1. #2221
    Quote Originally Posted by Aseyhe View Post
    My list is pretty sparse but I have a couple of videos here.
    holy mother of god - all i see is stuff. but thank you. is that the guardian video you said something about in the final boss episode? standing in the cone?

    i watched that Fragnance Vid on Juggernaut. Is that Weakauras with the Rip and Rake icon with duration and dmg ticks?
    Last edited by siccora; 2014-01-21 at 04:28 PM.

  2. #2222
    Yeah, but that was our first kill and I was more cautious. These days I actually stand in every one.

    I've heard that "Sten's UI represents the least amounts of flair you can sport." I put a lot of effort into optimizing it for my perception but indeed I do not pay any attention to style.

  3. #2223
    Mechagnome Etapicx's Avatar
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    I have to say that is a real hardcore UI
    Always choose a lazy person to do the difficult job!
    Why?
    He will find an easy way to do it.


    I'm schizophrenic and alone... at least I got each other

  4. #2224
    Alright guys, I have a question about reforging/re-gemming/re-enchanting for Rune.

    I just recently got my Rune and I've been toying around with Catus.

    My main question is, how much agility is worth dropping, if any? And also, would anyone mind using Catus to see if I did this correctly?

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Help/advanced

    Lastly, are treants an increase in dps over SoTF now that I have rune? If so, do I only use them during rune proc?

  5. #2225
    Quote Originally Posted by Makaveli9090 View Post
    Alright guys, I have a question about reforging/re-gemming/re-enchanting for Rune.

    I just recently got my Rune and I've been toying around with Catus.

    My main question is, how much agility is worth dropping, if any? And also, would anyone mind using Catus to see if I did this correctly?

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Help/advanced

    Lastly, are treants an increase in dps over SoTF now that I have rune? If so, do I only use them during rune proc?
    Usually it's viewed as all or nothing gemming, since if you're in the middle the difference would be extremely negligible anyway to try to find a balance of gems. In your gear you should be able to switch to full secondaries no problem.

    Treants are always a small DPS increase over SotF, small enough that some would make a case for them not worth using in most cases. With Rune you want to use them at the end of either of your trinket procs (last ~1 sec).

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  6. #2226
    Stood in the Fire Paloro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aggixx View Post
    Treants are always a small DPS increase over SotF, small enough that some would make a case for them not worth using in most cases. With Rune you want to use them at the end of either of your trinket procs (last ~1 sec).
    If Harrom's procs by itself, it would be fine to use it at the start of the proc though, since the treants benefit from the AP for all the melee swings. Rune snapshots the bleed that is applied initially.

  7. #2227
    Quote Originally Posted by Paloro View Post
    If Harrom's procs by itself, it would be fine to use it at the start of the proc though, since the treants benefit from the AP for all the melee swings. Rune snapshots the bleed that is applied initially.
    The idea is that you can still get a Rune proc while Haromm's is active making their combined snapshot higher than what you would have gained from immediate damage on one trinket alone. The only exception to this is using a charge before 20 seconds after the 3rd charge regenerated to avoid losing it.

  8. #2228
    Stood in the Fire Paloro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpheus View Post
    The idea is that you can still get a Rune proc while Haromm's is active making their combined snapshot higher than what you would have gained from immediate damage on one trinket alone. The only exception to this is using a charge before 20 seconds after the 3rd charge regenerated to avoid losing it.
    I'm not sure I'm following the wording in your last sentence. It's my understanding that you don't ever want to sit on 3 charges.

  9. #2229
    Idk, I would never see myself using treants on anything honestly, besides siegecrafter belts progression. Thats another "theorycrafter" thing, Jimmy or I have yet to use treants this entire teir. SotF just helps so much with the pooling playstyle sitting at 3+ combo points as much as possible. After the opener where treants are clearly better, they really lose a lot of effectiveness after that when you could miss out on a big rip or getting up a non CC thrash in your rune proc.

  10. #2230
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximum View Post
    Idk, I would never see myself using treants on anything honestly, besides siegecrafter belts progression.
    I guess it doesn't matter after the nerf, but I still am curious.... HOW? They are utterly useless for Siegecrafter belts for me.
    "Treant do something."
    "Don't go there Treant, you'll be cut in half!"

  11. #2231
    My theorycraft on treants.
    They are MUCH stronger than SoTF(single target). But SoTF has synergy with DoC. According to Simcraft they lose to SoTF if you are not going to use them with procs or lose their uptime. Also RoRO decreases their melee damage - see this http://simulationcraft.org/541/Raid_T16H.html#player5. Melee damage is 1.8%, dot damage is 3.2% - its not bad.
    Last edited by mmokri; 2014-01-22 at 06:20 PM.

  12. #2232
    Quote Originally Posted by mmokri View Post
    My theorycraft on treants.
    They are MUCH stronger than SoTF(single target). But SoTF has synergy with DoC. According to Simcraft they lose to SoTF if you are not going to use them with procs or lose their uptime. Also RoRO decreases their melee damage - see this http://simulationcraft.org/541/Raid_T16H.html#player5. Melee damage is 1.8%, dot damage is 3.2% - its not bad.
    Yeah they "Sim" around there but i'm wierd with sims i don't really trust them at all. I'm simmed for a malkorok style of fight at 421k in the fight time alloted. My AVERAGE dps on malkorok ranges from 520k-550k with only once over 600k(wipe though (((( ). Its at least 100k behind, that being said that isnt a GREAT example of a fight treants vs SotF, but i still feel like treants wouldn't even be close. That and 0 of the rank ones on iron jugg have had treants. That and people underestimate the extra dps they can gain from shredding with 2pc with any decent amount of energy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Karlzone View Post
    I guess it doesn't matter after the nerf, but I still am curious.... HOW? They are utterly useless for Siegecrafter belts for me.
    "Treant do something."
    "Don't go there Treant, you'll be cut in half!"
    Haha i didn't know that happened to them on there I tunneled boss in progress. Just thought they would be decent for saving cd's for up there. do they really just run into the lasers and die? If so that would be pretty funny to watch haha.

  13. #2233
    Quote Originally Posted by Paloro View Post
    I'm not sure I'm following the wording in your last sentence. It's my understanding that you don't ever want to sit on 3 charges.
    Yeh you're right. Nevermind that.

  14. #2234
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximum View Post
    Yeah they "Sim" around there but i'm wierd with sims i don't really trust them at all. I'm simmed for a malkorok style of fight at 421k in the fight time alloted. My AVERAGE dps on malkorok ranges from 520k-550k with only once over 600k(wipe though (((( ).
    Your best WoL parse is 550K in 4:25, with 92% damage done to Malkorok, as DoC/SotF with 7 tricks and I don't know how many skull banners.

    Catus estimates 485K average with 33K deviation, putting (550K * .92) 506K @ +0.63 SD easily within the expected DPS range.
    Last edited by raffy; 2014-01-22 at 07:48 PM. Reason: too many tricks

  15. #2235
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximum View Post
    Haha i didn't know that happened to them on there I tunneled boss in progress. Just thought they would be decent for saving cd's for up there. do they really just run into the lasers and die? If so that would be pretty funny to watch haha.
    Yeah first time and first time only

  16. #2236
    On shamans, do you just swipe spam for the start? Or do you try to multi dot everything with rip/rake.

  17. #2237
    Quote Originally Posted by Paloro View Post
    If Harrom's procs by itself, it would be fine to use it at the start of the proc though, since the treants benefit from the AP for all the melee swings. Rune snapshots the bleed that is applied initially.
    The melee damage is fairly inconsequential with the mastery levels we have now, it's higher DPS to maximize the damage by waiting for 2 trinket procs. Since Rune penalizes the melee damage further by not using them at the end of the proc it encourages you to wait until the end of the proc regardless of the if your other trinket is active or not.

    Without Rune, the goal would be use them ASAP when both trinkets are active so you could get the snapshotted Rake and as high melee damage as possible.

    That said, I made the disclaimer for a reason. I was aware Fragnance pretty much doesn't use them, and neither does Maximum, and a strong argument can be made for them being a complete waste of time at best.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Makaveli9090 View Post
    On shamans, do you just swipe spam for the start? Or do you try to multi dot everything with rip/rake.
    With Rune I would say Thrash x2, Multi Rake, clip Thrash at the end of Rune proc. Without, maybe the same minus the clip. Hard to say for sure what's optimal.
    Last edited by aggixx; 2014-01-23 at 02:42 AM.

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  18. #2238
    With soul swap and 4-piece t16 you can get rake, rip, and thrash up, soul swap, and get rake and rip up again all inside the 10-second proc window.

  19. #2239
    With Catus re-gemming, should I put the re-gem on Yellow or Yellow w/o expertise? And for the future should I just go with whatever sims my mastery proc the highest?

  20. #2240
    Quote Originally Posted by Aseyhe View Post
    With soul swap and 4-piece t16 you can get rake, rip, and thrash up, soul swap, and get rake and rip up again all inside the 10-second proc window.
    That's probably better, if more global intensive and harder to pull off. I can't imagine it's a huge difference though since you lose the majority of 2 buffed rakes and half a thrash or so worth of damage, mine would definitely be a competitive alternative if you want a different symbiosis than Soul Swap for some reason.

    @Makaveli: Use Yellow. Yellow w/o exp is mainly for testing purposes, but in theory if it's worth gemming crit or haste or mastery over agi it's worth gemming exp over agi too.
    Last edited by aggixx; 2014-01-23 at 04:43 AM.

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