Is it fair to consider SW:TOR a failure?

[RoninaThorstone]

Simple. Is SW:TOR making a profit?
If yes, the answer is no.
If no, the answer is yes.

No, clearly the question is; is it making more or less than a 2.3784058% profit? If less, than its a failure.

Obviously.

[SirRobin]

That's 365 non QA staff at 50k which I'm still thinking is conservative, 280 QA at lets say 25k to be really conservative and we exceed my example of 400 @ 50k by loads and I doubt those numbers include outsourcing as total number of people working on the game has been quoted at over 800 towards the end.

Well for artists it specifically referenced in and outsourced. I did ponder where all the VO guys were at but that may have been outside of Austin. The details, and cost, could vary a lot depending on what you "count."

[Kelimbror]

Random site of google search suggests that 50k is low balling it for most game developers.

According to Glassdoor a Senior Software Engineer II at Blizzard makes 98-157k, a Cinematic Artist 58-85k, the rest I can't see as I refuse to have FB, I doubt we're talking less than 50k for anyone that has a reasonable education.

Same site, EA Software Engineer avg salary $77,575.

These are people with a specific title. Come on, the three of us talking about this have enough common sense and knowledge to know that at least 75% of the people underneath these branches of titles are peons that don't make anything compared to the ceiling. Not even bringing in to fact that most of the artists and qa are hourly employees making the equivalent of minimum wage in their field.

It's like the difference between building a piece of furniture with your hands and then having someone else spray paint it. The money those two people get is vastly divided.

I did already concede that you might be just fine and close to your initial estimate. I just don't want people throwing numbers out there like video game companies pay employees out the wazoo. Getting a job in that field is mostly reserving yourself to a life of minimal salary to do something you love.

[Redblade]

Well for artists it specifically referenced in and outsourced. I did ponder where all the VO guys were at but that may have been outside of Austin. The details, and cost, could vary a lot depending on what you "count."

Yeah without solid numbers it's all guesswork but I'd say it's fair to assume that any number between 150 and 250 million is plausible, if it's the bottom or top end of that I'd say depends on what you count, if you do an all inclusive factoring any and all costs associated with it 300 is possible but not very likely.

---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 06:05 PM ----------

I did already concede that you might be just fine and close to your initial estimate. I just don't want people throwing numbers out there like video game companies pay employees out the wazoo. Getting a job in that field is mostly reserving yourself to a life of minimal salary to do something you love.

That's fair enough, my point was more that there are guys making that kind of cash and one guy making 75k a year makes up for half a guy assumed to make 50k for this discussion hence why I chose the more conservative 50k average.

[iceberg265]

How you could even begin to argue such a ridiculous statement is beyond me. Rehashing a game and upping the graphics takes less manpower and less time than the constant upkeep and design for an MMO as prevalent as WoW. In fact, bringing in Cost of Revenue only goes to further prove that WoW is a drop in the bucket compared to the CoD franchise.

Its actually kinda the same thing nowadays. Blizzard is just rehashing everything too.

[notorious98]

Yet you provide no evidence that it couldn't have cost that much.

That's ridiculously ignorant. There's no evidence to prove it one way or another. But if you're going to claim it costs a certain amount, the onus is on you to prove it, not on the person saying there's no evidence and not factual. It's no different than atheists vs. theists. The onus isn't on the atheist to prove that God doesn't exist because they aren't making the claim that he does. In fact, based on the evidence they've come upon(namely being they've seen no evidence of one), their thought process that there is no God is more justifiable. The onus of proof lies on the person who makes the claim/accusation. Just like in court and everywhere else.

[RoninaThorstone]

That's ridiculously ignorant. There's no evidence to prove it one way or another. But if you're going to claim it costs a certain amount, the onus is on you to prove it, not on the person saying there's no evidence and not factual. It's no different than atheists vs. theists. The onus isn't on the atheist to prove that God doesn't exist because they aren't making the claim that he does. In fact, based on the evidence they've come upon(namely being they've seen no evidence of one), their thought process that there is no God is more justifiable. The onus of proof lies on the person who makes the claim/accusation. Just like in court and everywhere else.

Spaghetti monster.

[WarpedAcorn]

Is anyone else expecting Dr Evil to come out with the budget numbers at this point, with his pinky up to his mouth stating: One Miillllion Dollars. To which we all stare dumfounded b/c it was so much less money than we expected? It would make me laugh.

Now I want to watch that movie again. Might do that tonight. =X

But yeah, speculation is speculation is speculation. Without solid numbers everyone's guess at the cost value is false. While you can debate whether the game was successful or not, I think we can all agree that they game was not as successful as they had hoped for.

[Redblade]

That's ridiculously ignorant.

As is ignoring multiple posts discussing how much it reasonably could have cost to develop based on the little facts we do have, while the number is highly unlikely to go as high as 300, a number as high as 250 isn't all that unlikely.

But I guess you will keep ignoring intelligent debate on the subject claiming you are right simply because no one can prove any number without EA releasing all financial documents for the past 7 years.

[Arlee]

I just don't even know... I think it's fair to say we have gone WAY off topic and that there isn't much left to discuss on the topic