Expansion 5 - The Utimate Speculation Thread [INFO & RUMOURS]

[Deleted]

I'm looking at it and it looks like the legion will be big in the next expansion.

You mean you're looking at the Q&A? Do you have a link?

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

You mean you're looking at the Q&A? Do you have a link?

Looking at the Alleria/Turalyon tip.

Looking at the QnA from the MoP launch where Metzen said flatly we'll need Alleria/Turalyon for what's coming next.

Reading Velen's short story where he says the Legion is coming.

Watching Wrathion state the Legion is coming.

Assuming we will not kill Sargeras (Metzen said at the MoP launch he feels Sargeras would be too big and powerful)

Assuming Azshara is stronger than Kil'jaedan.

[Deleted]

Looking at the Alleria/Turalyon tip.

Looking at the QnA from the MoP launch where Metzen said flatly we'll need Alleria/Turalyon for what's coming next.

Reading Velen's short story where he says the Legion is coming.

Watching Wrathion state the Legion is coming.

Assuming we will not kill Sargeras (Metzen said at the MoP launch he feels Sargeras would be too big and powerful)

Assuming Azshara is stronger than Kil'jaedan.

Do you have a link of the Q&A video?

[ReleaseDay]

cant wait for the next expansion o_o

[Deleted]

There will probably never be an Outland and Northrend revamp, at least not in the scale of the Cata 1-60 revamp. It's pretty clear they consider it a mistake, since relatively few people saw all that low level content, and it took a large amount of development time. Personally I loved many of the revamped zones, and there's a lot of cool lore and other stuff there, but ultimately I'm in the minority.

[Synros]

Doomlord Kazzak will return as a world boss as a Herald for the Burning Legion. It's likely he'll have new moves, possibly stuff that does not target lower level characters.

ha. Like the Legion cares what level you are.

[TJ]

While Sargeras is certainly a big number in WoW, the notion, that the franchise would be over, if he was gone, is ridiculous.

Worded incorrectly on my part, the current WoW game I think would be over lorewise, they would have to create completely new lore or cheese it by making a bigger baddie.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Worded incorrectly on my part, the current WoW game I think would be over lorewise, they would have to create completely new lore or cheese it by making a bigger baddie.

Essentially they have to make the Old Gods return and not just be 10,000 year prophecy villains.

[Deleted]

they would have to create completely new lore

I don't see a problem with that.

And every expansion creates new lore.
WotLK used the Lich King and the Scourge as a basis, but still created new stuff like Vrykul and Valkyr.

In any case, there's still enough loose ends they can use.

[TJ]

Essentially they have to make the Old Gods return and not just be 10,000 year prophecy villains.

Well they haven't gone anywhere to return, it's just their full forms have not been seen and their true powers not revealed, similar to Sargeras. One could argue that the Old Gods are bigger baddies than Sargeras I suppose but to me it just feels like he is the big bad of WoW.

---------- Post added 2012-10-07 at 10:37 PM ----------

I don't see a problem with that.

And every expansion creates new lore.
WotLK used the Lich King and the Scourge as a basis, but still created new stuff like Vrykul and Valkyr.

In any case, there's still enough loose ends they can use.

Ye but it still has the original base, i.e. Sargeras and the Old Gods are still there to be taken care of, if they go then who takes the spotlight? New lore/villains do.

[Deleted]

Ye but it still has the original base, i.e. Sargeras and the Old Gods are still there to be taken care of, if they go then who takes the spotlight? New lore/villains do.

Or old ones.
But yeah, that has always been the basic concept. Illidan dies, Arthas is next. Arthas dies, Deathwing is next.

[TJ]

Or old ones.
But yeah, that has always been the basic concept. Illidan dies, Arthas is next. Arthas dies, Deathwing is next.

Aye but they've always existed, people knew they would be villains it's just when, just like Azshara.

[Deleted]

Im guessing next expac wont be a burning legion expansion if they want a new class with it (since it seems they dont want to give a new class two times in a row) therefor i guess its more likely we will see something with Azshara. Poor shame, hoping for a new class since i did not find monk fun at all Is OP stil active in this thread and updating it if new information/rumors are heard of ?

[Deleted]

There will probably never be an Outland and Northrend revamp, at least not in the scale of the Cata 1-60 revamp. It's pretty clear they consider it a mistake, since relatively few people saw all that low level content, and it took a large amount of development time. Personally I loved many of the revamped zones, and there's a lot of cool lore and other stuff there, but ultimately I'm in the minority.

Outland and Northrend together though wouldn't take up nearly as much developing time as it did to revamp all of Azeroth. And really I don't think the revamp itself was a mistake just the implementation. They sadly didn't anticipate the amount of people who'd rather slog through to the max level than enjoy new low level content. But had there been some sort of incentive to go back and look at it, or phased high level versions of the new zones it would have paid off more.

Which is why I think a complete rearangement of the level flow would be good, and not just for sorting out the time discrepancies. Revamped Outland and Northrend could be the new 90-95 zones, meaning lots of incentive to level them, and then completely new zones in the Nether could be 95 stuff, giving players a tonne of content after hitting max level. Level rearangement could go:

Azeroth: 1-70
Cata zones: 70-80
Pandaria: 80-90 (Wouldn't require quite as much retuning.)
Northrend: 90-95
Outland: 90-95
(Both alternate levelling paths to one another.)
Nether: 95

So the revamped zones are given maximum exposure meaning Blizzard won't consider them a waste of time and there's masses to do at max level. It would be nice if Belf, Draenei and DK starting zones to be revamped as well. Also, if perhaps we didn't get a new race or class, but instead some really cool new feature (who knows what.) then there'd be plenty of development time both revamp Outland and Northrend, and to make new content.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Im guessing next expac wont be a burning legion expansion if they want a new class with it (since it seems they dont want to give a new class two times in a row) therefor i guess its more likely we will see something with Azshara. Poor shame, hoping for a new class since i did not find monk fun at all Is OP stil active in this thread and updating it if new information/rumors are heard of ?

It's not that they don't want to do it. It's that they can't.

They had 2 years to make the DK, and it still took a year thereafter to balance it.

They had 4 years to make the Monk and they got it pretty close to balanced.


So it takes at least 3 years to make a new class.

---------- Post added 2012-10-08 at 02:15 PM ----------

Outland and Northrend together though wouldn't take up nearly as much developing time as it did to revamp all of Azeroth. And really I don't think the revamp itself was a mistake just the implementation. They sadly didn't anticipate the amount of people who'd rather slog through to the max level than enjoy new low level content. But had there been some sort of incentive to go back and look at it, or phased high level versions of the new zones it would have paid off more.

Which is why I think a complete rearangement of the level flow would be good, and not just for sorting out the time discrepancies. Revamped Outland and Northrend could be the new 90-95 zones, meaning lots of incentive to level them, and then completely new zones in the Nether could be 95 stuff, giving players a tonne of content after hitting max level. Level rearangement could go:

Azeroth: 1-70
Cata zones: 70-80
Pandaria: 80-90 (Wouldn't require quite as much retuning.)
Northrend: 90-95
Outland: 90-95
(Both alternate levelling paths to one another.)
Nether: 95

So the revamped zones are given maximum exposure meaning Blizzard won't consider them a waste of time and there's masses to do at max level. It would be nice if Belf, Draenei and DK starting zones to be revamped as well. Also, if perhaps we didn't get a new race or class, but instead some really cool new feature (who knows what.) then there'd be plenty of development time both revamp Outland and Northrend, and to make new content.

That is a horrible idea. As you'd instead of just revamping 1 or 2 continents revamp the entire freaking game again.
What part of "even Blizzard hated Cataclysm" don't you get?


Also, WTF is a level 95 continent? This isn't Everquest.

[Talen]

There will probably never be an Outland and Northrend revamp, at least not in the scale of the Cata 1-60 revamp. It's pretty clear they consider it a mistake, since relatively few people saw all that low level content, and it took a large amount of development time. Personally I loved many of the revamped zones, and there's a lot of cool lore and other stuff there, but ultimately I'm in the minority.

IMO, for very good reason.

The revamp - this part of it at any rate - was, IMO a huge mistake.

First - there was issue with the old Vanilla content.
Second - the game had moved on, lessons had been learned, the player base and market had changed.

These argued for changes.

What Blizzard did was a half hearetd incomplete rebuild that had several flaws.

First - the quest structure was poor and overly linear
Second - too much reliance on pop culture references. That kind of things works when its subtle. It grates when its rubbed in your face.
Third - there was and is too much reliance on building upon Vanillas storylines.

Now, don't get me wrong. Changes needed to be made. Remodelling the land was good for example.

But, IMO, Blizzard didn't need to throw out Vanilla.

What it needed to do (IMO) was:

1: Set Level 1 as Year 0. EVERY storyline, every race works from this point on. Don't introduce timeline issues at all.
2: Look at the Level 1-60 quests. See what was good, what was bad, what worked , what didn't.
3: Look at the post-60 quests in TBC, Cata and LK. See if there were any storylines that could be seeded in the old world. The Alliance building up Valgarde for example.
4: Identify areas where phasing could be used.
5: Alter and expand the existing content. Change the quest structure and layout where needed. Remove and alter the quests that didn't work. Finish the quests that could do with finishing. Keep the class quests. Add quests where necessary.
6: And all those new quests that got brought in for cataclysm? Post L80 content.

Even leaving aside what could have been - which will always be better than what we have - Cataclysms quest structure and stories usually weren't great. And while something needed to be done to fix the system and make it more newbie friendly, Blizzard put a lot of work into the system - and that work didn't pay off for the effort involved.

The revamped maps needed to be done. But the quests simply needed to be moved around a bit.

EJL

[Deleted]

It's not that they don't want to do it. It's that they can't.

They had 2 years to make the DK, and it still took a year thereafter to balance it.

They had 4 years to make the Monk and they got it pretty close to balanced.


So it takes at least 3 years to make a new class.

---------- Post added 2012-10-08 at 02:15 PM ----------



That is a horrible idea. As you'd instead of just revamping 1 or 2 continents revamp the entire freaking game again.
What part of "even Blizzard hated Cataclysm" don't you get?


Also, WTF is a level 95 continent? This isn't Everquest.

How exactly would it be revamping the entire game once more? It would be retuning things which would be a fair bit of work, but all the questlines and everything would stay intact. I'm not too hot on the technical aspects of things so if someone could tell me why retuning things would be so impossible would be good. I certainly have a hard time seeing how it could be more work than the Cata revamp.

Sure blizzard didn't like cata, but that was because they spent most of the development time recrafting the old world, and only a small percentage of the player base saw most of it. If the revamped content was actually relevant to those at the max level as I'm suggesting that problem isn't there.

Also not sure what your beef is for having a level 95 continent is. Didn't play everquest so.... But anyway wasn't a major complaint of Cata that there was little to do at max level? Seems to me having an entire continent of 5 or 6 zones would be a good way to remedy that.

So yeah, please explain what the problem is with getting rid of all the time related plot holes, updating outdated content and giving max level players the most content they've ever had.

---------- Post added 2012-10-08 at 08:45 PM ----------

IMO, for very good reason.

The revamp - this part of it at any rate - was, IMO a huge mistake.

First - there was issue with the old Vanilla content.
Second - the game had moved on, lessons had been learned, the player base and market had changed.

These argued for changes.

What Blizzard did was a half hearetd incomplete rebuild that had several flaws.

First - the quest structure was poor and overly linear
Second - too much reliance on pop culture references. That kind of things works when its subtle. It grates when its rubbed in your face.
Third - there was and is too much reliance on building upon Vanillas storylines.

Now, don't get me wrong. Changes needed to be made. Remodelling the land was good for example.

But, IMO, Blizzard didn't need to throw out Vanilla.

What it needed to do (IMO) was:

1: Set Level 1 as Year 0. EVERY storyline, every race works from this point on. Don't introduce timeline issues at all.
2: Look at the Level 1-60 quests. See what was good, what was bad, what worked , what didn't.
3: Look at the post-60 quests in TBC, Cata and LK. See if there were any storylines that could be seeded in the old world. The Alliance building up Valgarde for example.
4: Identify areas where phasing could be used.
5: Alter and expand the existing content. Change the quest structure and layout where needed. Remove and alter the quests that didn't work. Finish the quests that could do with finishing. Keep the class quests. Add quests where necessary.
6: And all those new quests that got brought in for cataclysm? Post L80 content.

Even leaving aside what could have been - which will always be better than what we have - Cataclysms quest structure and stories usually weren't great.

EJL

That would've been pretty good, having the Cataclysm happen through phasing, and giving it all to max level players while also streamlining (but not massively reworking.) the Vanilla stuff. I also feel that Cata could have had a bit more development time with sort of a series of interlude patches that added led up to the cataclysm storylines some raids and stuff to tide us over. It would've meant a long wait between expansions, but providing new content kept coming out the player base would probably be satisfied for the most part.

But anyway that ship has sailed. My dreams for a perfect cataclysm will never be.

[jayishere]

The next expansion will probably have a 10 level jump to 100...95 just seems...lame

[Deleted]

It's not that they don't want to do it. It's that they can't.

They had 2 years to make the DK, and it still took a year thereafter to balance it.

They had 4 years to make the Monk and they got it pretty close to balanced.


So it takes at least 3 years to make a new class.

---------- Post added 2012-10-08 at 02:15 PM ----------

well i for one hope you are wrong, but i think you are right but can always hope I think new classes bring much more life to this game than some new quests, zones imo. So is demon hunter the only "logical" new class coming or anyone else think it could be something we wont see coming?

Edit: also, i dont think it took them 4 years to do the monk, i have a hard time thinking they started designing the monk as soon as they went out with wotlk.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

well i for one hope you are wrong, but i think you are right but can always hope I think new classes bring much more life to this game than some new quests, zones imo. So is demon hunter the only "logical" new class coming or anyone else think it could be something we wont see coming?

Edit: also, i dont think it took them 4 years to do the monk, i have a hard time thinking they started designing the monk as soon as they went out with wotlk.

Yeah I doubt it was precisely 4 years to make the Monk. But I feel it was around 3 years, like how long it took to make/balance the DK. Because unlike the DK where it was clearly still in development during Wrath beta, the Monk came into beta feeling conceptually done but in need of balancing.


Now if people want I can try to logic my way through an entire expansion right here.