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  1. #1

    Why pvp damage so low?

    TV hits for 5k and only crits for 10k (RF gurth)
    Exo 4-5k 11k crit
    HoW 8k 15k crit

    These numbers seem awfully low to me. Can barely make a dent in anyone.

  2. #2
    Stood in the Fire silver9172's Avatar
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    Do you have any PvP gear?

  3. #3
    Yes i got a mix of ruth/cata

  4. #4
    The Patient welcome2life's Avatar
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    What are these abilities hitting for outside of pvp? Ret paladins generate holy power a lot faster now and this could have required blizzard to nerf the damage of some of their abilities to make sure that they were not pulling too far ahead of other classes.

  5. #5
    Correct me if i am wrong, but ret pallies strike damage scales off weapon damage, if so then lfr gurth is the issue more than ability power ?

  6. #6
    Scarab Lord Gandrake's Avatar
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    have to pop wings and trinket if you want to do any damage

    Correct me if i am wrong, but ret pallies strike damage scales off weapon damage, if so then lfr gurth is the issue more than ability power
    well lfr gurth has more top end than the pvp weapon, but I would definitely rather use something like an N Cudgel/ESS or N Gurthalak.
    Sunglasses and Advil, last night was mad real. Sun coming up, 5 a.m., I wonder if they got cabs still?
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  7. #7
    it feels to me dmg is a bit low too especially when im full pvp gear and my TV crits for like 15k and i have the normal mode Gurth. but when i can get crit for 67k from a full pvp gear warlock from chaos bolt i feel like im being more of an annoyance then dps hurting anyone lol

  8. #8
    Scarab Lord Gandrake's Avatar
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    i am sure the warlock does not appreciate it when you are just nomming away at his health bar with back to back dp procs

    it can be difficult to find these openings, but is easier for ret paladins since they have pretty good self-healing
    Sunglasses and Advil, last night was mad real. Sun coming up, 5 a.m., I wonder if they got cabs still?
    Thinking 'bout the girl in all leopard who was rubbing the wood like Kiki Shepherd
    Two tattoos: one read "No Apologies". The other said "Love is Cursed by Monogamy"

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by uncannyllama View Post
    it feels to me dmg is a bit low too especially when im full pvp gear and my TV crits for like 15k and i have the normal mode Gurth. but when i can get crit for 67k from a full pvp gear warlock from chaos bolt i feel like im being more of an annoyance then dps hurting anyone lol
    Completely agree, rets are worst than ever in arena.

    We are pocket healers now, that do some damage. And with dispel being on cooldown it weakens our class even more. So not only did our damage get gimped but our healers can't dispel us in arena because of the added cooldown.

  10. #10
    I'm full Cataclysm and i can only hit around 10k. 15k exorcism. 15k hammer of wrath. TVs on enemy players in mail armor or lower. 27% pvp power

    Those number may look like they suck, and some of them do. But i have 53% mastery, so the hammer of wrath is really around 22-23k and the TV is around 15.3k, because of Hand of Light.

    But mastery will not be near this high in next season gear.

    I hate inquisition for the main reason of it being mandatory to keep up in a pvp situation. It buffs so much of our damage output. And you feel super gimped if it's not up. Especially with hammer of wrath's damage..

  11. #11
    I've noticed the same on my ret pally. However it seems rets dps is more normalized in that ret now does a steady stream of constant dps over time instead of short bursts of dps. Whether its balanced or not we shall see at 90.

    eg.

    1)currently hypothetically speaking over 10 seconds ret might do 100 damage.( 10 damage per second. ) - More time nearopponents = dps spread out over longer time periods.

    2)when it should be over 10 seconds ret should do 100 damage but do 50 damage on the 4th second and 50 damage 6th second or something to that effect - Shorter time near opponents = dps more burst orientated

    Currently with rets moblity been somewhat fixed I can see how we are spending more time in melee range of our opponents and why the first method of dps is what we display currently.

    however I just don't feel rets pvp dps is isnt he right place still, without wings dps is still a bit meh...

    I just prefer playing my holy pally for now who cant die and does near the same dps as my ret ><

  12. #12
    Pit Lord gutnbrg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uncannyllama View Post
    it feels to me dmg is a bit low too especially when im full pvp gear and my TV crits for like 15k and i have the normal mode Gurth. but when i can get crit for 67k from a full pvp gear warlock from chaos bolt i feel like im being more of an annoyance then dps hurting anyone lol
    i got crit for 106k from a warlock chaos bolt yesterday

  13. #13
    Legendary! anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vathius View Post
    I've noticed the same on my ret pally. However it seems rets dps is more normalized in that ret now does a steady stream of constant dps over time instead of short bursts of dps. Whether its balanced or not we shall see at 90.

    eg.

    1)currently hypothetically speaking over 10 seconds ret might do 100 damage.( 10 damage per second. ) - More time nearopponents = dps spread out over longer time periods.

    2)when it should be over 10 seconds ret should do 100 damage but do 50 damage on the 4th second and 50 damage 6th second or something to that effect - Shorter time near opponents = dps more burst orientated

    Currently with rets moblity been somewhat fixed I can see how we are spending more time in melee range of our opponents and why the first method of dps is what we display currently.

    however I just don't feel rets pvp dps is isnt he right place still, without wings dps is still a bit meh...

    I just prefer playing my holy pally for now who cant die and does near the same dps as my ret ><
    What are you talking about? the main thing ret is balanced around is still short bursts of dps. This was true for all of cata and unless we get overhauled on live in MoP it will be true at 90.

  14. #14
    My pvp gear is a mix of the first two season's of the xpac and i'm still hitting for a bit, you may want to check your rotation cause it seems fine to me

  15. #15
    I usualy end up with about 15 kills and 0 deaths in BGs, what seems to be the problem? Just dont run around like a fool, pick your fights, use your CDs and own the BG.

    = Profit

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Nonslid View Post
    I usualy end up with about 15 kills and 0 deaths in BGs, what seems to be the problem? Just dont run around like a fool, pick your fights, use your CDs and own the BG.

    = Profit
    Your advice will sure be relevant when MoP hits and we'll have to look for teammates to play with in arenas...

    Imo our PvP dps has a lot to do with PvE state of things where we aren't shining either. It's all fine and dandy when we stack cd's/trickets and get serious untime on target, but that's probably our major flaw - get cced and you're loosing almost all the preassure. For classes less dependant on cd's getting CCed equals CC uptime on them whille for rets it can be so cruicial that often you're forced to wait next 2 min for killing oportunity. In Cata with proc mechanics we still could RNG someone down outside of cds, but MoP ret dmg is simply too predictable outside of cd. I've nothing against cd's - Unholy dk's are relying on Garg, Wars on Reck but they still put a serious preassure outside of cds. Rogue brings lots CC to the table so they can relieve preassure from their team between burst cd (not to mention it's only 1 min cd and can be poped along with magic immunity to avoid being countered).

    Melee PvP spec most comparable to ret now is unholy dk (might sound strange, but....) - both have little to no cc, both have big cds, both have range magic dmg. Ret brings more utility then DK hands down but our self defences are worse and unless you're able to put preassure on other team you'll be forced out of your utility cds real fast and proceed to loose. But main point of comparing Ret to DK is not figuring our who's better or worse (different classes are different), but comparing the way two specs do dmg. DKs dmg are spread out between Dk himself, Garg, Pet so in a situation DK going for burst even getting cced (AMS and Lichborne to counter but whatever) garg and pet are still assisting his teammate providing significant dmg.

    For ret dmg distribution is much worse - we're doing it on our own, are much more dependant on cds to force preassure then dks and have less cc then rogues and wars (now), don't have cc breakers. I really don't know what should be done to cure our problems, but switching some dmg from cds to abilities sounds reasonable as well as buffing dmg overall (since we aren't exactly raping ppls). Atm ret's pvp spot looks like it will be the same as in cata - once in 2 min burst and backpedal through offheals/cds till next set of cds.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyaldee View Post
    Your advice will sure be relevant when MoP hits and we'll have to look for teammates to play with in arenas...

    Imo our PvP dps has a lot to do with PvE state of things where we aren't shining either. It's all fine and dandy when we stack cd's/trickets and get serious untime on target, but that's probably our major flaw - get cced and you're loosing almost all the preassure. For classes less dependant on cd's getting CCed equals CC uptime on them whille for rets it can be so cruicial that often you're forced to wait next 2 min for killing oportunity. In Cata with proc mechanics we still could RNG someone down outside of cds, but MoP ret dmg is simply too predictable outside of cd. I've nothing against cd's - Unholy dk's are relying on Garg, Wars on Reck but they still put a serious preassure outside of cds. Rogue brings lots CC to the table so they can relieve preassure from their team between burst cd (not to mention it's only 1 min cd and can be poped along with magic immunity to avoid being countered).

    Melee PvP spec most comparable to ret now is unholy dk (might sound strange, but....) - both have little to no cc, both have big cds, both have range magic dmg. Ret brings more utility then DK hands down but our self defences are worse and unless you're able to put preassure on other team you'll be forced out of your utility cds real fast and proceed to loose. But main point of comparing Ret to DK is not figuring our who's better or worse (different classes are different), but comparing the way two specs do dmg. DKs dmg are spread out between Dk himself, Garg, Pet so in a situation DK going for burst even getting cced (AMS and Lichborne to counter but whatever) garg and pet are still assisting his teammate providing significant dmg.

    For ret dmg distribution is much worse - we're doing it on our own, are much more dependant on cds to force preassure then dks and have less cc then rogues and wars (now), don't have cc breakers. I really don't know what should be done to cure our problems, but switching some dmg from cds to abilities sounds reasonable as well as buffing dmg overall (since we aren't exactly raping ppls). Atm ret's pvp spot looks like it will be the same as in cata - once in 2 min burst and backpedal through offheals/cds till next set of cds.
    Well, I havn't tried MoP PvP. And as it isnt out I was sure we was talking about live. And as I hate arenas - they aren't realy fun imo.
    You do have a point about the CDs, when we got all spells on CD we're hitting like a wet noodle.. But that's pretty much how we are :P

    I'm gonna try do some arena again in MoP, hope we'll get fixed Or else I'll quit that shit after 5 matches as always..

  18. #18
    Damage is all right, considering we can pump out twice as much TV's now, don't really have any trouble killing anything beside a resto shaman currently.
    How your exo is only hitting for 4-5k is just beyond me, it's usually my #1 ability and HoW damage is pretty decent as well.
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  19. #19
    Maybe my reforges are off...

    What is everyone using ?

  20. #20
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