction utility, or anything other than what any other spec'd druid would already bring (roar, tranq etc.).
    But why does it matter if another spec could bring it? Ferals still bring all those things. Would you bench a rogue just because another rogue already brings smoke bombs?

  5. #2105
    Quote Originally Posted by Alpheus View Post
    But why does it matter if another spec could bring it? Ferals still bring all those things. Would you bench a rogue just because another rogue already brings smoke bombs?
    Look at it like this - pretend whatever encounter we are doing we need 1 roar every so often; if I am taking the resto druid any way, or the boomkin or the bear, and I want to take a last player who offers me another decent damage reduction cool down (or some such thing), and dps is not tight, then it may make sense to bench a high dps feral over a lower dps rogue.

    In such a situation it would make sense because taking the rogue would offer you what you want, whereas taking a feral would not. What you want in this situation is, as Exo said "something beyond pure dps output."
    Last edited by Themessiah; 2013-12-18 at 05:20 PM.

  6. #2106
    The only guilds that should be nitpicking specific specs in the same role are top 10 world guilds. If you guild brings a rogue instead of you when neither person has a specific class related mechanic to deal with it's either the GM being too stupid and just stacking classes because "that's what other guilds do" or there is a serious player skill issue. In my experience the "that's what other guilds do" reasoning comes up A LOT in mid level raiding guilds.

  7. #2107
    Mechagnome Etapicx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glurp View Post
    In my experience the "that's what other guilds do" reasoning comes up A LOT in mid level raiding guilds.
    "We'r just as good as they, we just don't spend as much time"

    But yeah Player before Class everyday if you don't need the class for something really special.
    Always choose a lazy person to do the difficult job!
    Why?
    He will find an easy way to do it.


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  8. #2108
    Stood in the Fire Paloro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glurp View Post
    In my experience the "that's what other guilds do" reasoning comes up A LOT in mid level raiding guilds.
    Quote Originally Posted by Etapicx
    "We'r just as good as they, we just don't spend as much time"
    That's a pretty bold statement without having a set definition of a mid-level guild. Since you mention top 10 world, are you putting yourself into that category?

  9. #2109
    Quote Originally Posted by Paloro View Post
    That's a pretty bold statement without having a set definition of a mid-level guild. Since you mention top 10 world, are you putting yourself into that category?
    Did you actually read what I typed? The guilds that have a reason to nitpick specific specs within the same role are the ones pushing for top world ranks. Other guilds (including mine) shouldn't. Not even sure why you're trying to drag people's guilds into this discussion.

  10. #2110
    Quote Originally Posted by umppa View Post
    Which trinket would my fellow ferals use? 574 AOC or 530 Rune. Catus shows about 4k dps difference in favor of AOC, so pretty minimal.
    4k is hardly what most minmaxers would call "minimal". There's pretty much no reason to use Rune in that case.

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  11. #2111
    Stood in the Fire Paloro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glurp View Post
    Did you actually read what I typed? The guilds that have a reason to nitpick specific specs within the same role are the ones pushing for top world ranks. Other guilds (including mine) shouldn't. Not even sure why you're trying to drag people's guilds into this discussion.
    Don't get me wrong, I agree with you....but it's interesting you consider a top 50 guild in the mid-level range (when you really make up the top 5% of raiding characters).

  12. #2112
    Quote Originally Posted by Paloro View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I agree with you....but it's interesting you consider a top 50 guild in the mid-level range (when you really make up the top 5% of raiding characters).
    I said mid range guilds are the ones who will get overly picky about specs even though they don't need to. I never said top 50 guilds were mid range.

  13. #2113
    Quote Originally Posted by umppa View Post
    Which trinket would my fellow ferals use? 574 AOC or 530 Rune. Catus shows about 4k dps difference in favor of AOC, so pretty minimal.
    I was using a 580 AoC, 574 Haromm's and 530 RoR. If if I recall correctly Catus simmed RoR a little higher but in my testing it came out slightly lower.

    My experience with raid cooldowns is it is a MUCH bigger issue in 10 mans. In 25 mans Feral's poor target switching is the bigger liability.
    Last edited by teddabear; 2013-12-19 at 02:18 AM.

  14. #2114
    Cheers for advice, i think i will try AOC and see how it feels. AOC is hard to judge tought as in many fights you dont get to use extra berserk or it dont line up well. the cd off TF is nice tought and shorter deff cd is nice too on some fights.

  15. #2115
    Mechagnome Etapicx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paloro View Post
    That's a pretty bold statement without having a set definition of a mid-level guild. Since you mention top 10 world, are you putting yourself into that category?
    I've experience from what i would call mid-level raiding guilds. And maybe it was phrased bad but it was a citation from what you usually hear in those guilds. That was what the quote and the " " marks where for. Just because i doesn't play right now doesn't mean that i don't know how some guilds are or at least where.
    Always choose a lazy person to do the difficult job!
    Why?
    He will find an easy way to do it.


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  16. #2116
    Quote Originally Posted by Etapicx View Post
    I've experience from what i would call mid-level raiding guilds. And maybe it was phrased bad but it was a citation from what you usually hear in those guilds. That was what the quote and the " " marks where for. Just because i doesn't play right now doesn't mean that i don't know how some guilds are or at least where.
    This is kinda OT but my guild is only 10/14 heroic and there are quite a few people on our roster that say "well fatboss did it this way without this class so obviously we should too (even though their comp is way different than ours and we don't raid 5 days a week or whatever those people raid)"
    Last edited by Jordaen; 2013-12-20 at 11:00 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Coronius View Post
    When I see a lowbie Horde on a PvP server, I remove all my gear and fist him to death with my naked Gnome.
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  17. #2117
    Quote Originally Posted by Jordaen View Post
    This is kinda OT but my guild is only 10/14 and there are quite a few people on our roster that say "well fatboss did it this way without this class so obviously we should too (even though their comp is way different than ours and we don't raid 5 days a week or whatever those people raid)"
    Those guides are good for a starting point but that doesn't mean its right for your raiding group-I would never encourage blindly following them. There is more than one way to slay a dragon-or in this case an Orc.

  18. #2118
    Quote Originally Posted by umppa View Post
    Cheers for advice, i think i will try AOC and see how it feels. AOC is hard to judge tought as in many fights you dont get to use extra berserk or it dont line up well. the cd off TF is nice tought and shorter deff cd is nice too on some fights.
    One bad thing about AoC is the procs are so far apart you can't get the most out of FoN if your other trinket isn't cooperating. On the good side you can pretty well predict when AoC will proc so you can have 3 charges ready.

  19. #2119

  20. #2120
    gemming for feral these days (575), do i go for secondary stats everywhere, or do i still go pure agility in red sockets?

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