1. #801
    Brewmaster Methusula's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    1,307
    Quote Originally Posted by Soulstrike View Post
    zzz i have to switch main to priest for now (healing) since my guild needs healer atm T.T will be back to mage for gear later on though!!

    just as when i switch to priest Heroic horridon wand drops lei shen off hand drops vanq tier dropping everywhere >_> i hate this game
    I feel you man. I am not even raiding right now. I'm starting to itch like I need crack or something.

  2. #802
    4p bonus seems pretty strong for arcane.
    www . worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-54iab3zty0adp6bb/

  3. #803
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,019
    It really is, I agree. Unfortunately the stats on them are mostly horrible for Arcane (the Chest is very BiS though) and I can't get my hands on any tokens.

  4. #804
    Ratok,
    your results are impressive. Can you share some tips for the different movement heavy fights? (Durumu, Tortos, etc). I see you use icy flows, but thats only 2 casts in every 45 seconds

  5. #805
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,019
    Believe it or not, but the guide has been updated

    Changelog 4.4.2013.:

    - section 1.3 - 5.2 Note added
    - section 2 - Core Abilities - changed to reflect the 5.2 changes
    - section 3 - Gameplay - adjusted to reflect the 5.2 changes
    - any mention of 6-Charge camping has been removed
    - section 4 - Talents - changed to reflect the Scorch/Blazing Speed/Flameglow talents and many tips have been reworked
    - section 5 - CD Usage - changed Fire Blast
    - section 6 - Glyphs - removed any mention of Glyph of Fire Blast and fixed a few notes for others

    - previous hotfixes - removed any mention of haste-oriented builds some time ago

    - incoming changes which are ready in my notebook, I just have to type them:
    - a summary of the keypoints for players who don't need to read the whole guide
    - a detailed "Tips and Tricks for Arcane Mages in Throne of Thunder" section based on my experiences from killing all of the bosses on Normal. As I said, this is already written, just need to type it.

    _____

    Added an Arcane guide to Throne of Thunder into the guide. Feel free to discuss:

    10. Guide for Arcane in Throne of Thunder

    This section will cover tips and tricks for Arcane on every boss fight in Throne of Thunder that I've experienced. This is some general stuff and some stuff that I do, but other players might not. All fights are done with Rune of Power, no exceptions and I assume you know about the fights, it's not meant to be a boss strategy guide. Some of the things I write might be doable only in 25-man so be careful if you play 10-man.

    1. Jin'Rokh the Breaker
    - normal - nothing special, your DPS depends primarily on not getting targeted by Focused Lightning
    - heroic - dealing with Ionization - Ion 1 - Ice Block and instantly Cold Snap; Ion 2 - Ice Block; Ion 3 - Cold Snap and Ice Block (*credit for this goes to Windry)

    2. Horridon
    - cast Nether Tempest on everything while maintaining a single target rotation on the boss and switching to Barrage-cleave the adds
    - use Glyph of Remove Curse for the Amani tribe, it will give you a nice dps boost when you decurse
    - help with interrupts between casts
    - learn how your tank positions the boss so you can position yourself with Rune properly

    3. Council of Elders
    - cast Nether Tempest on all 4 bosses except at start when you're burning (or should be) Sul
    - stand somewhere around the middle so Kazra'Jin is also in your range most of the time
    - don't move just because Kazra'Jin occasionally bumps into you
    - 4-Charge Barrage the sand adds

    4. Tortos
    - stand in the Rune somewhere and attack, don't move for silly reasons - the little turtles will catch you everywhere
    - use Nether Tempest on all three little turtles, nuke one of the turtles who is a primary target, nuke the boss
    - use Greater Invisibility and Ice Block to soak Rockfall so you don't have to move
    - cheat: Barrage-cleave the Bats

    5. Megaera
    - another fight in which our dps primarily depends on not being targeted by random stuff
    - use Blazing speed to quickly kite the fire away or the frost through the fire or whatever

    6. Ji-Kun
    - try not to be on the first 'going down' platform so you can blow your cooldowns on the boss with Time Warp and trinkets - I'm always on the first one here so meh
    - use Greater Invisibility, Healthstones, Ice Barrier or Temporal Shield and Ice Block so you don't have to stack on Quills
    - don't fly for the buff unless you're sure you'll get it

    7. Durumu
    - if your raid leader doesn't put you in the blue beam, go find a new raid leader
    - Maze - Glyph of Arcane Explosion - use Nether Tempest, Arcane Explosion, Barrage and Fire Blast while running around, cast Missiles when you have procs and when you can spend two seconds standing, clear with Barrage if it's about to fall off or you're at 4 Charges
    - immunity spells don't work against the main eye during the maze

    8. Primordius
    - start in your Rune, but don't really bother with camping in it until you get transformed
    - spam Nether Tempest on some adds at start, single target the ones you'll use for buffs
    - find a remote spot with Rune so you don't get debuffs during burn phases and don't bother with AoE damage - other classes can do that far more efficiently

    9. Dark Animus
    - after your add is taken by the tank, find a spot in the middle so you don't get teleport around (and out of your Rune)
    - put Nether Tempest on the tank priority targets
    - cheat: put Nether Tempest on the Massive Anima Golems and laugh at damage meters. Keep it up even during the boss burn

    10. Iron Qon
    - fire phase - beg for your group to stack on your Rune
    - lightning phase - Blink + Blazing Speed to safety in only two seconds
    - frost phase - don't ever bother with repositioning during his half-immunity phases

    11. Twin Consorts
    - stand on the forward edge of your Rune when facing Lu'lin so when you get hit by her Barrage it knocks you back, but you stay in the Rune
    - use Nether Tempest and Barrage cleave if possible when Suen briefly appears during the Lunar phase
    - use Greater Invisibility to soak Tidal Waves

    12. Lei Shen
    - Greater Invisibility and Blazing speed are mandatory
    - use Greater Invisibility to soak Thunderstruck and Static Shock
    - don't bother stacking for Ball Lightning - dump a Flamestrike on the group and Barrage cleave from your Rune while maintaining single target damage on the boss
    - SPECIAL CARE - using Alter Time while the boss isn't connected to a pillar makes you keep the debuff if he reconnects before it expires which results in you being very dead after several seconds because the debuff will keep ticking on you even though it should have gone away
    - if you suffer from insane FPS spikes when the fight is starting, reboot your PC before you pull for the first time, do a /reload before every pull and zoom in deep into your character for the first 20 seconds of the fight (until the first Thunderstruck because you have to know where it is) - since MoP launch I've had issues with MoP zones and raids overloading my working memory, I usually can't spend more than a few hours in Pandaria without the game crashing. So, if you have this problem on Lei Shen (and from what I've been reading many people have it), the above solution is working for me.

  6. #806
    Thanks Shang

  7. #807
    Hey Shang,

    If info exists on this, could you point me in the right direction? Otherwise, would you mind elaborating on this point a bit?

    Rune of Power is currently the only competitive option for Arcane with Incanter's Ward being possible on some fights, but not really needed.
    I get that Rune of Power is a constant mana regeneration buff, and that helps us keep a more consistent damage output because of our Mastery. I'm just curious about why Invocation is dismissed as not viable.

    Is the faster mana draining really so detrimental to our dps? I'm no math whiz, but the way I am seeing it right now...

    Rune of Power:
    - Better regen, slower mana loss
    - Punishing for movement
    - Better option for more aggressive playstyle, expecting to take some damage

    Invocation:
    - Less regen, faster mana loss
    - Allows for movement
    - Better for avoiding shit to help healers out, but will cost some DPS

    What I'm also wondering is if prioritizing Haste with Invocation could be feasible, as it would help our mana regen a bit and reduce the cast time of Evocation, ergo, reducing our DPS downtime.

    Any additional info you could provide would be great man. I reeeeheeeeally effing hate Rune of Power, but if I'm screwing my raid out of a ton of DPS by not taking it, I want to know if I should just suck it up and learn to use it and say goodbye to Invocation.

    Thanks for all your work on this guide!
    Last edited by Skygoneblue; 2013-04-08 at 02:41 PM.

  8. #808
    if you dont like using ROP i suggest using IW, IW is actually really good on some fights (tortos and lei shen)

    think there was a post about "WHY invocation is bad"
    Last edited by Soulstrike; 2013-04-09 at 07:31 AM.
    http://oce.op.gg/summoner/userName=soulstrikes in oceanic now Lol

    5172-1206-0622 pokemon FC Lets Battle!!

  9. #809
    Field Marshal Leelloo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    71
    Thanks for the guide! it was a nice read, it shall come in handy!

  10. #810
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,019
    Rune of Power requires a different mindset and skillset compared to Incanter's Ward. They are both competitive, Ward just depends on the predictability of the encounter. Rune requires you to maximize standing in one spet which is doable on everything except a few choice mechanics. Ward requires you to anticipate boss abilities and take damage.

    Ward also requires some more understanding:
    - if you never use the active you lose damage
    - if you use the active but then have to move you also lose damage

    Everyone keeps moaning how Rune limits mobility, but hello, we can't dps while moving anyway, the only thing is one extra cast to place the rune when you find a spot.
    ____

    As for the Invocation thing, I can't give you a more detailed answer than simply: based on everyone's testing it just does less damage because of Mastery. That's the whole explanation. Sure you can use it, but you can't reach the level of Ward which in turn isn't likely to reach the level of Rune except in certain conditions.

  11. #811
    Tried Arcane today after getting this my 4th t15.

    Pretty stronk, here is the result: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jpd2u4p703oyxt43/

  12. #812
    Quote Originally Posted by mishh View Post
    Tried Arcane today after getting this my 4th t15.

    Pretty stronk, here is the result: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jpd2u4p703oyxt43/
    interesting how you played invocation arcane ?_?

    whats your rotation like?? is it AB until you reach 4stack then reset mana with invocation??

    why do you change between mage/frost armor?? depedning on fight??? to reach NT tick?? or just trying stuff out??

    ahhh too bad my main is priest sooo sad not being able to play arcane T.T (4ever 504 weapon)
    Last edited by Soulstrike; 2013-04-11 at 07:06 AM.
    http://oce.op.gg/summoner/userName=soulstrikes in oceanic now Lol

    5172-1206-0622 pokemon FC Lets Battle!!

  13. #813
    I used Mage armor for fights where I multidot alot. Like Horridon/Council. And Frost Armor on single target fights.

    This is because I am rarley at full mana because of Invocation, but on multidot fights I can invocation to full mana and then spam NT with full Mastery bonus.

    My rotation was pretty much to just spam AB, use AM on 4 Charges, and keep Magebomb up. Depending on procs and if I could cleave I used Arcane Barrage before getting my mana back up with evocation.

    I also tried to apply my NT after an evocation so I would get full Mastery bonus on it.

    EDIT: I should mention that I were fully crit gemmed since I was planning on just staying Arcane for a few fights, but it turned out much better than I thought.

    I reforeged Haste > Mastery or Mastery > Haste depending on the fights though.

    EDIT2: I got a few whispers from players who wanted to see how I played on certain fights in 10m HC as Arcane so I highlighted a few of the boss fights from last raid. http://sv.twitch.tv/or1m/videos

    My gameplay is far from perfect but I hope it can help someone!
    Last edited by Mishh; 2013-04-12 at 02:41 AM.

  14. #814
    Quote Originally Posted by mishh View Post
    I used Mage armor for fights where I multidot alot. Like Horridon/Council. And Frost Armor on single target fights.

    This is because I am rarley at full mana because of Invocation, but on multidot fights I can invocation to full mana and then spam NT with full Mastery bonus.

    My rotation was pretty much to just spam AB, use AM on 4 Charges, and keep Magebomb up. Depending on procs and if I could cleave I used Arcane Barrage before getting my mana back up with evocation.

    I also tried to apply my NT after an evocation so I would get full Mastery bonus on it.

    EDIT: I should mention that I were fully crit gemmed since I was planning on just staying Arcane for a few fights, but it turned out much better than I thought.

    I reforeged Haste > Mastery or Mastery > Haste depending on the fights though.

    EDIT2: I got a few whispers from players who wanted to see how I played on certain fights in 10m HC as Arcane so I highlighted a few of the boss fights from last raid. http://sv.twitch.tv/or1m/videos

    My gameplay is far from perfect but I hope it can help someone!

    Thanks for the post, I've been using your rotation now for a week and have been loving it. Good freedom of movement, very competitive DPS (topping most fights) at 522 ilvl and 4 piece bonus. I've gone full haste gem/reforge which gives me close to 12k haste which is still above the GCD during hero. I'm questioning whether I can be bothered spending the cash to try out a full mastery incanter's ward build but I think the regen will just be too slow with the 4 piece tradeoff. Any thoughts on that? I really hate ROP so if I was going to go mastery I would choose Incanter's for a lot of fights.

    Interestingly I can get over 41% crit self buffed with my gear but have just been pulling far more consistent numbers with arcane than I did with fire.

  15. #815
    Dreadlord Cycobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    In a tree
    Posts
    929
    Quote Originally Posted by Kodaz View Post
    Interestingly I can get over 41% crit self buffed with my gear but have just been pulling far more consistent numbers with arcane than I did with fire.
    While your DPS may well be more consistent, would you mind posting logs/armory?
    I'm interested in going back to Arcane but at the moment I just don't see how it would beat out Fire.

  16. #816
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,019
    On certain fights Arcane beats Fire purely because Nether Tempest benefits from Arcane's Mastery, which in my case is currently 76% increased damage (cca 18500 Mastery with raid buffs). On single target it's a lot harder to beat fire but possible if you're lucky with procs and they are not. However, the difference is currently very small and you should play whatever you like most.

  17. #817
    Dreadlord Cycobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    In a tree
    Posts
    929
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    On certain fights Arcane beats Fire purely because Nether Tempest benefits from Arcane's Mastery, which in my case is currently 76% increased damage (cca 18500 Mastery with raid buffs). On single target it's a lot harder to beat fire but possible if you're lucky with procs and they are not. However, the difference is currently very small and you should play whatever you like most.
    Out of interest what fights can you, in your opinion, consistently beat Zahim on?
    I have a slight problem right now in the sense that I don't really have enough gear to play Arcane properly, but oh well.

  18. #818
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,019
    Horridon, Council and Tortos are mine. Jin'Rokh as well if I don't get the ball crap. But he's been offline for a couple of days and I'm not sure anymore. Our logs are public so feel free to browse http://worldoflogs.com/guilds/1705/

  19. #819
    Dreadlord Cycobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    In a tree
    Posts
    929
    Will have a browse through, it could be that he's playing Fire sub-optimally on those fights but I guess we'll see ^.^

  20. #820
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,019
    Jin'Rokh favors our powerful spells, I had a 1.1M Barrage crit at one point with all cds, procs during the pool. Horridon is just Nether Tempest spam and Barrage cleave on HC (on normal I dot all the adds and cheat on the boss). Council is often too spread for Fire's full potential so NT works wonders. I don't move for Kazra'Jin, ever. Tortos is just an NT spam on all turtles and barrage cleave on bats which isn't my job. Focus on Tortos when she has the debuff.

    My dps on Megaera goes byebye the second I get targeted by any of her abilities. Ji-Kun I'm on the first going down so I lose most of the time warp burst.

    Durumu I start high and then level out on the maze then go high again bla. Primordius is weird and I don't think I ever did it 100% right with my positioning. Dark Animus I'm high on top most of the time.

    Qon is decent, I've never survived the Twins and Lei Shen just makes me nervous coz some of my guildies seem to be relearning the fight every week and RoP is amazing for p1 and p2 and sucks in p3 while IW is weird for p1 and p2 and amazing for p3.

    Did Lei Shen tonight with RoP again so you can check how it looks.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •