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  1. #21
    It would really depend on how you define success.

    It currently holds the number two spot in the North American/European MMO market which is nothing to sneeze at.
    From the return on investment lens of EA, it has to be an abject failure because it came no where near the boxes sold or subscriber retention goals they had.

    The real failure of the game comes from the fact that the game designers did not keep a unified vision for what they wanted the game to be. The game has great parts, but the overall experience is less than the sum of those parts.

  2. #22
    Oh it probably made money and for that is a success but at this point it's obvious that ea only cares about box sales. Warhammer and now SW:TOR have proven that MMO gamers need to just steer clear of anything with an EA tag as their games are not built for longevity.

  3. #23
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    I am sad to say it was a failure. It had so much promise(remeber guild ships?), but what they delivered was pitful....It really made me see WoW in a whole new light...

    In the terms of profit the failed exedingly, so they lost on both counts.
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  4. #24
    i lvl my bh and sith to 50 and half way with my the agent, they are fun playing by my self and the flash points are fun, but at 50 i had nothing to do, maxing out my profession seemed pointless, Ilum was boring and some of the quests didnt always work and i spent hours looking for a group to do a daily heroic and i was a tank, the new lfg is good but that should have been in game from the start or atleast a lfg chan, ya people can say WoW was like it when it first started but they should have learned from WoW's mistakes and had these little things fromt he get go. i will come back when its f2p and do all the class stories but i dont think i would sub again.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by XeroFive89 View Post
    Surely many of you are familiar with the vast amount of negativity this game has received since its release from sources such as the following:

    http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/Paragus1...t-The-Tortanic
    http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertco...or-surrenders/
    http://www.swtor-life.com/editorial/...r-failed/7143/

    Yet because the game failed to meet expectations and failed to retain over a million players, is it a failure? How do we define exactly what a failure is? Partly because I can't post this on the official forums without an active subscription, I'm posting it here (equips flame retardant shield) among other locations. The idea behind the video is exploring whether or not SW:TOR should be considered a failure. Personally, I think it has been a pretty big disappointment; but then again, so was EverQuest II yet it retained a sizable playerbase years after release. I believe SW:TOR failed to meet many expectations, but as long as BioWare are still pumping out content updates for a playerbase which remains relatively stable over a long time period, I can't say it's a failure. Obviously, to achieve a relatively stable population like Rift and EQ2, the game has to be doing something right in order to keep those people pleased. Ultimately, I think it's too early to say with 100% certainty either way. I specifically site Warhammer Online as an example of a failed MMO, yet it took that game awhile to reach its horrid state. Even though BioWare are still pumping out content updates, a couple years down the road, SW:TOR could also be sitting in maintenance mode with only a couple active servers.

    Anyway, check out the video and let me know why you do or do not consider the game a failure.
    It depends on what criteria you set as determining the failure. Did the game make or exceed making the amount of money it was supposed to make through game purchases? Did it manage to retain the subscription number targets in the long-term to meet its financial goals? Did it make more money than it spent to develop the game (ie: Was it profitable to develop the game)? Really, only the producer of the game knows what its goals were and whether or not it met, exceeded or failed to met its goals. If it met or exceeded its bottom-line goals then, I'd say yes it was a success, if it did not then I'd say no.

    This makes me also think of Diablo 3 and how people say it was a failure, but it did sell 6 million copies on the first day so I'm guessing that would be considered a success. Now if they planned to retain a certain amount of players and make a certain amount of money on the AH and failed to do so (just theoretically I have no idea what Blizzards goals were) and that 6 million game purchases did not make up the difference then it would be a failure. Once again, no one would know but the internal staff of the company (an possibly advisors and investors they chose to share those goals with).

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    I am sad to say it was a failure. It had so much promise(remeber guild ships?), but what they delivered was pitful....It really made me see WoW in a whole new light...
    Yeah. And then mist of panderia made me see rift in a whole new light...
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  7. #27
    I am Murloc! Thelxi's Avatar
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    Yes. Hype and high aspirations aside, it just was not a good game. Oh no I didn't!

  8. #28
    The game needs to stabilize it's player base first, something that will be hard to see when/if it does with the free to play transition, the numbers we seen so far has shown a steady decline since launch.

    In a general sense I'd say it failed though, as in more than 50% of the players left the game and it clearly didn't meet EA's expectations, it might still reach a more moderate success though if the player base settles and EA allows it to operate at that level without cutting it's losses and apply maintenance mode.
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  9. #29
    I'm a massive Star Wars fan. I enjoyed SWG (in both versions) enough to play it on and off for a long time.

    SWTOR I played for my free month and that was it. Felt so clunky is the only way I can describe it.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by roflpot View Post
    I'm a massive Star Wars fan. I enjoyed SWG (in both versions) enough to play it on and off for a long time.

    SWTOR I played for my free month and that was it. Felt so clunky is the only way I can describe it.
    I agree, the biggest disappointment for me was the terrible clunky combat, you know something is wrong in a game when instant spells can be interrupted. Seemed to be far better when I re-subbed for a month in 1.2, but still not quite where it should be.

  11. #31
    Dreadlord vazar_da_priest's Avatar
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    with arguably the greatest IP of all time and the LARGEST BUDGET FOR ANY VIDEOGAME EVER.....yes it was a massive failure

  12. #32
    The Patient
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    well the great point of the game was the leveling story. but maybe they should have tried a business model like GW2 from the start on, '' here's a game, enjoy it and in a while we let you pay a sum of money to get more '' because the end game was OK but not as engaging WoW

  13. #33
    It met and surpassed my expectations. On a personal level, it is far from a failure. I see the failure as coming from the expectations of the buyers, developers and players...

  14. #34
    I am Murloc! Xuvial's Avatar
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    Well then nothing is technically a "failure" until the servers get pulled offline permanently.

  15. #35
    Scarab Lord Frozen Death Knight's Avatar
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    It was a huge financial failure, considering what the goals were for the game, as well as creating a huge backlash from its fanbase against Bioware, further ruining the relationship between the consumer and company, while the DA 2, and later on ME 3, controversies were still really fresh in their minds. Those two points were the most significant aspects for Bioware and the game did nothing but add more fuel to an already huge fire. How can it not be considered anything else than a failure?
    Last edited by Frozen Death Knight; 2012-09-28 at 10:58 PM.

  16. #36
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    To me? No, it's not. It could be better but it still entertains me.

  17. #37
    Released too fast. Bare bone minimal stuff. And to top it off there was a monthly fee. No way was it worth it. With how little there was in the game at launch, it should have been free.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by necromus View Post
    Did it manage to retain the subscription number targets in the long-term to meet its financial goals?
    No. http://www.computerandvideogames.com...m-subscribers/

    They said that they need (I assume a constant) "500k subscribers to break even". They no longer have that. Breaking even is never a goal. Also, a moderate return on investment would still be a failure. They spent a lot of time and money developing the game, time and money that could have been spent on another project. Even if they make a modest profit that would still be bad from an investor's point of view. They want large growth, not stagnation.

    Quote Originally Posted by necromus View Post
    Did it make more money than it spent to develop the game (ie: Was it profitable to develop the game)?
    No. http://www.gametrailers.com/side-mis...ly-200-million

    They spent ~$200m developing the game (holy crap!). Currently they have sold ~2.45m in game copies (http://www.vgchartz.com/game/31584/s...-old-republic/). Even if they began with 1.7m (their highest sub count) subs from day one through today (which we know isn't even close to reality) they would have made 9 (months) * 15 ($ / month, max price) * 1,700,000 = 229,500,000. That would cover the development costs by 29.5m, but as we know, the sub number isn't even close to an average of 1.7m over 9 months.

    You then have to factor in continued development, maintenance, and support costs. The only thing I don't have a number for is peripherals (shirts, toys, whatever), but I don't think it matters. I don't see how they could have covered their development costs.

    Quote Originally Posted by necromus View Post
    This makes me also think of Diablo 3 and how people say it was a failure, but it did sell 6 million copies on the first day so I'm guessing that would be considered a success. Now if they planned to retain a certain amount of players and make a certain amount of money on the AH and failed to do so (just theoretically I have no idea what Blizzards goals were) and that 6 million game purchases did not make up the difference then it would be a failure. Once again, no one would know but the internal staff of the company (an possibly advisors and investors they chose to share those goals with).
    D3 sold all of those copies for two reasons:

    1. It was riding on its name, but unfortunately, none of the original developers were still around.
    2. WoW 1 year subs with a free copy of D3.

    D3 makes me sad. It's not the game I wanted, not the game I waited for. Oh well.

  19. #39
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Was SWTOR a failure? No. The game is great and is still populated even with a huge launch this week. Was this self promotion thread a failure? Yes.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Was SWTOR a failure? No. The game is great and is still populated even with a huge launch this week. Was this self promotion thread a failure? Yes.
    I'm not sure how you can say that. It is certainly a failure from a business perspective, and the massive sub losses would seem to indicate that it is also a failure in the eyes of its player base.

    Here, lemme try; Yes, it was a failure. That sentence includes as much reasoning and fact as yours did.

    The OP is asking a valid question here and didn't come off as biased to me. You're post is useless.

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